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Still debating on my final medium format camera. Need advice.

Analogski

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Hi!

For a while now I'm conflicted about buying my next medium format camera.
I want to buy a camera for portraits and general family photography and allround photography. I need something intuitive and relatively fast to operate.

I'm thinking of a Pentax 67 vs Hasselblad 500C/M (or a Leica, but I love the medium format). My budget is 2000 euro.

I already own a Rolleiflex 3.5F, so no need to advise a TLR.

Thanks in advance for your advice!
 

Sanug

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2000 Euro will be not enough if you like to have the camera in good shape and more than one lens only from Hasselblad or Pentax 67.

I can recommend the Bronica SQ series as an alternative to the Hasselblad. I have the SQ-A with 2 film mags, 2 viewfinders and 4 lenses and paid less than 2000 Euro for everything together.

If a lens or the camera body may fail and will not be repairable, a replacement will be cheaper than a CLA on a Hasselblad or Pentax 67 device.
 

Dan Daniel

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Get a Fuji GW670 (or 690, or 680, your call). Neither the Pentax nor Hasselblad are what I would consider fast moving snapshot cameras, and as Sanug points out you are hitting your budget limits with either one.
 

osullic

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Stop buying gear. Use what you have. You need to recognise that you're just suffering from GAS.

A Rolleiflex is as capable and as fast as any medium format camera - for your use case - save perhaps something with autofocus. Rolleiflex is also lighter and more compact than the other medium format systems you mention. By the sounds of things, the TLR is everything you actually need.

Spend the €2000 on film, processing and scanning.
 
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koraks

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I agree with this.
In fact, for general / allround photography, the TLR would IMO be much more suitable than a big, clunky SLR - if it really needs to be medium format to begin with. Smaller format/35mm or even digital would be far more convenient.
 

Paul Howell

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I would think about a Mamiya Press or Konica Rapid. Both are rangefinders that take interchangeable lens, unsure what they go for in the E.U, here in the U.S for $1700 you can find a Press or Rapid with two lens. The Konica Rapid is a bit faster to handle, it has a rechett film advance that cocks the shutter when push pulled. On the othe hand the rachett is prone to wear. Both use film backs, the Konica is 6X7 while the Press can used either 6X7 or 6X9.

 

RezaLoghme

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Analogski said:
Hi!

For a while now I'm conflicted about buying my next medium format camera.
I want to buy a camera for portraits and general family photography and allround photography. I need something intuitive and relatively fast to operate.
Click to expand...

I agree with Koraks. A Rollei TLR is already a simple and reliable and intuitive MF camera. I have owned both a Rollei TLR and several V series Hasselblads. Its almost the same way of using them.

I know some will roll eyes now...A Leica R4 (or 5 or 7) + Elmarit-R 135/2.8 will give you:

- Ownership of a camera made by a really iconic brand
- A portrait lens designed by one of the few legendary lens designers (Maldler)
- A wide range of bodies and lenses offer, not rare as hens teeth
- Various "auto" exposure modes (with a manual option too)
- Fast focussing with a quick focus throw
- a quite fast-tish 2.8 for a bright viewfinder image
- and a good resale situation if you dont like it

All this for 400-600 EUR for lens and body from a "good" seller (incl. Leica themselves with 12 months warranty) (You are in NL if I remember correctly).

R6 body is 600-700 EUR by now, and some Summilux lenses might be 800-1000 if not more. Then you are operating at the top of the house.


@Paul Howell is a Mamiya Press really "intuitive" and "fast to operate"? Size, the separate shutter cocking and film transport mechanisms...really...
 
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OAPOli

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OP, you had a few suggestions in your previous thread. Like you suggested there, rent one of the P67 or Hasselblad to see for yourself.

I've been looking for a Pentax 67, but then...

Hi all, I’ve been searching for my “final” medium format camera for a while now, and my plan was to buy a well-functioning Pentax 67. I want a camera that’s intuitive and reliable for portrait work, but also capable for occasional landscape and architecture photography. My budget is up to...
www.photrio.com
 

Franklee

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The Fuji rangefinders from the 1990s are excellent and affordable. Some of the 6x4.5 models are auto everything versus larger 6x7 or 6x9 meterless rangefinders (like giant Leicas).

Having owned a Hasselblad 500 system the honest truth is I made better or just as good photos with my Rolleiflex.

My experience with the Pentax 67 was it has a lot of mirror slap so I never shot handheld below 1/250th which was limiting.
 

mshchem

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If you're using a minilab to develop and print your family photos go no larger than 6x7.

If you print (or scan) your own photos Fuji GW690III, like a Leica.

As cool as Pentax 67 is avoid no spare parts.

Personally I would just buy film for the Rollei
 
OP
OP

Analogski

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Thanks Guys!

Maybe it's a form of GAS... But still... I have already tried a Pentax 67 in a shop nearby. Love the SLR feeling. No struggle with focus as I have sometimes with the Rollei. But I'm fairly in love with my 3.5f.

But I find it hard to focus fast with small kids running around. I'll like to get a Hasselblad loupe. Maybe this cam make faster focusing possible due to eliminating the world around me. But I don't know if that will work.
 

RezaLoghme

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How is a Hasselblad WLF different to your Rolleiflex WLF?
Or do you mean "prism"?
 

