So who keeps it super simple?

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knick1959

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I'll also add that I have seen some majorly over-edited digital images. I think you'll know what I mean.. maximum saturation, HDR, hyper post-processing to the point it looks like a 3d rendering or digital painting. Maybe this is what it takes to grab attention these days, but it is definitely not for me or my taste.

I know, I'm coming in a year later. I've been looking for some place to get opinions on this and perhaps I'm here. This is the first post I saw on this topic, so I'll be reading everything I can find.
I'm not a big FB person ... participate in one travel-related forum and rarely venture out to the wider environment. On my last trip (Egypt) I met a couple of people who do use it a bit, so I've been poking around Facebook-proper a bit more. Will likely have to stop!
Some of the images there are so over-edited it's ... disappointing at least on the border of discouraging. Some are plain fake, but I'm talking about Real Place images. One image ... somewhere in the country of Georgia, was over the top. I looked it up elsewhere and couldn't find even a close match showing the colors the FB post had. I asked as a reply there, but as the only negative-ish comment among thousands praising the image, nobody responded. I've had a couple of paid-for digital editing tools around and just started to apply tweaks. Which is again why I'm here, trying to stay in the realm of reality. If I'm in the wrong place here, please point me elsewhere. For now, back to searching and reading.
 

Kino

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Scan it, go to curves, find a good black point, a good white point and if needed, grab the center straight-line portion and tweak it slightly up or down.

That's about it.

After 30 years of motion picture grading, only having light intensity, three levels of gamma (processing) and maybe two print stocks, I don't tend to get crazy...
 

Steven Lee

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@Kino Would love to hear more about your 30 years of motion picture grading, especially how the transition to digital happened over time. Maybe start a new post? I bet I'm not alone.
 

Kino

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@Steven Lee I will look around my computer to see if I can find a paragraph or two I wrote for my former employer when the Eastman House and NYU Film studies groups would visit.

Can't guarantee I saved them, but I will look...
 

multivoiced

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What interesting ideas in this thread! I didn't realize the value of Capture One. At the risk of polluting the thread, I'm trying to figure out if GIMP can handle a simple Instagram-oriented workflow with no compromises. In particular, I'm talking about JPEG color. The assumption here is that the pictures from the camera are good enough to need little or no post-processing.

I hope I'm not hijacking the thread. While I don't yet have enough posts here to get some privileges, I would appreciate some help. If I can find someone, I am also prepared to hire a person who can offer a handful of steps (or sub-steps) that I think might be pretty easy.
  1. Open a JPEG in GIMP
  2. Scale the image down (mainly because Instagram doesn't want too many pixels)
  3. Export it from GIMP
  4. Upload the new file (from the previous step, obviously) to Instagram
The catch here is color compatibility. I believe a color space/profile needs to be maintained from the original file to the final export from GIMP. Perhaps GIMP is also capable of exporting with the appropriate space/profile even if something was "wrong" with the original JPEG color settings. I'm just not yet confident about picking the right options in GIMP or relying on defaults.

Is it better to leave this as a reply to this thread or start a new thread?
 

koraks

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Perhaps GIMP is also capable of exporting with the appropriate space/profile even if something was "wrong" with the original JPEG color settings.

GIMP offers color management alright. The simple 4-step workflow you proposed works well; I do it like that a lot in GIMP.

I believe a color space/profile needs to be maintained from the original file to the final export from GIMP.

No, that's not necessarily best. In a web environment, it makes the most sense to convert the image to sRGB if it isn't in that space already. There are still many web apps and devices that are not color managed, and the default profile they assume is sRGB. If you export as, say, AdobeRGB and the device interprets it as sRGB, the colors will come out all wonky and ugly. So just convert to sRGB when exporting for the web.

Perhaps GIMP is also capable of exporting with the appropriate space/profile even if something was "wrong" with the original JPEG color settings.

GIMP is capable of converting from one profile to another. The only thing 'wrong' I can imagine with an image is if the profile is unknown. In that case, it's usually safe to assume it's sRGB and GIMP is generally set up to interpret sRGB by default in such a case. If the colors look wrong in GIMP, you know the image was probably stored in a different profile and you'll have to try and figure out which one it was. This will depend on where the image came from and any clues you can derive from there. This, however, is a quite rare problem. I wouldn't worry about it in advance.

In your workflow, I'd add a step for sharpening; something like unsharp mask. Downscaling generally leaves a slightly fuzzy-looking image, which can be fixed with an unsharp mask action.

GIMP has a scripting engine that can be used to batch-convert images if you desire, making it quick & easy to do a folder full of files all in one go with only minimal intervention. GIMP's batch processing isn't quite as convenient in use as Photoshop's, but it works alright.
 

multivoiced

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Thanks so much for the detailed reply. Can't express how it feels to get some clarity on this problem.

In your workflow, I'd add a step for sharpening; something like unsharp mask.

For the moment (without having tried it), I am assuming the unsharp mask action occurs after scaling down the image.

The only thing 'wrong' I can imagine with an image is if the profile is unknown.

When I wrote my questions, I was assuming it would be "wrong" to start with a profile such as AdobeRGB. Your comments make it sound like it's no big deal to output a web- and Instagram-optimized file in such a case. Still, my best guess is that given a choice, a digital camera (or film scanner) should output a JPEG with sRGB to eliminate any drawbacks associated with converting later to sRGB. Does that sound right?

If you export as, say, AdobeRGB and the device interprets it as sRGB, the colors will come out all wonky and ugly.

