Simple bulk film ?

[DieHipsterDie]

How many feet of film make up a 36 exposure roll? Math is not my strong point but I figure it out to be roughly 5 feet/roll.

Is bulk loading easy to learn? Can canisters be reused?

 

[Dave Parker]

Do a search about bulk loading, you will find a ton of information about it..We have discussed this on several different occasions.

Dave

 

[Claire Senft]

There are 18 36x rolls in 100 feet. It is easy to do. Does not require a bulk loader if you have a very dark darkroom. Cassettes can be reused.

 

[Mackinaw]

I started bulk-loading 35mm just this spring (I've bulk-loaded a ton of 70mm throughout the years, but that's another story). I have an old Watson 66 B loader and use the plastic screw-on lid type of film cannisters. Once you get the hang of it, loading is a breeze. I especially like the option of loading in odd sizes, like 10 frames, 27 frames, etc., whichever fits your shooting needs the best. I wouldn't hesitate to give it a try.

Jim Bielecki

 

[DieHipsterDie]

Do a search about bulk loading, you will find a ton of information about it..We have discussed this on several different occasions.

Dave

*quietly leaves forum*

 

[Dave Parker]

*quietly leaves forum*

No reason to leave, I did a search using the terms of "bulk loading" and came up with over 3 pages of responces, I was just saying, there is alot of information that has been posted about bulk loading, I have been involved in many of these threads.

Dave

 

[copake_ham]

No reason to leave, I did a search using the terms of "bulk loading" and came up with over 3 pages of responces, I was just saying, there is alot of information that has been posted about bulk loading, I have been involved in many of these threads.

Dave

Nice welcome mat.

The poor b-tard joined this past month (August 2006) and had all of 13 posts to his credit. You joined 2 years before (August 2004) and have 3500+!

Yes, you know much more than he does about site content.

Sure shut him up fast....Hope he doesn't give up on film altogether now and just by a digi!

 

[Michael W]

Nice welcome mat.

The poor b-tard joined this past month (August 2006) and had all of 13 posts to his credit. You joined 2 years before (August 2004) and have 3500+!

Yes, you know much more than he does about site content.

Sure shut him up fast....Hope he doesn't give up on film altogether now and just by a digi!

Oh, come on. The reply was pretty mild & also helpful I thought.
One thing I have learned when joining a forum is to use the search function before starting a new thread with a question. Occasionally people need to be reminded that these existing threads are easy to find & the questions have possibly already been answered. If not, then add the question to the existing thread.

 

[copake_ham]

Oh, come on. The reply was pretty mild & also helpful I thought.
One thing I have learned when joining a forum is to use the search function before starting a new thread with a question. Occasionally people need to be reminded that these existing threads are easy to find & the questions have possibly already been answered. If not, then add the question to the existing thread.

It's easy to be an "expert".

It's a talent to be a "mentor".

 

[Markok765]

I'm bulk loading now, tri-x

 

[ZorkiKat]

How many feet of film make up a 36 exposure roll? Math is not my strong point but I figure it out to be roughly 5 feet/roll.

Is bulk loading easy to learn? Can canisters be reused?

In the old books for 35mm photography where film loading from long rolls were described, the official length of the strip which went into the magazine (cassette, cartridge, etc) was 1,6 metres.

Spooling from bulk rolls is easy. You can do it without a loader, but you'd need a darkroom to do that. Not recommended for those with sweaty hands.
Or you could opt for one of the several loading devices available. The easiest to use is the classic "Lloyds" loader. It's really just a big lighttight box with a chamber for the film cassette. Film passes through a velvet-lipped slit, just like in a 35mm cassette- this feature is often the least desireable since the felt trap can be cause for dust or abrasion on film. Film lengths or frame count is determined by the number of turns made on the loading crank.

Other loaders work slightly differently- with slightly more complex loading, automatic frame counters, and felt-free lip traps.

Cassettes can be reused if you can be used if you can snap their caps open. It used to be that old film cassettes had caps which could be tapped off easily ("snapcaps"), but the cassettes of factory loaded film are crimped (non removeable by normal means- has been largely so in the last 2 decades)
and non-reloadable. It is recommended that reloadables are used no more than 4 times, though careful handling can significantly increase the number of times they can be reused.

