Super Speed Graphic

[Carterofmars]

Big problem or small problem? What does a bellows replacement cost? Maybe I can replace or repair myself?

I'm sure old-timey photogs like weegee just used a piece of Wrigley's.

Any advice/ recommendations greatly appreciated.

Joe

 

[Donald Qualls]

Those can probably be patched; that's likely the best route if the rest of the bellows looks as good as that photo makes it appear.

I've done this in the past with small patches cut from very thin, black-dyed latigo leather. A flat patch will cover, because the bellows is folded from flat material. You can use contact cement or even rubber cement (in its "contact cement" mode) to adhere the patches; I did that with some on my 1927 Zeiss Ideal in 2004 and they're still stuck and light tight.

Get too many patches on the same corner position and the bellows will become hard to fold, but three should be okay if you can find thin enough leather. Tandy still has brick and mortar stores (Google says more than 100, so there might be one near you), but you may be able to get the information needed to select your leather from their web store if there isn't an actual store in your area.

 

[xya]

I use 3M 235 Black Photo Tape. It's very thin, adheres well and lasts many years. As Donald says, there should not be too many holes...

 

[Carterofmars]

Thanks guys. I'm going to recheck but on initial flashlight test I just see the three, right on the corner.

You ever see that nutty flexall rubber cement commercial? Rubberized rowboat? I actually have the thin flexall pipe tape and that patched a leaky sink for two years.

 

[Carterofmars]

Something like this. Not sure how effective this will be. Tape

 

[Bob S]

Smartest is to replace the bellows. Once you find pinholes you will continue to get mor pinholes. Having shots ruined by a bad bellows will be much more expensive then properly servicing the camera in the first place.

 

[juan]

Member shutterfinger was always good with answers on Graflex cameras. Here’s his last bellows repair post.

Light leaks with a really old camera

Hello everyone! Recently I shot one roll of 120 film on a camera I found at a jumble sale. The camera is the "Zeiss Ikon Nettar 515/2". All the 8 photos have the same light leak. I don't think it is from the bellows because you only can see it within the frame. Here you have some scans...

www.photrio.com

 

[gone]

I'd patch it w/ JB Weld glue (available at Walmart, Ace, etc), it will probably go years before needing the bellows replaced because they look in good shape.

That's a nice camera. I owned one and wish I'd kept it. They were nicer than the usual Graflex cameras, pretty light weight too for a 4x5 camera.

 

[Sirius Glass]

Smartest is to replace the bellows. Once you find pinholes you will continue to get mor pinholes. Having shots ruined by a bad bellows will be much more expensive then properly servicing the camera in the first place.

A bit pessimistic. A few holes can be easily patched and the bellow can last for years of usable service.

 

[Bob S]

A bit pessimistic. A few holes can be easily patched and the bellow can last for years of usable service.

But you don’t know when a hole will occur. That can ruin your shot.
just be smart and replace the bellows.

 

[Sirius Glass]

But you don’t know when a hole will occur. That can ruin your shot.
just be smart and replace the bellows.

Open the back of the camera with the lens closed and take it outside. Any holes will show up. Don't you ever check your equipment? I do regularly for all formats.

 

[BrianShaw]

If you are using the electric solenoid shutter release or the flash connections on the side of the body you might run into challenges with bellows replacement as there are wires for those functions embedded in the bellows. If you can find a genuine replacement you’ll be lucky; I haven’t seen one available in years.

 

[beemermark]

Same thing that used to repair pinholes in shutters - Liquid Electrical Tape. Black, dab it on the hole and let it dry for 24 hours. It stays flexible and won't come off.

 

[ags2mikon]

I had a horseman vhr that had pin holes in some of the corners and used liquid electrical tape to patch it. Just let it dry thoroughly before you close it back up. It worked about a year before more holes showed up. I bought a replacement bellows from evil bay and it has been light tight ever since. On the Super Graphic you have wires for flash sync and solenoid release embedded in the bellows. I don't think the replacements on evil bay have the wiring.

 

[OrientPoint]

Member shutterfinger was always good with answers on Graflex cameras. Here’s his last bellows repair post.

Light leaks with a really old camera

Hello everyone! Recently I shot one roll of 120 film on a camera I found at a jumble sale. The camera is the "Zeiss Ikon Nettar 515/2". All the 8 photos have the same light leak. I don't think it is from the bellows because you only can see it within the frame. Here you have some scans...

www.photrio.com

Shutterfinger's advice has worked really well for me. It may require several coats before all of the holes are filled, but it's cheap, easy and does work. Definitely worth trying before going through the hassle and expense of completely replacing the bellows.

 

[Carterofmars]

Same thing that used to repair pinholes in shutters - Liquid Electrical Tape. Black, dab it on the hole and let it dry for 24 hours. It stays flexible and won't come off.

This looks promising.

