roll film tank mechanical agitator - can it be built simply?

[ymc226]

Does anyone sell or can one build a simple contraption that can agitate a large Paterson tank (one that can hold either 8 35mm rolls or 5 120 rolls) for development on specified either 30 second or 1 minute schedule. I would time it using a darkroom timer and do the stop, fix and hypoclear manually.

The reason is I would like to have 3 or more of these tanks develop simultaneously since I often have 50+ rolls to develop at a setting.

 

[Rick A]

Um... I think they are called Uniroller motor bases, or something similar. Anyway, they are self reversing and will possibly handle the three roll Patersons, the two rooll tanks dont work so well(at least on mine).

 

[MattKing]

I think the OP may be looking for something that does inversion agitation, not rotary agitation.

I use the roller bases for rotary agitation of the smaller 2x120 Paterson tanks. For the 5x120 tanks, you would need something to hold the tanks in position, and I would be concerned about whether the tanks + reels + chemistry might be too heavy.

 

[Ian Grant]

Yes, they are called hands. I've often had 3 or more large tanks on the go at the same time, all Paterson with inversion agitation.

When I process that way I always use replenished developer, I stagger the tanks, starting a new cycle every 5-10 minutes, longer (10 mins) when there's more than 2 tanks.

I've worked that way when needed with both B&W and E6 since the 1970's (late 70's for E6). If it was a constant demand I'd use deep tanks again

Ian

 

[Martin Aislabie]

Have you thought about a TAS Film Processor - http://www.rhdesigns.co.uk/darkroom/html/tas_film_processor.html

They are expensive but it could be exactly what you are looking for

Richard Ross (the man behind RH Designs is an APUG subscriber and all round good bloke) is very freindly and full of good advice if you want or need help

Martin

 

[ymc226]

Thanks Martin, that's just what I wanted. I emailed Mr. Ross to see if the largest Paterson tank can be accommodated.

 

[David A. Goldfarb]

Have you considered setting up a tank line? It's been a while since I've used 3.5 gallon tanks with cages, but they hold a lot of reels (I forget if it's 24, 36 or 48 stainless 35mm reels).

 

[radiant]

I made myself this kind of agitator (subtitles in English available).

I have to say it has been really time / nerve saver. I'm currently using the 5 roll paterson tank and still I wouldnt want to do this by hand. If I couldn't build stuff like that myself I would probably buy a machine for this - if I knew what it is worth (in time, nerves, easiness..)

Also my machine doesn't roll upside down anymore (5 roll tank would not fit) and there isn't actually need for that. The movement is also slower now and I get even development. Amazed how little there needs to be movement to get enough agitation. And trust me, I have found the limit of "too little" too

I usually do so that I only mix developer, start developing and meanwhile make fixer, clean the darkroom a bit etc. I have a "continous" agitation mode for fixing phase too.

 

[Jim Blodgett]

"I made myself this kind of agitator..."

Impressive.

 

[radiant]

Impressive.

Thank you. By the way: my point was not to brag with these, more than showing what I have built and how I feel about the machine after almost one year of weekly use..

 

[Luckless]

I made myself this kind of agitator (subtitles in English available).

That is a sweet little rig. I've been considering building similar for myself, but also wanted to go the ambitious route of having automatic chemistry changes too...

 

[radiant]

That is a sweet little rig. I've been considering building similar for myself, but also wanted to go the ambitious route of having automatic chemistry changes too...

I would want that too. But building & maintaining that machine would be so heavy burden that I wouldn't then have any film to develop..

 

[Sirius Glass]

Yes, they are called hands. I've often had 3 or more large tanks on the go at the same time, all Paterson with inversion agitation.

When I process that way I always use replenished developer, I stagger the tanks, starting a new cycle every 5-10 minutes, longer (10 mins) when there's more than 2 tanks.

I've worked that way when needed with both B&W and E6 since the 1970's (late 70's for E6). If it was a constant demand I'd use deep tanks again

Ian

Yes, and I could definitely use more hands. Are they available on Amazon?

