I'm just realistic that no one can sustain production without an adequate volume of sales, not even Ilford. Someone talking about their product means more to you than it does to me. Remember last man standing didn't mean much with Fuji.
Some Reassuring News from Ilford!
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Nice post, and good to hear after the last few weeks, and as recent films like TXP and Neopan-400 are discontinued. It should provide upside to the vendors like Ilford that remain in the market.... Theoretically that is. To be honest, how many 400 speed emulsions do we truly need? I know TXP 320 was a different animal being the only remaining 220 B&W film, but there are better films. TMY-II can do all that TXP could... except in 220, and it's better than Neopan-400. That said, the price point of Neopan made it REALLY appealing as it was over a 1/3 less expensive and soon added up. Although I only use limited amounts of Ilford products, they do seem the most customer savvy and accessible vendor out of the big 3. Kodak, and Fuji should take note on that point alone. It could not hurt either K or F to have a presence on APUG like Ilford does instead of remaining distant and detached from their customers. After all, we are part of shaping their future.
my .02 YMMV
A.
my .02 YMMV
A.
Andrew, guess I'm in the minority when it comes to buying film, I buy based on what I like about the product. I don't spend a second of time considering how friendly/unfriendly the PR department is with it's customers.
Even though I'm a transplant, guess I've lived in the Show-Me state long enough to adopt the attitude.
Mike
Even though I'm a transplant, guess I've lived in the Show-Me state long enough to adopt the attitude.
Mike
Andrew what do you mean "better?" Neopan and TMY2 are two entirely different beasts. If you bring up grain you're missing the point entirely.
To back up my posts and just my .02 cents and what part of YMMV dont people understand?? Also to overt a flame war.... My post was about losing two of many peoples favorite films... which is never a good thing. The reference to PR departments was exactly that... Ilford is proactive, Kodak and Fuji is not. We hear news via rumors, and speculation over the various internet forums. Ilford regularly chimes in on APUG on their direction and regular press announcements like this one and they keep us in the know. Basically they see value in us. Fuji and Kodak do not post on here and appear to not have the same committment that I've seen anyway.
As for comments on TMY-II being better than Neopan-400. In my opinion (for what's that worth) TMY-II is WAY better. Grain is not the issue, not sure where I made reference to that. For me...... ME! I stated that TMY-II is superior. By that I meant that it can be many things just by changing dev dilution, agitation, just like many films can. I've had great results from Neopan, and it was my favorite film for years. Cost wise, and performance wise it was a win win. After using TMY-II in comparable ways, I find it superior in the way it handles highlights and handles shadow detail. Neopan is good, but is not great at either. Again, just my opinion for the way I shoot, and I respect that others might differ on that.
As for comments on TMY-II being better than Neopan-400. In my opinion (for what's that worth) TMY-II is WAY better. Grain is not the issue, not sure where I made reference to that. For me...... ME! I stated that TMY-II is superior. By that I meant that it can be many things just by changing dev dilution, agitation, just like many films can. I've had great results from Neopan, and it was my favorite film for years. Cost wise, and performance wise it was a win win. After using TMY-II in comparable ways, I find it superior in the way it handles highlights and handles shadow detail. Neopan is good, but is not great at either. Again, just my opinion for the way I shoot, and I respect that others might differ on that.
love it jon....
Maybe if we didn't all bash Kodak so much they would be on our side and be very proactive and interactive. It is almost as if 1 out of every 15 posts about Kodak is good around here.
You think Kodak might be sulking?
No!
I posted elsewhere that Kodak informed APUG members in advance about Kodachrome and in the last cancellation they published the cancelled items outright for everyone to see.
Fuji has not.
PE
I was joking...
I don't know what other post you are talking about, Ron.
As I said, I was joking - of course Kodak are not sulking. I don't imagine they care much whether a few APUGgers bag them or not.
Ian
As I said, I was joking - of course Kodak are not sulking. I don't imagine they care much whether a few APUGgers bag them or not.
Ian
In the twilight time of film, Kodak or Fuji have probably never even thought of proclaiming themselves the custodians of black and white (and/or analog) photography. They just would not have the balls to do it. THAT is peoples' beef.