Jay

 

[Alex Bishop-Thorpe]

A few odd companies still package their film in reusable cassettes, I use a handful of used Maco film cassettes. I've never heard that you shouldn’t use one catridge more than a certain number of times - I used two cassettes over a year rolling Ilford XP2, would have done 30-odd rolls on two cassettes and I still use them. So I wouldn’t say that's written in stone, but people have different experiences, and it does depend how careful you are, the ends can get looser than you'd expect.
I've also found they do make plastic reusable ones as well, the end screws off, but my lab told me they couldn’t process that type, so I just use them for home black and whites.
All in all it's an amazingly simple process and as long as you have a dark room or a dark bag to load the big roll, you're set - doesnt take long to get a handle on it. And I'd say you get about 30 rolls per 100ft/30.5m, but I'm guessing that at 12 frames per foot + excess - I never counted.

 

[ZorkiKat]

.... I've never heard that you shouldn’t use one catridge more than a certain number of times - ...

Many recommendations tend to be on the conservative side when it comes to how many times a factory snapcap cassette can be used. Found them to be quite accurate, for instance, the Chinese (Lucky) and Japanese (Mitsubishi) snapcaps I've used tend to disintegrate after about 5 or 6 uses. The caps loose their grip and the felt tends to crumble. The plastic ORWO with screw tops I used have rather delicate velvet lips which not only release a lot of lint, but also the whole strip tended to come off after a few cycles.

The number of times a cassette can be used will always depend on the quality of the snapcap cassette used. I've some 30 year old Agfa Isopan cassettes whose tops and felt pads still come strong after years and several reloads.

Nineteen rolls of 36 exposures each (if you load with sufficient allowance for leader and trailer) is a fair yield for a 100foot/30,5 metre roll. Some types of loaders will yield slightly more, some less. 21 is the most I got from Lloyds and A/P loaders. The Watson teardrop loaders give the least, since they require longer 'trailer' at the end.

Jay

 

[fschifano]

How many feet of film make up a 36 exposure roll? Math is not my strong point but I figure it out to be roughly 5 feet/roll.

Is bulk loading easy to learn? Can canisters be reused?

Back to the original question. Give or take 5.5 ft for each 36 exposure roll; it depends the loader and how careful you are about using the minimum amount needed for leaders and trailers. It is easy to learn, in fact there's nothing to it. There's no point in describing the mechanics of the process here. One you have the supplies in hand, what to do will be obvious.

The Lloyds and similar bulk loaders are pure simplicity. I have a couple of these things and they have never scratched my film. I also have a few Alden 74 loaders which are very similar in design to the Watson units. These are minimally more complicated to use. These need a little more trailer that the Lloyds type loaders, but in the end it's almost a wash.

Some cassettes can be reused, but Kodak, Fuji, and Ilford stopped packaging their films in reloadable cassettes long ago. I picked up a load of Lucky Pan films from China a couple of years ago and to my surprise the DX coded cassettes were reusable. If you don't find any around though, just pick some up from Freestyle They seem to have the best prices in the US for them. http://www.freestylephoto.biz/sc_prod.php?cat_id=&pid=1458

 

[Dave Parker]

It's easy to be an "expert".

It's a talent to be a "mentor".

Give me a break George,

I didn't do a darn thing to him, except say use the search feature and you will find a ton of information, christ, you would think I called names and ranted and raved about something...I don't see the corillation between join dates and post numbers having anything to do with using the search feature of the website..

Dave

 

[David Brown]

How many feet of film make up a 36 exposure roll? Math is not my strong point but I figure it out to be roughly 5 feet/roll.

Is bulk loading easy to learn? Can canisters be reused?

Roughly, figure 1.5 inches per frame. For 36 frames, that's 54 inches. Another 12 inches for leader and you're at 5 and a half feet. One advantage to bulk loading, though, is that you're not restricted to a set number of exposures. You can load 12, or 20, or ?...

The store-bought canisters for bulk loading can be used until they start scratching the film. How many times is that? Varies. But that is why there are some very conservative recommendations.

If you have a good, dark room (doesn't have to be a real "darkroom") you can load without a "loader". When I did this, I simply placed some tape at two points on the edge of the (clean!!!!) counter (about 66 inches apart ) and measured out the film in the dark using these two tactile points. Cut the film and roll into the cassette, and you're off. Don't forget to leave a couple inches out for the leader.

Good luck and have fun.

BTW - welcome to APUG!

