Report from the Photokina 2014

[Ashfaque]

Dear Henning,

Thank you very much for this wonderful summary and your help in the other issue. I have also enjoyed and learnt from your report on the previous Photokina.

@mnemosyne: I vaguely remember reading here at APUG (, or somewhere else) about this problem with Foma's B&W slides. IIRC, the thread discussed and mentioned specific batch numbers of problematic B&W slides (- I.e., people found problems slides produced within a certain frame). Perhaps others can chime in.

I love to do some B&W later when I am confident enough. In the mean time, it is exciting to hear and read about B&W rev as I had no idea about these until last year!

Bests,

Ashfaque

 

[Oxleyroad]

Is it possible to reverse Orwo UN54? Since it gives very fine results when developed as negatives.

I reversal process this film (both 35mm and 16mm) using ORWO's 829 formula and it is very good. In 16mm you would hardly know the base is light grey. 35mm when viewed on a light box it is obvious the base is light grey, but when projected it is like 16mm, you just struggle to tell.

 

[Henning Serger]

Thank you, Henning, for the information regarding B/W reversal processing. Those are some impressive images you've put up here. You've given me lots to think about.

You're welcome.
Try it, enjoy it. You will not regret it.
There are so much creative options with reversal film, both BW and colour.
Just recently I had again a professional photoshoot (fashion and portrait) where I used colour and BW reversal film with excellent results (and some BW and colour negative film was used, too, as well as instant film ).

Best regards,
Henning

 

[Henning Serger]

B/W reversal gives some stunning results indeed and I would happily use it more frequently, well that is, if FOMA, who are the last remaining producer of a dedicated reversal b/w film, would finally get their QC act together.

Well, even Agfa Scala 200X is still availble:
http://www.fotoimpex.de/shop/system...filme 135&cache=1414153077&nocache=1414153077

For reversal processing films with a clear base work best generally (no rules without exceptions, of course ). At least it is easier to get excellent results with films with a clear base.
And fortunately there are a lot of films with a clear base and excellent results (often better than the Foma) in reversal processing:
For example:
Adox CMS 20 II
Adox Silvermax
Adox CHS 100 II

Agfa Copex Rapid

Ilford Delta 100 120 (and sheets)
Ilford Delta 400 120

Kodak TMX and TMY-2 120 (sheets)

Rollei RPX 25
Rollei Ortho 25
Rollei Retro 80S
Rollei Superpan 200 / Retro 400S / IR

I had four rolls of fresh Fomapan 100R developed by Studio 13 recently, the results were exceptional, but most of the pictures are covered with hundreds or thousands of black dots/specks that render them almost unusable. According to the lab, this is a rather common problem with Fomapan film. What a shame ...

Well yes, it looks like Foma has (or had) some QC problems. At the beginning of 2013 I had the same problem with the black dots.
This spring I used film from another, younger batch and there were no black dots at all.
As you had the problem, best is to contact Foma.

Best regards,
Henning

 

[Henning Serger]

Is it possible to reverse Orwo UN54? Since it gives very fine results when developed as negatives.

Yes, it is possible, results are good.
But instead I highly recommend using Adox CHS 100 II instead in the reversal process from Klaus Wehner.
Because:
The tonal rendition of the Orwo and Adox is very similar, but the Adox is significantly sharper (due to an additional AHU layer), has better resolution, a clear base, and gives ISO 200/24° in the reversal process of K. Wehner.
And it is already finshed as 35mm film for photo cameras.

Best regards,
Henning

 

[Henning Serger]

Dear Henning,

Thank you very much for this wonderful summary and your help in the other issue. I have also enjoyed and learnt from your report on the previous Photokina.

I am glad I could help you.

I love to do some B&W later when I am confident enough. In the mean time, it is exciting to hear and read about B&W rev as I had no idea about these until last year!

You don't have to be confident to use BW (or colour) reversal film.
You are able to use your camera?
You are able to use the lightmeter in your camera?
If the answer is yes, then you can start with reversal film.
More is not needed.
Use one the professional BW reversal labs, that's it.

