small LED panel recommendation

[etn]

Hey Folks,

Please pardon me in advance for another "what is the best gear to take pics of my cat" thread Or newborn, in this particular case (both he and his mum are fine, thanks) As a nature/landscape photog I'm a total newbie with artificial lighting.

I am thinking of buying one or two small, cheap LED panels to increase lighting in indoor situations. As we are in winter, it's typically dark, the last pics I took were at EV 6-7 with Tri-X 400, which is too slow even on tripod. I would like to either bring it to handholdable speeds or (with tripod) to larger depth of field, e.g. around EV 13 or more if possible.

Goal is not to build a studio (no place for this in our apartment) or buy tons of gear - the simpler/smaller the better.

- Are LED panels OK for this or shall I look into flash? I imagine LED panels are easier to use (no flash sync cord, etc) although the light output is certainly less than flash. Question is, what is sufficient?

- About placement: 1 panel above the camera? (I use a PME45 viewfinder which has a hotshoe, so this would work). 2 panels close to the subject? around 1m on each side to avoid shadows perhaps?

- the spec'd color temperature of most panels I've seen is 5600k: do you confirm whether daylight color films can be used? (Portra 400 or Provia 400X are my films of choice here)

- There are ring panels (or flashes, for that matter) which go around the lens, what are the advantages of that? Those seem to require mounting accessories, not sure I want to go into that... I prefer simple if possible.

- Any specific model you love and recommend?

Thanks!

 

[John Koehrer]

I'm far from an expert with regards to lighting!
With a Yognuo 300 lll at 3' and full power I get an incident reading of 1/30 @ f2.8 + 1/3 ISO 100.
The difficulty using a single light above a subject is there's no modeling to speak of. With a ring light the light id generally used to shoot small object without shadows (jewelry, stamps) even less modeling, No shadows at all.
You've probably seen something like this in some family photos already shot with on camera flash.
Yes 5600k is about daylight(5500k) so there MAY be a VERY slight tendency for the picture to tend to be a tiny bit blue IF you shoot slides. Color print
there are several steps between developing and the print so I doubt you can see it.

With flash(I use Vivitar 283's) I've used two as a set, one aimed at the ceiling or a bounce card and one with the power set lower at the side.
I use the VP-1 power dingus to adjust the power.
The Vivitar 285 has the power adjustment device built in and can use some of the filters Vivitar makes.

 

[spijker]

Looks like you've just become a father. Congratulations!

I have no experience with LED panels. From what I read on the web, they're still not as bright as a flash. And it's probably more annoying for your son so be looking at a continuous very bright LED panel than a very short flash. But LED has the advantage that you can use it for video as well. If you're taking the flash route, I'd suggest to look at Godox flash equipment. The camera-dedicated flash triggers also work on medium format film cameras with a hot shoe (no TTL). There's a large range of battery operated flashes from small/cheap to big/still-affordable and a large choice of modifiers/softboxes. I'm happy with the Xpro trigger and two AD200 flashes. I shot the Children's Christmas party at work yesterday with this (digital though).

Edit: something like this might be a good starting point.

 

[etn]

Hello John, Menno,

thank you for your answers In the meantime I've been researching LED panels a bit more. It looks that flash is indeed the way to go, if only from a power perspective. Medium format lenses are quite slow and film limited to 400 ISO for all practical purposes. I don't do video.

Another advantage of flash with Hasselblad is that the leaf shutter can sync to 1/500th! There's no hot shoe, therefore a cable trigger will be mandatory.

A point I will research is the TTL capability of my Hassy 503CW. I might be limited to older flash systems, though (another generation of cameras!) I think I'd probably prefer the convenience of modern remote triggered systems over TTL, as I have no issue setting up the flash manually. My spot meter doubles as a flash meter!

A friend here uses a pair of Nikon SB-26 (around $80 used) which can trigger to another flash pulse. Cheap small flash on the (cold) shoe of the Hassy and one or two SB-26. Might be another option. Despite those being 25 years old, there's not much risk at this price.

Thanks,
Etienne

 

[138S]

- Any specific model you love and recommend?

Check the CRI of the panel, > 95 should be ideal, 90 can be acceptable.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Color_rendering_index

 

[etn]

something like this might be a good starting point.

