Should I start developing at home?

[Brownie_Holiday]

I do shoot digital. I shot film 'back in the day' using your standard 35mm SLRs, Pentax, Minolta, etc. Moved to videotape when it became a thing, went back to stills when digital came in, now shoot digital and film. Have multiple DSLRs and SLRs, a Rangefinder, a couple of old P-n-S that have been laying around since forever (anyone have some disc film? ). I use several different processing programs, some open source and some paid. Just shot a roll of Kodak 200 yesterday that will get dropped at the lab tomorrow, and am lucky enough to have a local camera shop that processes. They charge me $10/roll for negatives only, which I then scan with a cheap scanner for viewing. I will get a better scanner eventually, but if a print is needed I can either use one of my DSLRs and convert it or just take the negative in to them and let them do it.

It's not that I can't afford it, I just hate wasting. There's a thread on this forum where a new guy blew 20 rolls of film and couldn't sort out why, most of you posting were in that thread as well. I don't mind screwing up a roll here or there, and don't mind wasting a roll to learn how to spool it on the tank reel. I'll take 24 shots of the same subject if needed just for testing. What I don't want to do is enter into a whirlpool of wasted film, chemical and time. Understand that to me 'wasted' does not = 'learning', wasted = the same failure over and over, learning is failure followed by improvement.

Leader test is ? I saw it mentioned in here, do they explain that in the instructions? How long can you actually store the chemicals? Someone posted that you can mix batches and keep the concentrate unmixed in airtight bottles filled to the brim for quite a while. Does buying powder make more sense and just mixing what you need? Is Unicolor as good as/better than/worse than Cinestill? Who makes the best kit to start with? I have some 750ml PET bottles in dark brown that came with a beer brewing kit, are those good for storage?

 

[RalphLambrecht]

I’m just starting with home developing because I want to keep my costs low. I only shoot like 8-10 rolls each years so not many of them. I read in many websites that c41 chemicals last only a few month so I’m wondering what would be the best route for me. Should I just process all the rolls at once when I have like 15 of them? I don’t love this solution because I would get to see my photos at least one year later. Is there any other way I could do this without wasting chemicals? Developing where I’m from costs at least 7 euros so I guess even developing like 5 rolls with one kit would break even, but I would love to develop rolls as soon as I finish them and spend as less as possible. Any ideas?

the man reason for me to process film at home is the fact that I can do a far better job than any lab. When I got started ,I was too scared to process my own film (thought I would mess it up) but now, I won't trust any body with my film anymore. Don't make cost the issue; go for quality! You can keep cost low and always have fresh processing chemicals by mixing your own from bulk!

 

[pentaxuser]

It is just as well that we have been able to help others in this thread as the OP posted once and hasn't been seen since his day of posting way back in August

pentaxuser

 

[Brownie_Holiday]

the man reason for me to process film at home is the fact that I can do a far better job than any lab. When I got started ,I was too scared to process my own film (thought I would mess it up) but now, I won't trust any body with my film anymore. Don't make cost the issue; go for quality! You can keep cost low and always have fresh processing chemicals by mixing your own from bulk!

I'm on it. Maybe some day I'll be able to say I can do a better job!

It is just as well that we have been able to help others in this thread as the OP posted once and hasn't been seen since his day of posting way back in August

pentaxuser

Yeah, not me...I will keep going until you scream STOP!!!

What do you guys think of this? I like the all in one concept.

COLOR PROCESSING STARTER KIT - Cs41 Kit, °CsC (120V), Developing Tank, – CineStill Film

I noticed that they want $42 for the CineStill kit on Amazon, Cinestill sells it for $25 or so, plus shipping.

Would like to know more about Unicolor. I was shocked to learn I am about 20 miles from their headquarters in Dexter MI. I'll check my local camera shop for these products too.

I really appreciate all of the experience you guys bring to the table.

 

[removed account4]

developing th3 film is only 1/2 the equation, what are you going to do with the chemistry when you are done ?
in Europe ( where the op is from ) rules for dumping chemistry down the drain are quite strict, hopefully brownie_holdiay you will consolidate your photochemistry in containers and bring them to the household hazardous waste disposal day at your local/regional resource recovery center. or become friends with someone who owns a mini. lab and float them some $$ to dispose of your waste chemistry and waste wash water at their place since they are required by law to have a disposal plan in place. from what I understand color chemistry is not as kind to the earth as b/w, and one needs to be treating these chemicals with respect ( and not dump them down the drain ) and be kind to Mother Earth.
==
OP
if you had armloads of film to develop a month &c I'd say sure develop your color film at home ( and see above statements about disposal ). otherwise might as well take the film to a lab and help keep the 1 remaining lab in the 100km radius of your home in business.