Best regards,
Henning

 

[flavio81]

In the mean time, it is exciting to hear and read about B&W rev as I had no idea about these until last year!

B&W reversal development has existed for a long long time and has been used a lot for movies. Many current B/W films are usable.
Let's hope that ILFORD or TETENAL release some chemicals to make this process easier in the home. For example they could release a bleach and a chemical-reversal solution, and with these two we'd all be shooting B&W slides easily.

There is another way of doing B&W sildes and it's by using "direct positive film", which is film that does not respond to light as a negative, but as a positive. Photo Engineer has mentioned that much promising research was done in the past with these kind of emulsions. Currently there is a direct positive paper sold.

 

[AgX]

There are direct positive films too.

 

[flavio81]

There are direct positive films too.

... currently sold? Please AgX, enlighten us!!

I wonder, as well, if current fast films (like HP5+) could be made to work as direct films by preflashing them strongly and then exposing at something like ISO 6. Perhaps Photo Engineer can give a clue. Because if i recall correctly in all films the exposure/density curve has a zone where, after density is taken to the max, the curve actually reverses it's slope. In other words, the film acts as a positive film.

 

[Chris Livsey]

... currently sold? Please AgX, enlighten us!!

http://www.foma.cz/en/catalogue-fomapan-r-100-detail-273

Is I suspect the source of the comment.

 

[flavio81]

http://www.foma.cz/en/catalogue-fomapan-r-100-detail-273

Is I suspect the source of the comment.

Hi Chris. The link is to the FOMAPAN R100 film. That's a b&w "reversal" film, not a b&w "direct positive film".

A reversal film produces positive output because it is developed with reversal processing, which, as its name implies, includes some steps to achieve the reversal. The film responds to light exactly as a negative film does: more light, more density. It is developed with a normal developer, so exposed areas develop as black silver. But there is unexposed silver on the darker (less exposed) areas. So, in the reversal process, we use a "bleach", which removes the developed "black" silver. Then we re-expose the unexposed silver (i.e. by using a light bulb) and bring the film into a developer for the second time. In this way, the darker (less exposed) areas develop as black. In other words, we get a positive image.

A "direct positive" film responds to light in a different way: more light, less density.

As far as i know, the difference between Fomapan R100 and a regular negative film is that Fomapan R100 has a clearer film base and a special anti-halation layer that requires reversal processing to clear. Of course, i expect the emulsion has also been formulated to withstand the bleach and reversal steps in a way that gives excellent tonality and sharpness. I have seen some online samples of Fomapan R100 and they made me drool. I wish i could get the necessary chemicals to prepare my own reversal chemistry!

 

[AgX]

... currently sold? Please AgX, enlighten us!!

I wonder, as well, if current fast films (like HP5+) could be made to work as direct films by preflashing them strongly and then exposing at something like ISO 6. Perhaps Photo Engineer can give a clue. Because if i recall correctly in all films the exposure/density curve has a zone where, after density is taken to the max, the curve actually reverses it's slope. In other words, the film acts as a positive film.

What you refer to is solarisation, something modern films rarely do.



Agfa has several direct reversal films in production.

One of these films is converted by Maco/Rollei Film into type 135:

http://www.macodirect.de/special-offers-agfa-slide-direct-twinbragfa-copex-slide-directbr2x-p-2347.html

Film speed is eqivalant to fraction of ISO or negative DIN values.

 

[Henning Serger]

B&W reversal development has existed for a long long time and has been used a lot for movies. Many current B/W films are usable.
Let's hope that ILFORD or TETENAL release some chemicals to make this process easier in the home.

Flavio, keep calm, it is already in the works!
But from two other German companies, one of them having an outstanding knowledge in BW reversal processing, the other being a top-quality photo chemical producer.
Experienced photographers are alreading doing field tests with this new chemistry, me being one of them.
There is a good chance having this easy to use reversal kit for home development on the market next year.

Best regards,
Henning

 

[baachitraka]

Existing reversal kits are easy to process at home compare to C-41.