 

[Donald Qualls]

Those don't look like "aging material" but rather friction damage -- in which case, if whatever was rubbing on the bellows every time the bed was opened and closed is corrected, and the holes patched, that bellows might well last another fifty years.

FWIW, Flex Seal is not rubber cement or contact cement, it's Something Else. I've had bad experiences with liquid electrical tape, but that may be brand dependent. I'd stick with a thin conventional tape product (NOT electrical tape, it doesn't stay stuck for long) or thin leather for patching those corner rubs.

Shutterfinger's method (black acrylic paint, potentially mixed with white glue) is another tried method and doesn't have the potential to stay tacky like liquid electrical tape did when I tried it, but may not stick well if the bellows have a plastic outer coating.

 

[Sirius Glass]

Those don't look like "aging material" but rather friction damage -- in which case, if whatever was rubbing on the bellows every time the bed was opened and closed is corrected, and the holes patched, that bellows might well last another fifty years.

FWIW, Flex Seal is not rubber cement or contact cement, it's Something Else. I've had bad experiences with liquid electrical tape, but that may be brand dependent. I'd stick with a thin conventional tape product (NOT electrical tape, it doesn't stay stuck for long) or thin leather for patching those corner rubs.

Shutterfinger's method (black acrylic paint, potentially mixed with white glue) is another tried method and doesn't have the potential to stay tacky like liquid electrical tape did when I tried it, but may not stick well if the bellows have a plastic outer coating.

@shutterfinger is the resident expert here and on Graflex.org. He is my go to guy for advice and repairs.

 

[Carterofmars]

Those don't look like "aging material" but rather friction damage -- in which case, if whatever was rubbing on the bellows every time the bed was opened and closed is corrected, and the holes patched, that bellows might well last another fifty years.

FWIW, Flex Seal is not rubber cement or contact cement, it's Something Else. I've had bad experiences with liquid electrical tape, but that may be brand dependent. I'd stick with a thin conventional tape product (NOT electrical tape, it doesn't stay stuck for long) or thin leather for patching those corner rubs.

Shutterfinger's method (black acrylic paint, potentially mixed with white glue) is another tried method and doesn't have the potential to stay tacky like liquid electrical tape did when I tried it, but may not stick well if the bellows have a plastic outer coating.

Thanks Donald.

I'd stick with a thin conventional tape product (NOT electrical tape, it doesn't stay stuck for long): Can you recommend a thin conventional tape?

Or thin leather for patching those corner rubs:
How would you patch with thin leather, using what kind of adhesive? Is there a page with examples of patch work using this method?

TY

 

[Paul Howell]

I used electric tape on the bellows of my ex US Navy WWII Speed, not just the corners, I taped the entire bellows, creaks a bit with I pull it out of the body, not sure how long, maybe 20 years? I don't recall the brand of tape, it is fabric rather than the newer plastic type, not sure if anyone still makes it.

 

[Carterofmars]

I found this compound here:

Bellows Patch material, small bottles, suitable for numerous fixes, $7.50 plus $4.50 shipping in US. Other countries, ask - Use ONLY this compound to patch bellows, never silicone or other adhesives. The bellows patch is not a glue, but a liquid designed to be used by itself; it forms the patch by painting on any leaking inside corners of the bellows. It cannot patch a large hole, for example, but heals pinholes in the corners, the most common bellows leakage. See this page for more about light leaks and Bellows Patch use

Equinox Home Page

 

[Donald Qualls]

Thanks Donald.

I'd stick with a thin conventional tape product (NOT electrical tape, it doesn't stay stuck for long): Can you recommend a thin conventional tape?

Or thin leather for patching those corner rubs:
How would you patch with thin leather, using what kind of adhesive? Is there a page with examples of patch work using this method?

TY

There was a tape product mentioned up thread, which has a track record.

I use 3M 235 Black Photo Tape. It's very thin, adheres well and lasts many years.

I noted in my first post in this thread, I bought the thinnest black-dyed latigo I could find (latigo is the skin side of split leather, tanned soft), cut small round patched (1/2 to 3/4 inch diameter) and applied them with rubber cement by coating both surfaces and letting them dry to "tacky" before joining.

 

[xya]

As I had hundreds of cameras with bellows (with quite some pinholes) for my projects, I have also used "liquid electrical tape". I works very well for very few very small pinholes on the edges, as shown in this post. You have to clean the surroundings of the holes so that the liquid can adhere. There a some precautions: learn to manage the liquid in thin layers. Better three thin layers within 30 minutes than one thick. You have to wait a week or so before using the camera until it's really dry. And do not fold the bellows before a month or 2. The paint can still glue the folds of your bellows together.

If you want to keep the camera, always change the bellows. That's THE solution to go for.

If new bellows are unavailable or your budget is tight for the moment, go for very thin material as adhesive tape (which I mentioned) or very thin leather as Donald mentioned. And always learn to manage the material before attacking your bellows themselves.

Good luck!