 

[radiant]

Btw: If you want to build something similar yourself - it doesn't have to be as fancy as mine. And mine is not a fancy one: my plan was just to get it to do it's job. It's a bit too "complex" because I thought the tank needs to be turned upside down.

Build a rig from wood that can turn the tank 45 degrees or a bit more. No need to turn 180 degrees or 90 degrees in my experience. The less is better actually, but not too little! Then add Arduino and RC servo and program simple one minute timer which runs the servo and connect it to some kind of lever to get more movement from servo with metal wire or something!

Good example: https://www.arduino.cc/en/Tutorial/Sweep - just add minute delay after each agitation. More arduino information here: https://www.arduino.cc/en/Tutorial/Foundations

If you are ready to learn new stuff I think this should be doable for most of people. Arduino environment is really nice and user friendly and easy to use. You can easily add few switches to control the functionality (for example continous agitation).

 

[John51]

Is there any form of agitation that will never work properly no matter how much trial and error goes into it?

Assuming that there isn't, might as well choose the most convenient form of agitation and then dial it in.

For multiple tanks, I'd go for a large vibrating plate. Have it on a timer to vibrate for x seconds every y minutes.

 

[Arklatexian]

Have you considered setting up a tank line? It's been a while since I've used 3.5 gallon tanks with cages, but they hold a lot of reels (I forget if it's 24, 36 or 48 stainless 35mm reels).

The only one that I have used took 18 reels of 120 film.......Regards!

 

[mklw1954]

How much do you want to spend?
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B...e227-51d0-a3b9-ae3638cb0aa5&pf_rd_i=318018011

I wonder if a lab orbital shaker table would provide adequate agitation:
https://www.amazon.com/Mophorn-Orbi...2?s=industrial&ie=UTF8&qid=1572123110&sr=1-12

 

[Ian Grant]

Rather a stupid comment, some people are disabled, MS etc think before looking stupid

No an apt comment, someone who's disabled and can't agitate a tank probably wouldn't be loading or developing film in the first place, they'd be getting someone else to aid or help them.

As it happens my darkroom has been used a few times in the past by a severely disabled wheelchair bound photographer and I processed for him, if someone 's disability was slight so they could perhaps load a tank then most of us would suggest an automated Jobo rotary processor or similar.

Perhaps you should have read why the OP was asking the question before your comments.

ian

 

[choiliefan]

Here we go...

 

[Ian Grant]

Wrong again.


JUST because a person has, say MS does NOT mean they can'ft load a film,l BUT they may not be able to agitate a tank.

The comment "hands" was wrong.

I replied from a disabled persons point of view and YES I AM disabled, want proof. I find the inverting tanks, agitation a pain, and such a machine that is a good cost would be great, regardless of one of fifty films

Also I don't want someone "doing it for me"

Finally YESb an agitator/tank vibrator IS available that takes tanks of up to 5 35mm films, single speed for £25.99 or £29.99 variable speed, on off switch, made in Wales, GB, for people with a disability or general use.

Why didn't you read my replies properly ? You replied deliberately to try to provoke an argument, it's that simple.

Read what the OP was asking I was simply pointing out it's possible to work hand agitation 3 tanks at a time without the need for a mechanical agitator.

Ian

 

[RalphLambrecht]

Does anyone sell or can one build a simple contraption that can agitate a large Paterson tank (one that can hold either 8 35mm rolls or 5 120 rolls) for development on specified either 30 second or 1 minute schedule. I would time it using a darkroom timer and do the stop, fix and hypoclear manually.

The reason is I would like to have 3 or more of these tanks develop simultaneously since I often have 50+ rolls to develop at a setting.

not automatically but, You could mount a couple of skateboard wheels to a flat wooden board and put the tank on top to roll it manually.

 

[Ian Grant]

not automatically but, You could mount a couple of skateboard wheels to a flat wooden board and put the tank on top to roll it manually.

Many tears ago I used to use a Lego motor and wheels to turn a Paterson Colour Print tank, it worked well, you can do the same with film tanks.

