Solarizing paper negatives?

[Arg6442]

Hi All,

Lately I've been playing around with pseudo (sabbatier) solarization of paper negatives in the darkroom (shoot negative -> re-expose during development) to get a sort-of direct positive with all the crazy and wonderful effects the process creates. I want to try a 'true' solarization now, similar to the work of Chris McCaw, in-camera with a long exposure. I understand the basic principle, an extreme overexposure will actually produce a 'positive' image. I'm trying to wrap my head around some of the physics of this and I need some pointers in terms of the actual process. From my understanding, what's going on is that the density curve becomes a bell curve with overexposure, leading to a decrease in density where exposure is higher (reversing the image). If this is the case -- why does the sun remain/turn black? I understand that often times the paper actually gets burnt, is the 'black sun' just the emulsion scorching and turning black because of that or is it blackness from density? What's the darkroom process like for this 'reversal'? I'm under the impression that the image comes straight out on the paper, like an alt print-out process, but honestly I have no clue. Would I develop-stop-fix as normal? What kind of exposure times should I be starting with (outdoor, daylight)?

Apologies for how little I know about what's going on here, If any of my assumptions or background understanding are wrong, please correct me! Information about this is preciously rare online. I know that I can do the standard, ansel adams black sun solarization with a paper negative and then contact print it, but my intention isn't to just take a bunch of pictures of the sun, I'm moreso interested in the direct reversal that takes place . I want to make unique, positive images in-camera of any subject with this process (though I do have at least one specific black sun image in mind).

Should I be concerned about setting my camera on fire?

Thanks!

 

[removed account4]

no clue how you can get your process to do what you want
but I think Chris McCaw uses POP paper
so it might do different things than regular paper because of its composition
( no POP made anymore regular paper is Developing out paper / DOP )
there are recipes to make your own though ...

and regarding fire. no clue
but I remember a post years ago by Domenico Foschi
( I tried to find it to post a link ) he burned up his camera with the sun
so it is a possibility / something to think about ..
I know I wasn't much help but ...

 

[MattKing]

My understanding is that current materials are resistant to solarization, but I applaud your interest.
The mechanism most likely involves at least some self masking - a quick desensitization due to the initial gross over-exposure, with the surrounding area responding more normally.

 

[Donald Qualls]

My understanding is that current materials are resistant to solarization,

True solarization is the effect seen in the Ansel Adams image "Black Sun" -- where the gross overexposure of the sun in frame resulted in clear film in that spot, as as you say, it's my understanding that most if not all modern materials have a shoulder that doesn't slope back down. This is essentially what direct positive B&W materials did, back in the day -- they used to actually have a precise and very even pre-exposure, to the peak of the shoulder, so that further exposure resulted in less density rather than more. Harman Direct Positive paper apparently uses chemical methods to get the same result, but it's the same result -- and nothing special is required, just expose at approximately EI 6 and develop like a regular print or paper negative. There are (or were a few years ago) a small number of film products with the same characteristic -- direct positive with normal exposure and development. All were quite slow (EI below 10); they were made for duplication with artificial light of arbitrary brightness.

 

[Linues]

Hi All,

Lately I've been playing around with pseudo (sabbatier) solarization of paper negatives in the darkroom (shoot negative -> re-expose during development) to get a sort-of direct positive with all the crazy and wonderful effects the process creates. I want to try a 'true' solarization now, similar to the work of Chris McCaw, in-camera with a long exposure. I understand the basic principle, an extreme overexposure will actually produce a 'positive' image. I'm trying to wrap my head around some of the physics of this and I need some pointers in terms of the actual process. From my understanding, what's going on is that the density curve becomes a bell curve with overexposure, leading to a decrease in density where exposure is higher (reversing the image). If this is the case -- why does the sun remain/turn black? I understand that often times the paper actually gets burnt, is the 'black sun' just the emulsion scorching and turning black because of that or is it blackness from density? What's the darkroom process like for this 'reversal'? I'm under the impression that the image comes straight out on the paper, like an alt print-out process, but honestly I have no clue. Would I develop-stop-fix as normal? What kind of exposure times should I be starting with (outdoor, daylight)?

Apologies for how little I know about what's going on here, If any of my assumptions or background understanding are wrong, please correct me! Information about this is preciously rare online. I know that I can do the standard, ansel adams black sun solarization with a paper negative and then contact print it, but my intention isn't to just take a bunch of pictures of the sun, I'm moreso interested in the direct reversal that takes place . I want to make unique, positive images in-camera of any subject with this process (though I do have at least one specific black sun image in mind).

Should I be concerned about setting my camera on fire?

Thanks!

Any clue about it? I’m interested too?!