Does "wonky and ugly" usually mean the appearance of desaturation? The look of desaturation has consistently plagued my web-viewed images over two decades, and I've actually never noticed a different problem. But I'm optimistic that a fresh approach and the great tips on this forum will help a lot.
 

koraks

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I am assuming the unsharp mask action occurs after scaling down the image.

Yes, it should; it doesn't happen automatically though.

Does that sound right?

Having your devices output sRGB prevents any fuss with profiles if you intend to output to the web (and it'll be OK for a host of other output channels as well).

Does "wonky and ugly" usually mean the appearance of desaturation?

Shifted colors, and saturation problems, yeah. They could go either way, though, depending on how the gamut of one profile relates to the other. It's certainly possible if you previously had your devices generate aRGB-encoded images and never converted them to sRGB, then this is the cause of the color inconsistencies you ran into when publishing on Insta etc.
 

jeffreyg

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I keep it pretty simple (I think). Mostly scanned negatives from 2 1/4 Ilford Delta 400 at box speed and HP5 4x5. Either of two developers (depending on mood). Scanned with SilverFast Ai studio8. Edited with PS as I would in the darkroom (pretty much). I make a slightly less contrasty image then copy and paste into a new file and add the add contrast curve, copy and paste back to a new layer in the first image and adjust the contrast layer fill to taste. I print on either gloss or matte paper whichever seems to be better.

Some negatives. I enlarge on to Pictorico and print pt/pd

For analog I use one paper and my trusty Aristo variable contrast lamp (until the bulbs go)

My controls are basically: size, contrast, burn and dodge.


 

George Collier

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I scan multiple formats, but these days, mostly 35mm (current system is Leica M's).
I use an Epson V850 with Silverfast (a version that allows saving the scan in a 16bit TIFF), and Photoshop.
I use a 10year old iMac with Adobe CS6, delaying a subscription cloud version and upgrading the OS of the computer for a number of reasons, one of which is that it does everything I want. I've been using Pshop since version 2.5 in the early 90's, but am always learning.

I scan to 16bit TIFF, open in camera raw, assign a set of options including a level sharpening I've determined over time, based on grain appearance. The sharpening controls in Raw are far more discrete than in Pshop. I occasionally assign a very small amount of smart sharpening at the time of printing.

I use masking and adjustment layers for everything (all B&W), leaving the background layer intact. Masking can be at different levels, using quickmask to finesse, often using soft masking (less than 100% to finesse controls) in creating a mask for a curve layer.

This may sound like a lot to some, but almost everything is driven by actions, or at least keyboard commands, and 5 - 10 minutes is probably average time for a file. Most of what I'm doing would be a computer version of burning and dodging, with far greater control than I ever could with my hands in the darkroom.

My objective is to optimize what I think of as the emphasis of the image - what it is (and was) that attracted me to the idea of recording and bringing the image up for sharing with others. More about this on my web site, "Work" page below all the long image links.

To me, this is very streamlined, especially compared to what I did with an enlarger (with split filter printing).
 
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Sirius Glass

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I use an Epson V850 Pro, Light Room and Classic PhotoShop and I keep it as simple as I can because I am just beginning to dabble in digital photography.
 

RezaLoghme

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i have an ancient Macbook and am keeping it simple like hell. Mostly some cropping, but very rarely anything else. There are so many variables...
 

MattKing

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@RezaLoghme ,
Don't forget the other simple requirement.
If you wish to upload photos to Photrio, resizing them first to 1000 pixels on the longest dimension and then saving them as a jpeg with quality 80 makes the Photrio uploader much better behaved!
 

Sirius Glass

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I use an Epson V850 Pro, Light Room and Classic PhotoShop and I keep it as simple as I can because I am just beginning to dabble in digital photography.

i have an ancient Macbook and am keeping it simple like hell. Mostly some cropping, but very rarely anything else. There are so many variables...

I can use LightRoom and Classic PhotoShop on my lap top Dell computer but on Light Room on my Mid 2012 Mac Pro tower because Classic PhotoShop will not talk to a computer that old. I will replace the Mac Pro tower after the first of the year. Generally I have to replace my PC laptops about every five years and Mac towers every twelve to fifteen years. YMMV
 
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Sirius Glass

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Classic PhotoShop will not talk to a computer that old
A couple of questions - what do you mean by PShop Classic? What version, specifically? And which OS are you running on the Mac?

The OS for that Mid 2012 Mac Pro is now incompatible with PhotoShop Classic. I will not use the cloud based version because I will not share my photographs with them.
 

George Collier

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PhotoShop Classic is not specific.
Go to the upper left corner of the display with PShop the active application.
Click on the menu bar - Photoshop>>About Photoshop, it will open a window panel. What does it say?
(I'm in the same boat with you about renting the software).
 

George Mann

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I use Darktable + Irfanview with plugins for editing, and XnView for viewing my photo's.

I have never needed anything more.
 
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Sean

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I've been getting more used to Capture One. A thing I like is getting all the basic settings adjusted and then saving all of them as a "style" that can be applied to future images. Applying a style does not always give the best result for every image, but it often gets you very close.
 

Sirius Glass

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PhotoShop Classic is not specific.
Go to the upper left corner of the display with PShop the active application.
Click on the menu bar - Photoshop>>About Photoshop, it will open a window panel. What does it say?
(I'm in the same boat with you about renting the software).

I disagree. When I signed up to rent LightRoom and PhotoShop Classic I checked and verified that PhotoShop Classic did not use the cloud and would not allow Abode to touch my negatives outside my computer.
 
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