Should I trade in my Fuji GW690III for a Fuji GF670 or Plaubel Makina 670/67?

[manfrominternet]

Hi all,

I need a little bit of help figuring this one out. I originally purchased a new-in-box Fuji GW690III (6x9) fixed-lens rangefinder because I already have a Pentax 67II and Bronica GS-1, both 6x7 SLRs, and wanted a medium format camera that is light and portable, which the Pentax 67II + Bronica GS-1 with all their lenses are definitely not.

A year ago, I decided to purchase the Fuji GW690III rangefinder because, beside being lightweight, the camera has an incredibly sharp 90mm f3.5 fixed lens and the larger 6x9 negative seemed unique for medium format film cameras. However, after using the GW690III for about a year, I've realized that I really don't like the 6x9 (3:2) aspect ratio at all - it's too 'long', and I feel like I'm wasting film. I also don't like the fact that the GW690III doesn't have an internal light meter. The final nail in the coffin is the fact that instead of a Bulb mode for dedicated long exposures, the GW690III has an absurdly designed "T" mode, where the shutter opens via a threaded cable release, BUT said shutter doesn't close unless you advance the film or change the shutter speed, thus moving the camera and obviously ruining the long exposure. Using the GW690III for long exposure/night photography is just too much of a hassle.

Anyway, I'm seriously thinking about selling the Fuji GW690III and using its sale to help fund the purchase of either a used Fuji GF670 (with a fixed 80mm f3.5 EBC lens) or a used Plaubel Makina 670 (with a fixed 80mm f2.8 Nikon lens). Both of these cameras are rangefinders that include internal light meters. I also love the 6x7/4x5 aspect ratio, preferring it above any other, including the 6x4.5, 6x8, and 6x9 common medium film formats. Finally, both these cameras have a dedicated Bulb mode for long exposures, which is vital to my practice.

Do any of you guys have any suggestions of what I should do, or even if I should go ahead and actually sell my Fuji GW690III? I know that the Fuji GF670 and Plaubel Makina 670 are both currently selling for a small fortune on eBay, roughly anywhere between $2600 and $3700; it honestly makes me wonder if either of these cameras are really worth getting, considering the fact that I already have two different 6x7 medium format systems, albeit SLRs. At the end of the day, I really would like a portable 6x7 medium format system with an internal light meter and a bulb mode that actually works, that also isn't completely out of financial reach like the Mamiya 7 has become.

Perhaps some of you have better suggestions on where I can put the roughly $3000 I'd be spending on either the Fuji GF670 and Plaubel Makina 670? Is there another lightweight and portable 6x7 film camera that I'm missing?

Finally, between the Fuji GF670 and Plaubel Makina 670, which one - if any - would you pick and why? (Also, what are the differences between the Plaubel Makina 670 and the Plaubel Makina 67?)

Many thanks for your time and help!

 

[250swb]

Personally I prefer the 4x5 (6x7) aspect ratio more. so I did sell my GW690, and GWS690 and bought a Fuji GW670. The GW670 is much rarer and commands a premium, but not nearly as high as the GF670.

 

[guangong]

I have both the Fuji GF670 (bought very last one new from B&H at very generous clearance discount), and Makina 67. I like both cameras, but, if portability is of utmost importance, the GF folds into a compact self protecting easy to carry package. In this regard, the Makina seems more vulnerable, because the “case” is simply soft leather pouch. A hard case was available but very expensive.
As for shooting, both require steady hands. I would describe the Makina as nose heavy.
Due to big bucks involved, I would buy from a reputable dealer who would permit easy return if you are not satisfied after handling camera, such as Roberts Camera or Igor’s camera. I have had pleasant experiences with both dealers.

 

[EdSawyer]

The Gw670iii is not rare. There were plenty of those made, probably more common than the 690 version. Just lately for some reason people (newbies) have fetishized it and driver the prices up for no real reason.

I would go with the gf670 over the Plaubel, it’s newer and more reliable.

 

[Vaidotas]

Zeiss lenses for hassy so nice, but that pentagonal aperture spoils the game.
Fujifilm so puristic perfect, but Fujinon lenses are just dull.
Mamyia lenses are cool, distinctive.
But choice for rangefnder is quite narrow.
So I carry RB load!

 

[OAPOli]

I agree that the T setting on the GW690 is dumb. But one could make a simple lightweight cap to cover the lens before turning the speed ring. BTW I don't recommend using the film advance to close the shutter, the image will drag a bit on the film.

Regarding the meter, the Plaubel uses a manual meter, which IMO is no better than a handheld one. The Fuji has AE I think.

The prices for the GF670 is not too far from a Mamiya 7. Although the latter will drag you down the rabbit hole of multiple lenses. Plaubel is less expensive I think.

I think the GF670 is better in specs than the Plaubel (6x6 option, AE, compactness, more recent) but have no experience with either. If it was me I'd keep the GW and buy film for 5 yrs with the difference.