Ian

 

[tezzasmall]

Rather a stupid comment, some people are disabled, MS etc think before looking stupid

No an apt comment... Perhaps you should have read why the OP was asking the question before your comments.

ian

Wrong again.

The comment "hands" was wrong.

I replied from a disabled persons point of view and YES I AM disabled, want proof.

Why didn't you read my replies properly ? You replied deliberately to try to provoke an argument, it's that simple.

Read what the OP was asking I was simply pointing out it's possible to work hand agitation 3 tanks at a time without the need for a mechanical agitator.

Ian

I have held off and bitten my tongue for a while now, but I can't hold back any longer as I am so annoyed!!

I totally agree with Ian's comments!

I also find a lot of 'Mr Jeremy S Rundle's' comments ridiculous and over the top PC! He'll be complaining about us all writing on forums soon, as blind people can't read them!

I have read 'Mr Jeremy S Rundle's' comments both on here and on FADU for a while now and to my eyes he does what Ian says above, in that he quite often comes across as trying '...to provoke an argument.'

He accuses one poster of 'bragging' on behalf of a friend at that, yet constantly posts his latest purchases, which might be cheaper, but is constant bragging none the less, as others may not be able to afford all that he buys and shows.

He says he has trouble driving locally, yet did a return car journey to London from Wales and back, to buy an enlarger, IN ONE DAY!

I've noticed that he will come onto a forum question, say something underhand and then go away and not reply to the answers given.

He says that people are not as polite as they used to be, yet I have found him being impolite to others in some of his comments.

He says 'YES I AM disabled, want proof.'' Or exactly as he put it on FADU, 'Being disabled (I am told

)' and 'I can walk, but not mountaineer!' So, like an average NON-disabled, average person then? A disabled blue badge is meant for someone who is UNABLE to walk any more than 25 metres, or like so many others did you lie about that as well???

He'll constantly points out that he's 'autistic', as if that's an excuse!!

And PLEASE DON'T say the autism bit is what makes you like this, for I volunteer alongside lots of people who have it, along with many other mental illnesses, and NONE of them act the way you have and do on at least two forums that I know of.

I AM mobility disabled myself, after a car accident, and have to use sticks and a wheelchair, but I barely mention it on this or any other forum.

But it winds me up something bad when I see all the people with 'blue badges', which has a person in a wheelchair on it, using them in supermarket etc parking areas, and then walking or even running(!) into a shop, with no mobility aids at all. So, as said previously, I strongly object to people like Mr Rundle declaring from the roof tops by saying, 'YES I AM disabled, want proof.' There should be a secondary or more levels of these badges, as I've heard that there is now about 10% of the population in Britain that are registered 'disabled' when the majority can walk perfectly fine. The blue badge shows a person in a wheelchair - what else is there to know, other than the huge majority of people shouldn't have them!!! It's funny how we have so many 'disabled' people in Britain now, after the introduction of FREE, yes FREE (and paid for the taxpayer!) mobility cars, blue badges and lots of extra benefits! Some of us remember the 1970's, when a 'disabled car' was a small light blue vehicle. You'd be lucky to see one at all in those days. As I say, funny that...

To end, I must say that I hate myself for being dragged into something like this, but Mr Rundle, stop and take a good look at yourself and think twice and then think AGAIN before posting anything in the future. Autism is NOT a 'get out of jail' card for every bad comment made on a forum.

Terry S

 

[odell1618photography]

Here we go...

 

[MattKing]

I don't have Mr. Rundle on "ignore", but if there was a waiting queue .......
I have a particular sensitivity to use of the phrase "disabled" - having essentially 1.5 capable and dexterous hands.
I've used two Paterson tanks at the same time and could probably handle three at the same time, but I fear if I did I would fit the following description:
"like a dog in a meat market"
(This was shared by a couple of old New Orleans Dixieland musicians who stayed with us for a few days when they were up here playing at the Jazz Club my parents were active in. It was a description of a young Lionel Hampton, from the first time he was ever in a movie production recording studio. And the description must be said with a really strong, southern United States, African American accent.)