YMMV

 

[Steve@f8]

It is just as well that we have been able to help others in this thread as the OP posted once and hasn't been seen since his day of posting way back in August

pentaxuser

Yes, I’ve found it very helpful, thank you all.
One thing i worry about is staining the sink, white enamel, or the bath; the bath is sort of plastic, not exactly plastic but a high grade engineering polymer . And the health issues using chemicals in the kitchen if I don’t use the bathroom.
I would cut my teeth on B&W and try a few developers, eg HC110 and Rodinal or equivalent for stand development. Also what about fixer, is it safe enough to use in the kitchen?

 

[removed account4]

what about fixer, is it safe enough to use in the kitchen

I wouldn't use any photo chemistry anywhere close to where I make or consume food, not even caffenol...

 

[pentaxuser]

. Also what about fixer, is it safe enough to use in the kitchen?

Frankly I'd say: It all depends but yes take all the sensible precautions such as mixing in the sink, washing away any dregs left on the sink and moping up any spillage should there be one with sponges and kitchen roll, the latter being disposed of in the waste bin straight away and I cannot see any problems

pentaxuser

 

[MattKing]

I have developed film in the kitchen for decades.
The cleaning solutions stored under the kitchen sink are of about the same level of concern (if not more) as all standard black and white film developing chemicals.
If you are able to safely use those cleaners in the kitchen, you can safely use darkroom chemicals.

 

[Brownie_Holiday]

...what are you going to do with the chemistry when you are done ? /snip/ hopefully brownie_holdiay you will consolidate your photochemistry in containers and bring them to the household hazardous waste disposal day at your local/regional resource recovery center. or become friends with someone who owns a mini. lab and float them some $$ to dispose of your waste chemistry and waste wash water at their place since they are required by law to have a disposal plan in place. from what I understand color chemistry is not as kind to the earth as b/w, and one needs to be treating these chemicals with respect ( and not dump them down the drain ) and be kind to Mother Earth.

YMMV

Well, there's a river near me. Lots of water in the river...should dilute the chemicals just fine. Guess I'll just dump it in the river.

Remember, the solution to pollution is dilution.

Re: kitchen, I do all kinds of stuff in the kitchen that I probably shouldn't. It or the bathroom may be the only places in my house to do it with enough ventilation. Plastic drop cloths are cheap.

 

[Sirius Glass]

Well see, that's the thing. I learned how to fall off motorcycles when I was 9. I might also point out that a good part of your post appears to be written in Latin, or possibly Romulan.



Maybe it's because I've not yet read a set of instructions.

High Valerian

 

[removed account4]

Well, there's a river near me. Lots of water in the river...should dilute the chemicals just fine. Guess I'll just dump it in the river.

Remember, the solution to pollution is dilution.

Re: kitchen, I do all kinds of stuff in the kitchen that I probably shouldn't. It or the bathroom may be the only places in my house to do it with enough ventilation. Plastic drop cloths are cheap.

its comments like this, dumping chemicals outside &c that gives chemical based photography a bad name. you sound like someone who I met a few years ago who dumps his cyanide fixer in his backyard. not too swift.

 

[Sirius Glass]

Also what about fixer, is it safe enough to use in the kitchen?

I have developed film and toned prints at the kitchen sink for decades. Before I start I remove anything related to food and cooking from the area including sponges and towels. I have separate sponges and towels for photography which I use to thoroughly scrub down the sink and counters. I use Bar Keepers' Friend. After I am finished with the photography, I again scrub down with the photography sponges and towel and then with the household sponges and towels.

So far the chemicals, which for the most part are not that dangerous, have not gotten me poisoned nor sick. They have not killed me either, as far as I can tell.

 

[grat]

I wouldn't use any photo chemistry anywhere close to where I make or consume food, not even caffenol...

Well, that's one way to make sure you won't contaminate your developer.

 

[Brownie_Holiday]

its comments like this, dumping chemicals outside &c that gives chemical based photography a bad name. you sound like someone who I met a few years ago who dumps his cyanide fixer in his backyard. not too swift.

Surely you can't be so uptight or humorless as to believe I'm serious? If it makes you feel any better, I spent over decade administering my town's sold waste program, including recycling and hazardous waste collections. I am trained as a HAZMAT first responder, and have HAZWOPER administration and incident command. I also carry stormwater collection certification and was formerly licensed in my state for water and wastewater processing. Shall I continue?

Take a breath dude, it'll be ok. I promise not to dump my chemicals in the river.

 

[MattKing]

Surely you can't be so uptight or humorless as to believe I'm serious? If it makes you feel any better, I spent over decade administering my town's sold waste program, including recycling and hazardous waste collections. I am trained as a HAZMAT first responder, and have HAZWOPER administration and incident command. I also carry stormwater collection certification and was formerly licensed in my state for water and wastewater processing. Shall I continue?