PS. I also prefer the 4x5 aspect ratio, I managed to mod my 690 to take 10 6x7 shots.

 

[GregY]

It's odd, because a few years back you could get a Fuji G670 ll/lll for much less than a 6x9. Today's prices $1600 and up are crazy.
The GF670 is a cool camera, but users have had problems with the lens alignment. A friend of mine sent his back to Fuji in NJ twice before he gave up and sold it.
I've had both the Plaubel 67 & 670...the key differences in the 670, accepts 220 film (not much use now), improved film transport, better routing for the meter wires & an improved body skin which is easier to grip.

 

[MattKing]

The Gw670iii is not rare. There were plenty of those made, probably more common than the 690 version. Just lately for some reason people (newbies) have fetishized it and driver the prices up for no real reason.

I would go with the gf670 over the Plaubel, it’s newer and more reliable.

There are a lot more of the 6x9 and 6x8 versions around - because in the Japanese market they were the standard.
The 6x7 versions used to be more common in other markets, like the US, because they were imported to those market to satisfy the different preferences for format in those markets.
But in reference to the total number produced, and the resulting current (mostly from Japan) availability, the 6x7 versions are and were relatively rare.

 

[Maris]

And I ended up with a Fuji GSW680. The 68 format fits efficiently on standard sizes of photographic paper where the 69 format is just too long and usually needs a bit of cropping. I didn't find the T setting for long exposures was a problem. The tiny bump (if any) on the camera when closing the shutter is such a small fraction of the total exposure that it doesn't register on the film.

 

[mshchem]

Crop?

 

[gone]

I had a Fuji GS645s (you might like the 6 x 4.5 format better). But when it's shutter failed, no one was able to locate the parts to repair it. So that's something to think about. It was a fun, small camera w/ a great lens, but if it can't be repaired, if there are no parts for it like mine, that may be a deal killer.

So make sure the larger size Fuji shutters can still be fixed before buying one. If the shutter just needs a cleaning, no problem. But w/ mine, an internal part broke. Fortunately, KEH refunded my money, but that was the old KEH. I've not bought anything from the new KEH, their prices are too high now.

 

[GregY]

Momus, I'd be more concerned about buying a Mamiya 6, 7 or the Fuji GF670 with electronics. I've hammered around the mountains for years with the GW67/8/9 GSW. 6x7 6x8 6x9.... never a problem.... The first one i had a GL690 had taken a 60ft fall and still worked. I had to tape the back. I paid $40. It's now in the Whyte Museum of the Canadian Rockies....I bought it from Bruno Engler.

 

[rcphoto]

I've used two examples each of the 690's and love them and that's why I'm also on the quest for a 670. I agree with other sentiments though, the prices for them are stupid. The auction prices hover in the 700-900 range but the BIN prices are more than double in some cases.

 

[Huss]

If you don't like using the GW690II, sell it. Whether you get another camera or not. It's why I sold mine, I just did not enjoy using it. Gave great negs, but so do other cameras.

As for Plaubel vs GF670? The Plaubel is notorious for having a very fragile film advance mechanism, and the wires failing on the light meter. But as it is a mechanical shutter camera, it does not need the light meter to work.
The Fuji is notorious for battery drain issues - this can be easily checked for though. When the camera is closed, the meter should turn off. If you close the camera but still see meter lights in the VF, it has the battery drain issue. I think this was limited to a batch of them, so if you get one that is ok, it will remain ok.

Personally I'd get the Fuji over the Plaubel. I prefer its feature set and it seems that it would be less likely to suffer from a mechanical fault.

 

[GregY]

The last 67 I bought was $400 when 6x9s were $600. By far my favourite was the 680 iii....I even had a 680 neg holder made for my Beseler 4x5.

 

[DREW WILEY]

I already responded to the same question on a different forum. But there are couple more things I'd like to add. The Fuji GW doesn't need any battery at all - that's a plus. One can always use a handheld meter like me, or get a clip-on meter. So no electronics to worry about or go bad in the cold. I got snowed in by blizzard a few years ago quite a ways back in the mountains. No problem. That has happened to me many times before, and I'm well equipped for it. And it was a beautiful location to be stuck at. But I don't like having to remove batteries from cameras to keep them warm. With my "beater" GW690ii, I could just pop out of the tent anytime without that worry. I did keep the light meter itself in the sleeping bag prior to use. But that strategy is just too clumsy and linty for an MF camera per se.

The second point is that long exposures are no problem; it's the intermediate ones longer than one second but still just a few seconds which are a headache to deal with in the GW series. Yeah, wish they had added a real time function to the shutter; but one can get around that limitation if they have to.

 

[Sirius Glass]

Zeiss lenses for hassy so nice, but that pentagonal aperture spoils the game.
Fujifilm so puristic perfect, but Fujinon lenses are just dull.
Mamyia lenses are cool, distinctive.
But choice for rangefnder is quite narrow.
So I carry RB load!