 

[srs5694]

A couple of additional comments:

First, it is possible to re-use commercial cassettes, even with crimped tops, if you don't pry the tops off to unload them. Instead, unload them (onto your developing reel) via the film slit through which the film travels when it's in the camera. (You'll need to either leave a bit of leader protruding when you rewind the film or use a film leader retriever.) Cut the film at the end, leaving a centimeter or so protruding. You can then tape the bulk film to this film stub and re-use the cassette. Dead Link Removed has some embedded photos at the bottom showing the technique. You can even get cassettes from 1-hour labs to use in this way; most unload their cassettes as I described and are happy to give you their empties. This method of bulk loading has the advantage of being cheap and providing DX coding. (DX coded reusable cassettes are available, but AFAIK only in 100 and 400 speeds.) The drawback is that it involves extra trips through the cassette's felt trap, which increases the risk of scratches; and/or use of cassettes whose pedigree you don't know.

My second point is that it's possible to minimize the amount of fogged film at the end of a roll by attaching the film to the cassette's spool in a changing bag or darkroom. You can then use the bulk loader in the light, if you like, and unload it in darkness again. For the designs, like the Watson, with long exposed stretches between the film door and the place where the cartridge resides, this is the only way to go, IMHO; those long stretches result in two or three useless frames at the end of each roll if used in the light. If you use reusable cassettes, you can end up with no wasted frames due to fogging at the end of the roll in this way. When combined with the reused single-use cassette technique I just mentioned, though, it's hard to attach the film in the dark. Still, if you do the attachment close enough to the bulk loader's light trap, you can limit the fogging to a couple of centimeters. Depending on the semi-chance factors involved in loading the film into the camera, there's about a 50/50 chance of damaging part of the final frame, in my experience.

 

[DieHipsterDie]

No worries. Just meant that I was leaving 'till I figured this place out. I should have searched and remembered that some people lack anything resembling tact.

 

[Dave Parker]

No worries. Just meant that I was leaving 'till I figured this place out. I should have searched and remembered that some people lack anything resembling tact.

Please explain to me what tact is?? in almost 20 years on the net, including owning some very large systems, I have never figured out a way to convey the tact that could be conveyed in a face to face conversation, because no matter what you post, someone is going to take it wrong, you want tact, then talk in person, you want information talk over the net..and get a thicker skin..the net is not condusive to tactful convesations...

Dave

 

[DieHipsterDie]

You're right. My apologies.

 

[Dave Parker]

You're right. My apologies.

By the way, I will add my welcome to APUG, you have found the #1 source for analog/traditional photography information in the world, there is a wealth of information to be found here..

Dave

 

[p krentz]

I agree with Dave. a point I did not see mentioned was when you reload be sure to tape (scotch/masking) about 1/2 to 3/4 in up on the film so that when you get to the end of the roll in your camera you cannot pull it loose from the cassette. Pat

 

[troym]

How many feet of film make up a 36 exposure roll? Math is not my strong point but I figure it out to be roughly 5 feet/roll.

Is bulk loading easy to learn? Can canisters be reused?

There's a decent bulkloading FAQ at Dead Link Removed

The FAQ isn't perfect, but it gives a good overview of the process. The FAQ is geared to users of the Watson's "teardrop" shaped bulk loader.

By the way, I use the AP/Bobinquick type loader, which is available from Adorama (under its own brand, I think) and elsewhere. This loader has two nice features: (1) It fogs a minimal amount of the film "tail" (where the film attaches to the spool), and (2) it has a counter that tells you how many feet of film you have left on your bulk roll.

The second feature allows you to calibrate for yourself about how many feet of film you end up using per roll.

 

[Justin Low]

If you have a camera that will accept it (such as a Leica), the metal feltless cassettes made by the manufacturer should last for many, many rolls.

They last practically forever, and unless damaged, won't scratch your film.

The catch is that they're hard to find, and a little expensive if you do come across them.

 

[Saganich]

Bulk Loading Lessons Learned

I've learned two things about bulk loading:

1 - Cheap reusable cans are not really that reusable. After 2 or three rolls they start scratching the film. I only use them thrice, four times if I'm desperate. The old Kodak snap cap metal cans are pretty good.

2 - Rather then using crappy reuseable cans I get used cans from my local photo store. I clean them out once per month and its free . I just tape my film onto the end of the used leader in the used can, spool it in, expose, and open the can for developing as I would any store bought can. I've never had a problem with this method (knock, knock). The down side is that the supply is dwindling.

Chris