Take a breath dude, it'll be ok. I promise not to dump my chemicals in the river.

As you are probably aware, ironic intentions don't always get noticed in internet fora. I myself thought you were trying to be funny, but I wasn't totally sure!
John (jnantz) is particularly attuned to the environmental issues surrounding photographic processes - out of that concern he actually started a business selling a silver recovery unit for small darkrooms - so once he missed that you were trying for humour, he not unreasonably was concerned about your post.
Questions about disposal do come up here from time to time. Hopefully you can assist by bringing your experience to the issue.

 

[DeletedAcct1]

I’m just starting with home developing because I want to keep my costs low. I only shoot like 8-10 rolls each years so not many of them. I read in many websites that c41 chemicals last only a few month so I’m wondering what would be the best route for me. Should I just process all the rolls at once when I have like 15 of them? I don’t love this solution because I would get to see my photos at least one year later. Is there any other way I could do this without wasting chemicals? Developing where I’m from costs at least 7 euros so I guess even developing like 5 rolls with one kit would break even, but I would love to develop rolls as soon as I finish them and spend as less as possible. Any ideas?

Ti rispondo in italiano.
Penso che non convenga mai svilupparsi il colore a casa, è molto molto difficile evitare dominanti di colore fastidiose. Inoltre se scatti poco ti ritroverai con una gestione difficoltosa della chimica, che non dura poi tanto.
Oltre al fatto che ci sono ancora validi laboratori italiani che operano, uno di questi è http://magnanellianalogic.com/
http://magnanellianalogic.com/laboratorio.html
Hanno dei processori dip&dunk della Tecnolab, i migliori, per il trattamento delle pellicole, il che significa che non avrai graffi sull'emulsione.
Con il costo della chimica che sta salendo secondo me ti conviene mandarli li i tuoi rullini.
Spero di esser stato d'aiuto.
Ciao.

 

[removed account4]

Surely you can't be so uptight or humorless as to believe I'm serious? If it makes you feel any better, I spent over decade administering my town's sold waste program, including recycling and hazardous waste collections. I am trained as a HAZMAT first responder, and have HAZWOPER administration and incident command. I also carry stormwater collection certification and was formerly licensed in my state for water and wastewater processing. Shall I continue?

Take a breath dude, it'll be ok. I promise not to dump my chemicals in the river.

nah im not humorless but have seen and read some outrageous stuff regarding waste disposal. as matt said I sell silver recover stuff, but I don't do the hard sell... I've read thing about people claiming selenium is harmless because it is present in multivitamins ( from someone who claimed she was a chemist/scientist ) and as I mentioned my regional neighbor who claimed cyanide came from the earth, said he was just putting it back... and when I told him it was uncool, and I fished in the pond footsteps from his house he said " don't worry I'm downstream" .. not to forget to mention the person he was told it was safe to dump his cyanide in his backyard is a world renown guru regarding wet plate.. when he moved he offered me a boatload of his dry chemistry ( from dichromate to metol to potassium cyanide ) and said if I didn't take them he was just going to pour them in his backyard ... so im kind of freaked out by people's crazy-disposal-attitudes when it comes to photo chemistry.
glad to read you were just kidding cause .. its hard to tell sometimes ..
I laughed when you said "dilution is the solution" to be honest because in my college days I had hippy friends who said that as well as "if its yellow let it mellow, if its brown flush it down". and when it came time for them to flush it went into the garden behind their house.. messed up..
have fun with your processing..

 

[Donald Qualls]

COLOR PROCESSING STARTER KIT - Cs41 Kit, °CsC (120V), Developing Tank, – CineStill Film

I noticed that they want $42 for the CineStill kit on Amazon, Cinestill sells it for $25 or so, plus shipping.

One thing to be aware of: Cinestill sells their kit in two forms. One is a liquid concentrate; the other is dry chemicals. The dry kit costs them less to produce/package, and it also cheaper/faster to ship (can travel regular air postal vs. ground-only UPS, as well as weighing less). The dry kit does not, however, include the final rinse, but Flexicolor final rinse is easy enough to get and quite inexpensive.

 

[pentaxuser]

Alessandro I hope your Italian brings him back as he abandoned us after one day in August

pentaxuser

 

[RalphLambrecht]

I wouldn't use any photo chemistry anywhere close to where I make or consume food, not even caffenol...

+1

 

[Down Under]

Processing at home, well, why not?

On the plus side, you will save money, especially with C41. E6 I wouldn't touch with a barge pole, and I say this very seriously after decades of processing this stuff.

On the somewhat less than positive side, the learning curve with home developing isn't as small as many think - I've been doing it since 1961, am I'm still learning. Souping new films means a LOT of testing, and some small disasters.