I have been using Hasselblads for over a decade and the pentagonal aperture has not caused any artifacts nor problems. People have been using the Hasselblad since 1957 without that being a problem. You have an Operator Assisted Failure.

 

[Sirius Glass]

...

A year ago, I decided to purchase the Fuji GW690III rangefinder because, beside being lightweight, the camera has an incredibly sharp 90mm f3.5 fixed lens and the larger 6x9 negative seemed unique for medium format film cameras. However, after using the GW690III for about a year, I've realized that I really don't like the 6x9 (3:2) aspect ratio at all - it's too 'long', and I feel like I'm wasting film. I also don't like the fact that the GW690III doesn't have an internal light meter. The final nail in the coffin is the fact that instead of a Bulb mode for dedicated long exposures, the GW690III has an absurdly designed "T" mode, where the shutter opens via a threaded cable release, BUT said shutter doesn't close unless you advance the film or change the shutter speed, thus moving the camera and obviously ruining the long exposure. Using the GW690III for long exposure/night photography is just too much of a hassle.

...

One needs to fire the shutter a second time to end the T exposure, not advance the film, change the shutter speed or punt it across a goal line.

 

[MattKing]

One needs to fire the shutter a second time to end the T exposure, not advance the film, change the shutter speed

Not on these cameras - it is one of their peculiarities.

 

[Roger Cole]

I'd keep the 6x9 and just crop the prints. Yeah, it wastes some film, but from what people are saying here about the price difference you could buy a lot of film for that, especially considering you're "wasting," what, two frames, 8 versus 10, per roll? So five rolls in the 69 gives you two more frames than four rolls in the 67. I guess it depends on how much you shoot whether that makes sense cost wise.

I thought the T was the regular old version where tripping the release a second time did it. That's good to know, and another reason I probably won't buy any of these. I've toyed with buying a 69 when they come up, but I've just never gotten along with rangefinders in 35mm and doubt I would with a MF one either. That's totally a personal quirk though and I know many people love them. The price of the 67s may or may not come down. Maybe just crop prints and waste a little film in the meantime and see if the prices come back down?

 

[Steven Lee]

I used to be enamored by Fuji GF670 and pulled the trigger a few years ago. The camera was simply too fragile to be practical and nailing critical focus was not easy: the focusing helicoid felt toy-like and imprecise, without a reliable infinity stop. In hand, it felt plasticky and way cheaper than its high (even then) price. Made all the wrong sounds: the shutter was silent but film advance was on a loud/clicky side, basically the least engaging camera to shoot I ever owned. Additionally, the rangefinder kept drifting and needed periodic re-alignment which wasn't nearly as easy to DIY as a Leica, for example.

I sold it and flirted with an idea of switching to Makina, but talked to a few owners who basically said the same thing: too fragile for daily use. I tried to approach a Mamiya 7 but it's too ugly to be in the same room with me, so I abandoned that idea. Recently I acquired a couple of cheap Soviet Moskva and Iskra rangefinders, and they cemented my convinction that if you want light & portable medium format camera, steer clear of folders and get a TLR. The square is the superior format anyway and it's important for any photographer to relaize this before their death.

 

[MattKing]

The 6x8 version is worth it - if only because you can fit all 8 (oops, 9) negatives in a single, normal sized Printfile sheet!
That and because it is the same aspect ratio as 6x4.5, Micro 4/3, and yes - 110!
And I really like how that aspect ratio works for me.

 

[250swb]

The Gw670iii is not rare. There were plenty of those made, probably more common than the 690 version. Just lately for some reason people (newbies) have fetishized it and driver the prices up for no real reason.

I would go with the gf670 over the Plaubel, it’s newer and more reliable.

Here's the thing, at the last count (ten minutes ago) worldwide eBay had 9 (nine) Fuji GW670's on sale, compared with 245 (two hundred and forty five) GW690's. So I guess they are either rare in terms of numbers manufactured, or people are hanging on to them which makes them rare in terms of finding one. But either way it is entirely untrue that they are more common than the GW690.

 

[Ernst-Jan]

The 6x8 version is worth it - if only because you can fit all 8 negatives in a single, normal sized Printfile sheet!
That and because it is the same aspect ratio as 6x4.5, Micro 4/3, and yes - 110!
And I really like how that aspect ratio works for me.

6x8 gives you 9 frames
But I really like the 6x8 too, I have the Fujica GW690 (I) and the Fujifilm GSW680 III, I prefer the aspect ratio of the 6x8.
I find the 3:2 ratio of the 6x9 too wide

 

[guangong]

While I own and use both Fuji GF670 and Makina 67, if a really compact 6x6 no nonsense folder is desired, the best choice is ZI Super Ikonta B. Super accurate and rugged rangefinder system, by far the most fail proof lens erecting system. No plastic! I haven’t had any problems with battery drain with GF. The instruction manual states that the film should be advanced with care. If I want a Camera that is tough and dependable my choice would be a Hasselblad or Rollei TLR, but for casual walking around MF nothing beats a folder.