I love Kodak and Fuji products. I just wish they would at least TRY to sell them as a viable alternative to digital, and tell us what their intentions are, as Ilford has done constantly! How is it that Ilford is doing well but Kodak and Fuji are not, when they all have excellent products?
No film division of any company is doing "well" in terms of product sales and chemical sales. There have been huge declines in sales across the board.
I might remind you that Kodak is the only company to have directed major R&D towards both color and black and white in the last 5 years or so.
PE
(there was a url link here which no longer exists)
All money that they should be spending on advertising, instead of trying to meddle with something that isn't broken in the current line of films.
I don't want R&D. I want statements of intent regarding analog photography, and I want them to try to push their product down everyone's throats.
Why can Ilford keep their product line unhacked for so long? Why can they come out with statements of intent so often? Why can they have a presence in schools and on APUG (like Simon Galley)? Why cannot Kodak and Fuji?
I agree. The current films are awesome. Scott DiSobato who speaks on Inside Ananlog Photo Radio is the marketing director of film at EK or something like that. That makes no sense to me. I have not seen a film advertizement in years....I think some times people don't even know the films are out there at all....I think a good example is the 320 Tri-X. I didn't really know about it until a couple of months ago....Since most poeple don't see film for sale everywhere, they don't seem to think it is still available......
So are new product launches, and we've had plenty from Ilford via their Kentmere brand, two films, re-formulated papers, also products with.for Partners like Adox (Fotoempex), Bergger, not to forget the Impossible Project in the pipeline with their probable launch in the very near future.
There's too much knocking manufacturers, they aren't to blame for the downturn in trade caused by the switch to digital of almost the entire professional market.
Ilford, Kodak and Fuji all make superb products, and we also have EFKE, Foma and now Fotoimpex (Adox) resurrecting some of the former Agfa B&W papers and films, as well as Forte's Polywarmtone.
Ian
Ian,
I don't think we've seen anything yet from Harman about the supposed new variable contrast Kentona and Bromide papers.
Tom
I don't think we've seen anything yet from Harman about the supposed new variable contrast Kentona and Bromide papers.
Tom
Last year there were comments about a late 2009 introduction for at least some of these papers.
Tom
100%. What I care about is the development of new films and the improvement of their manufacture. Making film profitable in small batch runs must be very difficult.
Kodak does a good job (I think) of communicating via their web pages, their podcasts and appearances on the Analog Photography Podcast. If anyone knows of other film manufacturers that speak on podcasts please let me know as I'd enjoy tuning in. So far I've only found Kodak.
Rob Skeoch
Advertiser
Ken asked a question a few pages back about Kentmere Bromide papers.
Bromide is available however they've added a 10 package minimal order for each size and each grade. So that means a store has to buy 10 boxes of 8x10 100 sheets in grade 2.
Since the stores sell so little of the product they have dropped the line-up. So yes it is available but the stores have chosen not to stock it.
I try and keep each size and grade in stock and have started to order with this new 10 box minimal order. Ten boxes is not so bad for 8x10 25 sheet packages but I'm not sure that I want to stock 10 boxes of 16x20 50 sheets.
One of the reasons I'm willing to keep it in stock is I use it myself, since I like a graded product. If I have to buy 10 boxes to have some in the store I can always use it over the years.
-Rob Skeoch
www.bigcameraworkshops.com
Bromide is available however they've added a 10 package minimal order for each size and each grade. So that means a store has to buy 10 boxes of 8x10 100 sheets in grade 2.
Since the stores sell so little of the product they have dropped the line-up. So yes it is available but the stores have chosen not to stock it.
I try and keep each size and grade in stock and have started to order with this new 10 box minimal order. Ten boxes is not so bad for 8x10 25 sheet packages but I'm not sure that I want to stock 10 boxes of 16x20 50 sheets.
One of the reasons I'm willing to keep it in stock is I use it myself, since I like a graded product. If I have to buy 10 boxes to have some in the store I can always use it over the years.
-Rob Skeoch
www.bigcameraworkshops.com
- Joined
- Oct 26, 2002
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Rob: I might be interested in the Kentmere Bromide paper. Are there some references that might indicate how such paper differs from the Gallerie graded?
Ed M.
Ed M.
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