Shooting RA4 as negative in camera in ULF sizes

Algo después · Oct 26, 2020

Hello,

Sorry for my poor English. First at all: Thank you guys for all the kindness and wisdom here, it is certainly a very powerful tool for researchers like me dealing with this fantastic analog world. A ton of my questions will probably be resolved on this forum and it's just time for to find out where it is. So that's my case, I'm starting to shoot Fuji CA II with a Zeiss Ikon Maximar 207/7 (9x12) and I already found here some answers about filtering with satisfactory results (by my standard haha). I tried shooting 5x7 with the same carpet lens (CZJ Tessar 135mm) because 9x12 is too small to enlarge but I have no results, just dark images, I don't know if this is what you call "foggy neg". Anyway, I would like to increase my negatives to these ULF scales: 11x14- 16x20 "that's why I bought an Apo tessar f9 / 600mm (circa 1930). Actually I choose ra4 because c-41film for me is prohibitive and not available in many standards and for Last, but not least, because ra4 for me is a very interesting option to experiment with.

So I was wondering if anyone else around here was shooting ra4. Could you tell us some advice or tip? Or if you know the correct thread, please take me there. Thanks again.

Greetings

David A. Goldfarb · Oct 26, 2020

Thread moved to the color section and title updated for clarity.

Algo después · Oct 26, 2020

Thank you David

David A. Goldfarb · Oct 26, 2020

No problem.

David A. Goldfarb · Oct 26, 2020

Threads combined. No need to post duplicates, since people will see both in their "new post" view. Multilingual threads are okay here.

Pioneer · Oct 26, 2020

This is certainly an interesting thought! I have a couple of boxes of RA4 paper I inherited in a bulk purchase and this would certainly give me something to do with the paper.

I will watch this one closely.

MattKing · Oct 26, 2020

I haven't done this.
It will require very high light intensity and/or long exposure times.
RA4 paper is intended to be exposed with light heavily balanced toward red, so you will need to filter heavily, which in turn will extend exposure.
I am really interested in seeing if anyone has done this successfully.

Adrian Bacon · Oct 27, 2020

MattKing said:
I haven't done this.
It will require very high light intensity and/or long exposure times.
RA4 paper is intended to be exposed with light heavily balanced toward red, so you will need to filter heavily, which in turn will extend exposure.
I am really interested in seeing if anyone has done this successfully.

Thinking about this, it's possible one could take a roll of 120 C-41, or sheet of 4x5 C-41, and process it without exposing it, then use that as a filter in front of the lens as a starting point. One would have to work out the exposure time, but it would at least get something in the ballpark in terms of filtration.

Raghu Kuvempunagar · Oct 27, 2020

Algo después said:
So I was wondering if anyone else around here was shooting ra4. Could you tell us some advice or tip? Or if you know the correct thread, please take me there. Thanks again.

@Algo después: Have you seen these?
https://www.photo.net/discuss/threads/reversal-paper-for-ra4-processing.135328/
https://www.photo.net/discuss/threads/paper-color-slides-anybody-part-1.140128/

koraks · Oct 27, 2020

Adrian Bacon said:
Thinking about this, it's possible one could take a roll of 120 C-41, or sheet of 4x5 C-41, and process it without exposing it, then use that as a filter in front of the lens as a starting point. One would have to work out the exposure time, but it would at least get something in the ballpark in terms of filtration.

Yes, that's a good way to get in the ballpark. Additional filtration will still be necessary in my limited experience. I didn't get very promising results in my few tests, although I did get colors that somewhat resembled reality. I've seen many similar results from others, and one or two that were much better. One was from a Chinese team that looked really well, at least in their controlled studio shots.

Edit: just to be sure, I'm talking in-camera positives, not negatives, so reversal processed RA4.

Adrian Bacon · Oct 27, 2020

koraks said:
Yes, that's a good way to get in the ballpark. Additional filtration will still be necessary in my limited experience. I didn't get very promising results in my few tests, although I did get colors that somewhat resembled reality. I've seen many similar results from others, and one or two that were much better. One was from a Chinese team that looked really well, at least in their controlled studio shots.

Edit: just to be sure, I'm talking in-camera positives, not negatives, so reversal processed RA4.

