Replenishing fixer

[BetterSense]

I'm getting tired of mixing up new rapid fixer after I find out my old fixer died. Sometimes I even have to go back and re-fix the last roll just to have peace of mind about it. I'm starting to wonder, why can't I just add a certain number of mL of fresh concentrate to the bottle so that my fixer never goes bad at all? I use replenished developer and add 23 mL of replenisher every roll. Doing the same thing for fixer seems natural.

 

[MattKing]

Fixer gets "polluted" by silver.

Replenishment doesn't remove the pollution.

Matt

 

[nickandre]

the replenisher in the C41 process essentially works by dumping out a small portion of fixer and replacing it with some fresh stuff every roll. Personally I use one of two methods. Method 1: use the fixer for one roll of film and dump it. Method 2: mix the fixer in a gallon jug. Use it once, and pour it into a one liter bottle. Use the stuff from the bottle and then dump it. Fixer is cheap. Pictures are worth a lot more.

 

[Ian Grant]

Colour processes and RC B&W paper (or film) fixing can use replenishment systems for fixing because the silver content is far less critical for image permanence etc.

Ilford have a section on replenishing Hypam in their data-sheet. However replenishment isn't recommended for fibre based papers.

Ian

 

[bdial]

I have some old texts that discuss removing silver electrolytically and reusing the solution. Working out the details would take experimentation though, and probably risks image permanence. Seems easier to test the fix more often and mix fresh as needed.

 

[dancqu]

Try the Ammonium or Sodium form One-Shot

I'm getting tired of mixing up new rapid fixer after
I find out my old fixer died.

I use fresh fix each roll. When I was using a rapid fixer
I added 20ml of the concentrate to the solution volume
needed. As the fixer is quite dilute additional time is
required. I found 10 minutes about right with
a non-iodized film, Acros 120.

I too had the liquid fixer going bad before finishing the
bottle so switched to the solid sodium form. If you'd like
to try the slower sodium form allow a little more time.
16 grams of the anhydrous will do for most films. Life
span of the sodium form may be generations.

As one-shot dilute fixers are very little loaded with
dissolved silver, washing can be expected to be
more thorough. All things being equal. Dan

 

[fschifano]

Dan's got a point there, but I also believe that for many people his methods are a little extreme. It's not the state of exhaustion that you should be worried about, but rather the concentration of fixing byproducts. When the concentration of these byproducts gets too high, it causes problems. These byproducts are very hard to remove in the final wash, and any left behind will have a deleterious effect on the image. Dan's method virtually guarantees that the absolute minimum amount of fixing byproducts are present to cause problems later on. If you replenish without discarding some portion of the working fixer, these byproducts will continue to build up to a concentration that is considered harmful. For quick and dirty prints for which you have no expectation of longevity, I suppose it doesn't matter. If you expect your work to last for more than a few years at best, replenishing fixer is not the way to go.

 

[BetterSense]

For what it's worth, I wasn't thinking of prints. My film and print fixers are separate, and it's the film fixer that annoys me. I'm thinking of going to two-bath fixing for film, that way when fix 1 dies, I already have fix 2 ready and at least I don't have to mix up a new batch that instant.

 

[fschifano]

Even so, there is an upper limit to the concentration of fixing byproducts that should be observed. The figure differs by the type of material being processed, and I'm sure someone on this forum has those figures handy.

 

[Philippe-Georges]

Have a look in the attached document, I use the UNILEC works good on B&W FB paper and film too :

 

[marcmarc]

I don't replenish my working solution fix, but I do pour it back into a separate jar through a coffee filter. I'm not really sure if this has any effect on the byproducts in the fix, but I figured it wouldn't hurt.

 

[nickandre]

For what it's worth, I wasn't thinking of prints. My film and print fixers are separate, and it's the film fixer that annoys me. I'm thinking of going to two-bath fixing for film, that way when fix 1 dies, I already have fix 2 ready and at least I don't have to mix up a new batch that instant.

You can "replenish" B+W fix too. "Replenishing" the fixer is essentially replacing it a small part at a time rather than replacing it all at once. It's also more consistent.

Two bath is fine, it just takes longer than one bath and toss. I'm impatient. Two bath is the "save every penny" strategy because you can safely use fix to it's limit without archival problems as the byproducts diffuse out in the second fresh fixer. It makes me wonder why color fix takes 6.5 mins if the clearing time is 30 seconds...

 

[fschifano]

...It makes me wonder why color fix takes 6.5 mins if the clearing time is 30 seconds...

Indeed, C-41 fixer can clear some B&W films in 30 seconds, but be aware that B&W films need far less fixing than color films. Silver that forms the image remains behind, and only the non image bearing silver halides need to be removed. Color films, both C-41 and E-6, have at least three (four?) separate layers of silver bearing emulsion, and all of the silver halides must be removed, placing a much heavier load on the fixer.

 

[dancqu]

Why Replenish When ....

Dan's method virtually guarantees that the absolute
minimum amount of fixing byproducts are present
to cause problems later on.

I've not done the arithmetic but believe the method
I suggested brings dissolved silver levels well
within 'archival' levels.

Why replenish when likely the same amount used
for replenishing will in itself thoroughly fix a roll
of film?

With the two bath method the OP would have
twice as much fix going bad. Used little or
not at all fixers do go bad.

If your volume is low and you've a few minutes
to spare the slow sodium form is the one to use.
It makes for a quick fix to mix. Spoon up a fresh
fix at processing time. That's what I do. Dan

 

[removed account4]

i have read of people plating out the silver from their fixer using something like the silver magnet ( electroplating ) .
they use it as their first bath and use a fresh fixer as their 2nd bath ... they say they don't really have trouble ..