OAPOli

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A Hasselblad is much slower to focus; the helicoid travel is slow so that the subject never "pops" quickly in focus. In addition, you need to raise the WLF (and loupe) upwards before starting to compose and focus. With the P67, you just raise the camera to your eye and the subject pops nicely in focus via the microprism.

Small kids running around is the hardest thing to focus on reliably. My AF subject-tracking Sony struggles with that.
 

osullic

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You are going to be disappointed. Manual focus medium format cameras are the wrong cameras for the job you are talking about.

I also have a Rolleiflex 3.5F and I love it - but I know the challenge of manual focus and shooting moving subjects - and especially indoors, etc.

If you were going to make the smart decision, you would shoot something with autofocus for small kids running around - and realistically, digital with its higher usable ISOs is the right tool for the job here. Use your Rolleiflex for posed photos and general photography.

If you must buy something, buy something auto and modern that you know will assuage your GAS. (Could you find a Leica Q for €2000? Or maybe a nice fast AF (prime? zoom?) lens for an existing system you own.) Then focus on taking photos, not thinking about your next purchase.
 
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Dan Daniel

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Well, keep spinning around, but the one camera that fits what you want and is truly different than the Rolleiflex is a Fuji GW670. The viewfinder is big, the rangefinder is integrated, you can follow things like moving kids, and it has pretty fast responsive focusing.

Has anyone ever made a lever attachment for a Rolleiflex focus knob? Maybe that's the answer, a faster focus action on the Rolleiflex. A single 1=1/2 inch extension lever for fast follow.
 

Taylor K Nankervis

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My (big) kit comprises of 35mm, medium format and large format.
Any of these formats I can easily use for portraiture, landscape, scenic or on-the-fly, but 35mm is fastest and most ready for unplanned shots. MF will likely require you to have a dioptric correction lens if you have a vision deficit, especially with the Pentax 67; a DCL for certain Nikon cameras works on the P67. The P67 is also slow to focus due to its coarse, dark focusing screen (there is a precise reason for this) — the camera benefits most with lenses of f2.4 to f3.5 — f4+ lenses, with a polariser for example, require the nuanced patience of a Hindu cow.

Medium format...well, one lens won't be enough, and the more lenses you add, the heavier the MF outfit becomes to a point where it is quite niggling and you could well see yourself drifting back to the smaller, more versatile format of 35mm. Suggest you hang around 35mm and perhaps dedicate it to portraiture with a lens like 80mm to 100mm. Your mention that it is difficult to focus with "small kids running around"...that's not the preserve of MF, but tracking-AF in 35mm, and it works very, very well.

I was using 35mm for everything for decades — and printing large from it, before the shift to medium format 25 years back. I thought that would be the end of 35mm, but it was not. And will not be.
 

ntenny

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osullic said:
You are going to be disappointed. Manual focus medium format cameras are the wrong cameras for the job you are talking about.
Click to expand...

I don’t know that I’d agree necessarily. I just looked through some albums from my kid’s fast-moving-little-kid era, and quite a few of the images are from a Rolleiflex or a Mamiya 645. I won’t claim it’s as easy as autofocus and/or digital, but I don’t think writing off medium format for this use case makes sense.

OP sounds like they like the general feeling of an SLR. I looked pretty hard at MF SLRs a number of years ago; I ended up with the Mamiya 645, but they’re not as cheap as they once were, and we seem to want a bigger negative here. For 6x6, I’d look pretty hard at the Bronica SQ family. I’m not sure how far you can go for EUR2000 in building a full Hasselblad kit; those lenses are expensive.

-NT
 

Paul Howell

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In college the 60s we were taught to use a TLR for press work, have you tired to use the sports finder? We would use fast film, F16, zone focus. It worked pretty well, was the standard in the 60s to early 70s when TLR were common in the field. I have not used a Rolli in a very long time, my Yaschia 124 and Ds have the fold down front with the window for the sports finder.
 

osullic

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I guess f/16 only works with flash or under broadcast/sports lighting. Using a Rolleiflex in a domestic home, you are probably going to be working around f/4 at 1/60 with ISO 400 film. You could shoot ISO 3200 film to allow for 1/125 and maybe f/8.
(You can obviously use a smaller aperture outdoors in (good) daylight.)
 
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MARTIE

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A Fuji GA645Zi is a fantastic MF point and shoot camera.
 

brian steinberger

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I have two fast moving kids. I would recommend a newer MF rangefinder. Mamiya 6, Fuji 645, Fuji 670 etc. These might be over your budget however.

For SLR I enjoy my Mamiya 645 1000s with a grip. The manual focus lenses snap into focus rather quickly.
 

osullic

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I don't mean to be so negative but this ever-repeated idea of manual focus lenses just "snapping" into focus is such a myth. If you are really critical about focus, you've simply got to fine-tune back and forth, and that takes time done manually.

Having said that, of course autofocus is not infallible. It needs to be not only fast but also accurate. Autofocus systems don't always realise exactly which part of the scene you want in focus, though modern systems that detect faces and eyes are pretty good.
 

Andrew O'Neill

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I have several MF kits, and love all of them...They all have their uses. I just added a 500CM to my tool box. That's a camera I've wanted for decades.
 
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