RA-4 is designed to work with a tungsten light source, so if you’re shooting daylight, I’d think you actually need a full CTO gel (to convert daylight to tungsten) stacked with a blank processed C-41 film base. Or maybe just the full CTO. Hmm...I’d have think about that.

Algo después · Oct 27, 2020

Mike, Thanks for the advice,
I had luck shooting outdoors in sunny days but just 9x12. Def. will gonna be a challenge to try 16x20 indoor !
So here´s my real problem, dealing with bellow´s factor/ iso ra4 paper / developing times.

Adrian, thanks for the idea,
For filtering I just using an Ambico sepia filter (I attached one test). In this old thread this guy called Mark Killmer was working very nice with his combo filters.
https://www.photrio.com/forum/threads/color-paper-as-paper-negative.64063/

Raghu., Thanks for the links
I was checking all these threads and def they are very useful. Bujor´s and Roland´s tests are simply great.
Actually I didn´t try yet (developing with reversal process) but I agree with Koraks here, just a few results are real promising.
Probaly I think I already watched this guy from China (on instagram) but there´s not too much info about the process.

Probably, if would do it, gonna be using these chemistry hc-110 /C-41. I don´t know if it work but anyway...no more options around here in Argentina
(the kit Tetenal ra4´price is fetchin insane 295 bucks !!! can you believe it ¿¿). All my ra4 shots are developed with c-41 with decent results. and later that I use PS for the positves.

Hey Pioneer
I´m not the right person for to say this but, what the heck !
welcome aboard !

______________________

[ATTACH = full] 258128 [/ ATTACH]
Zeiss Ikon Maximar 207/7 (9x12)
f 8 - 4 "(con filtro Ambico Sepia)
Papel Fuji Crystal Archive II
Dev con C-41 (1 min)
Blix (2-3 segundos)

Adrian Bacon · Oct 28, 2020

Algo después said:
Adrian, thanks for the idea,
For filtering I just using an Ambico sepia filter (I attached one test). In this old thread this guy called Mark Killmer was working very nice with his combo filters.
https://www.photrio.com/forum/threads/color-paper-as-paper-negative.64063/

Colorwise, your attachment isn't half bad. Maybe a little low on contrast, but otherwise, you're not way off. That other thread is amazing prints for what he was doing.

Wayne · Oct 29, 2020

I messed around with making RA4 negatives from positives briefly, and I intend to again, but my darkroom time is extremely limited and I haven't revisited it since this thread. Not exactly what you want to do but related.

https://www.photrio.com/forum/threads/printing-from-ra-4-paper-negatives.164612/

Algo después · Oct 30, 2020

Wayne said:
I messed around with making RA4 negatives from positives briefly, and I intend to again, but my darkroom time is extremely limited and I haven't revisited it since this thread. Not exactly what you want to do but related.

https://www.photrio.com/forum/threads/printing-from-ra-4-paper-negatives.164612/

Thank you Wayne,

It would be great to see more tests like those. Perhaps I would rather following this path than reversal process
Probably I´m wrong in this but my problem with most of reversal process that I seen is people anyway are using PS for fixing their filtering.

Wayne · Oct 30, 2020

Algo después said:
Thank you Wayne,

It would be great to see more tests like those. Perhaps I would rather following this path than reversal process
Probably I´m wrong in this but my problem with most of reversal process that I seen is people anyway are using PS for fixing their filtering.

I'm trying to get my darkroom set up again. I only have a few weeks to a few months each winter to use it. I haven't decided what I will work on when its ready. This will likely be one thing I work on some more but I can't guarantee it. I'm aiming for more of a surrealist effect than realism look so what I do may not be all that helpful.

Shooting RA4 as negative in camera in ULF sizes

Algo después

David A. Goldfarb

Moderator

Algo después

David A. Goldfarb

Moderator

David A. Goldfarb

Moderator

Pioneer

MattKing

Moderator

Adrian Bacon

Raghu Kuvempunagar

koraks

Moderator

Adrian Bacon

Algo después

Attachments

Adrian Bacon

Wayne

Algo después

Wayne

Shooting RA4 as negative in camera in ULF sizes

Moderator

Moderator

Moderator

Moderator

Moderator

Attachments

Privacy & Transparency

Privacy & Transparency