 

[Ashfaque]

Dear Henning,
You really know how to motivate. Thanks again!

Flavio, keep calm, it is already in the works!
But from two other German companies, one of them having an outstanding knowledge in BW reversal processing, the other being a top-quality photo chemical producer.
Experienced photographers are alreading doing field tests with this new chemistry, me being one of them.
There is a good chance having this easy to use reversal kit for home development on the market next year....

Just out of curiousity, who are they?

Bests,

Ashfaque

 

[flavio81]

Flavio, keep calm, it is already in the works!
But from two other German companies, one of them having an outstanding knowledge in BW reversal processing, the other being a top-quality photo chemical producer.
Experienced photographers are alreading doing field tests with this new chemistry, me being one of them.
There is a good chance having this easy to use reversal kit for home development on the market next year.

Best regards,
Henning

Yay!! This is great news!! Thanks Henning!!

 

[Ulrich Drolshagen]

Just out of curiousity, who are they?

I try to guess:

Chemicals: Wolfgang Moersch
B/W-slides: Klaus Wehner

 

[Xmas]

http://www.foma.cz/en/catalogue-fomapan-r-100-detail-273

Is I suspect the source of the comment.

Try
http://shop.silverprint.co.uk/Fomapan-R-Black-and-White-Reversal-Kit/product/54404/V70150/
You need to use with clear base film and take care with temperatures etc.

 

[flavio81]

What you refer to is solarisation, something modern films rarely do.



Agfa has several direct reversal films in production.

One of these films is converted by Maco/Rollei Film into type 135:

http://www.macodirect.de/special-of...twinbragfa-copex-slide-directbr2x-p-2347.html

Film speed is eqivalant to fraction of ISO or negative DIN values.

Thanks AgX!! This made my day

Is this actually microfilm? ("Copex")

 

[Henning Serger]

Dear Henning,
You really know how to motivate. Thanks again!


Just out of curiousity, who are they?

Bests,

Ashfaque

Hello Ashfaque,

you will see .
Because of NDA I cannot tell more at this time.
Intensive test runs are currently done. All people involved in this project are working hard.

And there is additional good news:
We will probably see another improved RA-4 paper on the market in the next months. A paper the manufacturer tries to match the brillance in white which his biggest competitor is already offering .

Best regards,
Henning

 

[Henning Serger]

Hello friends,

Impossible Project:
Very interesting news in the talk with the Impossible manager, too: Demand for Impossible film is increasing. They expect to sell about a million film packs this year.

just a short update:
They even surpassed their target: Already in mid-November the 1 million film pack number was surpassed (official statement by IP). So from January 1th to mid-November 2014 1 million IP film packs were sold.
This summer their first new own camera shall be introduced.

Best regards,
Henning

 

[RattyMouse]

Hello friends,



just a short update:
They even surpassed their target: Already in mid-November the 1 million film pack number was surpassed (official statement by IP). So from January 1th to mid-November 2014 1 million IP film packs were sold.
This summer their first new own camera shall be introduced.

Best regards,
Henning

Fujifilm said last year that they sold 2.7 million INSTAX cameras. Clearly instant film is doing pretty well.

 

[Henning Serger]

Fujifilm said last year that they sold 2.7 million INSTAX cameras. Clearly instant film is doing pretty well.

Yes.
And that was much much more than their sales of the digital X-camera line......

Best regards,
Henning

 

[AgX]

Hello friends,



just a short update:
They even surpassed their target: Already in mid-November the 1 million film pack number was surpassed (official statement by IP). So from January 1th to mid-November 2014 1 million IP film packs were sold.
This summer their first new own camera shall be introduced.

Best regards,
Henning

It is easy for them to state such numbers but concealing the same time how they got to that enterprise without paying.

 

[AgX]

In contrast to 35mm films, the problem with instant films is that sales are completele dependant on marketing at those markets where instant photography has vanished from the perception of people for some time. Thus there can be most great differences between shops who have cameras and films at offer and present them their customers and shops that have some instant films waiting fo someone to enter the shop and asking for films no-one else around has heard of.