Hi Menno, this looks like an interesting system indeed, and quite low-cost!
One point is not clear from the spec or manual of the Xpro: is the 2.5mm sync cord jack on the side an input or an output? from the manual it seems it is an output (i.e. to control other devices), however with the Hasselblad I need to input the sync information which comes from the shutter in the lens. Not sure this will work here.
Thanks,
etn

 

[John Koehrer]

Does it use a standard PC to connect to the camera or the 2.5mm jack? IF it has a HOT accessory shoe, there are inexpensive hot shoe to
PC cable adapters. they go between the shoe on the controller to a PC on the lens. the only thing the adapter does is allows a FLASH to fire
by closing a mechanical switch. If the controller needs an electrical signal from the camera it wouldn't work.

 

[Pieter12]

Continuous light (LED panels, hot lights) don't have the light output of even a moderate speed light or strobe. The downside is you are going to either have to use a long synch chord if you want to position the light(s) away from camera. Options are to use a small, weak strobe to trigger off-camera flash in slave mode or use a radio remote trigger (and receiver, depending on the flash being used). Both options would require a hotshoe or a bracket with a cold shoe and a short synch cord.

 

[spijker]

Etienne, the Xpro's 2.5mm sync port can be set as an input or output through the custom function menu. So all you'll need is a PC to 2.5mm sync cord for which Amazon is your friend. With the Xpro trigger you can control all the Godox flashes remotely; flash power, manual/TTL, on/off etc. Even the small TT350 can be controlled remotely. They all have built-in receivers. I always use my Godox set in manual mode with a flash meter, both with the Canon DSLR and the Mamiya 645AFD3. That way I can move the Xpro trigger between cameras without affecting the flash setup and exposure. Luckily the extra contacts on the hot shoe of the Mamiya do not interfere with the XproC(anon)

Trying things out with your friends flashes would be a good idea. It gives you an idea of how much flash power you'll need. A soft box will absorb at least one stop worth of light, probably similar to bouncing a flash against the ceiling.

 

[etn]

Thanks everyone for your answers!

I ordered (with return policy!) a Xpro with a pair of Godox flashes, let's give that a try. Great thing about it is that I can use it with my Nikon too!

 

[etn]

So I received the Godox set and gave it a try. Looks good so far. Setting everything up in manual mode is simple and straightforward. My lightmeter measures the flash intensity correctly, as confirmed by a few "polaroid" shots done with my digital Nikon. Can't wait to get my rolls processed now.

Here's the Hassy with the Godox transmitter (cheap cell phone pic without any artistic pretension.) The transmitter adds yet another floor to the building but handholding is still manageable. I like the "small" (everything is relative) size of the Hassy with waist level finder, but alas since I passed the mid-forties a prism with magnification has become mandatory - it comes with the benefit of an accessory shoe.

Thanks to all for your advice and Happy Xmas time to all!

 

[M Carter]

I've upgraded most of my video lighting to LED, but it's expensive to get good output - I have Lightstorm panel that was about $700, and sprung another $200 for a big v-mount battery. I've adapted it to fit in a medium or large softbox, and at portrait/interview distances I get about F4 at ISO 400. In most scenarios, LED panels need some sort of bounce or diffusion - they're not that soft unless they're really close, and sometimes you'll get a sense of the individual LED beads without diffusing them.

Where LEDs for still shooting excel is if you like shallow DOF photography and don't want to mess with ND, especially in mixed lighting situations. It can be hard to dial down flash power, esp. shooting film where you're stuck with one ISO (though with shoe mount flash that may not be an issue, I use packs & heads).

And if you ever want to upgrade your strobe setup for reasonable $$, look into monolights. The current models have dimmers, slaves, some have built in radio slaves, and many use common accessory mounts (like the Bowens mount), so you can start exploring softboxes and grids and so on, with lights that mount easily to stands. Getting a controllable light that's not stuck to the camera is a nice upgrade. You can get a decent monolight for well under $200, and there are tons of them used out there.

 

[etn]

Where LEDs for still shooting excel is if you like shallow DOF photography and don't want to mess with ND
[..]
And if you ever want to upgrade your strobe setup for reasonable $$, look into monolights.

Thanks, that's great advice and I'll keep it in mind for future upgrades. Is my understanding correct that monolights are larger in size? When not in use, the flashes are easily stored out of sight - we live in a small apartment in Munich and space is at a premium...

For the time being, I am perfectly happy with the 2-flash setup. I bounce them on ceiling and walls and it creates a nice, soft light. I've had beautiful results with both Portra 400 and Tri-X. Depending on the flash output (generally around 1/8 to 1/2 of rated power) I can shoot at 1/250s at f/5.6 to f/8, which allows to be mobile and maintains a nice balance of "enough DOF" for accurate focusing and "shallow DOF" for artistic effects. I mainly use a 120mm Makro-Planar which is just about perfect for the kind of baby portraits I do.