If you get really seriously into it, consider a Jobo. I have two Duolabs I bought for very little when they were being dumped in Australia in the early 2000s, and they go on giving me excellent results. Again, there is a learning curve, but Jobo provides a big lot of detailed data about how to do just about everything. Google for it.

Yes, almost everything you put through your tank can be fixed up in post processing - but with C41, you will be spending many hours making micro-adjustments...

All this said, if you stay with B&W, unless you are an absolute true perfectionist, your results should be suitably satisfying.

The best way to find out is to try it. Best of luck, and keep us posted about your results!

 

[Brownie_Holiday]

One thing to be aware of: Cinestill sells their kit in two forms. One is a liquid concentrate; the other is dry chemicals. The dry kit costs them less to produce/package, and it also cheaper/faster to ship (can travel regular air postal vs. ground-only UPS, as well as weighing less). The dry kit does not, however, include the final rinse, but Flexicolor final rinse is easy enough to get and quite inexpensive.

Thanks. I looked at both the wet and dry. They were priced similarly, however, neither is in stock.

Your opinion, please. Do you think the powdered is better in terms of mixing in small batches to avoid the shelf life issues with mixed product?

Thanks!

 

[Donald Qualls]

Your opinion, please. Do you think the powdered is better in terms of mixing in small batches to avoid the shelf life issues with mixed product?

Thanks!

I don't think the powder has any advantage here. The problem with subdividing powder mixtures is being sure you're getting the same fraction of each ingredient. Yes, people have done it for decades, mostly it works -- and occasionally someone has something go wrong and doesn't know why, and doesn't bother to tell us they did something like mix half the D-76 powder. Mixtures of powder can stratify by density and particle size, and the developer, especially (even if it's two or three envelopes) will have mixtures in at least one. Then there's the fact that it's difficult to fully reseal those bags, so the powders will be subject to humidity and oxygen after opening. Might not be a problem, but we just don't know.

With liquids, you can agitate the bottle before pouring, mix half or a quarter, and be sure it'll be the same as what you get when you mix the rest -- and concentrates generally keep much better than working solutions anyway. If you'll be holding the unmixed portion for longer than several months, get a can of butane lighter fuel at the nearest smoke shop and blanket the bottles with it -- it'll exclude oxygen very effectively, and oxygen is the only real enemy of developers and fixer. I would, however, look up how to mix the bleach and fixer separately instead of together as blix -- each component will last longer than they will mixed. Bleach and Fixer will last much longer than the developer when separate; as blix, they're only just about good for the same shelf life (and when they say eight weeks and 12 rolls, they mean it).

The other advantage of the liquid is that it comes with the final rinse concentrate -- this does the same job as Photo-Flo, but also includes some preservative and antibacterial additives specific to color film. It also keeps well at working strength, and in my experience can be reused many times (likely has a longer capacity life than the blix or color developer).

 

[Brownie_Holiday]

I don't think the powder has any advantage here. The problem with subdividing powder mixtures is being sure you're getting the same fraction of each ingredient. Yes, people have done it for decades, mostly it works -- and occasionally someone has something go wrong and doesn't know why, and doesn't bother to tell us they did something like mix half the D-76 powder. Mixtures of powder can stratify by density and particle size, and the developer, especially (even if it's two or three envelopes) will have mixtures in at least one. Then there's the fact that it's difficult to fully reseal those bags, so the powders will be subject to humidity and oxygen after opening. Might not be a problem, but we just don't know.

With liquids, you can agitate the bottle before pouring, mix half or a quarter, and be sure it'll be the same as what you get when you mix the rest -- and concentrates generally keep much better than working solutions anyway. If you'll be holding the unmixed portion for longer than several months, get a can of butane lighter fuel at the nearest smoke shop and blanket the bottles with it -- it'll exclude oxygen very effectively, and oxygen is the only real enemy of developers and fixer. I would, however, look up how to mix the bleach and fixer separately instead of together as blix -- each component will last longer than they will mixed. Bleach and Fixer will last much longer than the developer when separate; as blix, they're only just about good for the same shelf life (and when they say eight weeks and 12 rolls, they mean it).

The other advantage of the liquid is that it comes with the final rinse concentrate -- this does the same job as Photo-Flo, but also includes some preservative and antibacterial additives specific to color film. It also keeps well at working strength, and in my experience can be reused many times (likely has a longer capacity life than the blix or color developer).

That thar is some mighty fine info, exactly what I was looking for, thanks!

I was thinking about using my vacuum sealer to encase the bags or bottles. Cheap and easy to do. I can see the butane in the bottle, then in a vacuum sealed bag for storage of longer periods. Although I am hoping to get into it enough to do 2 or 3 rolls/month.