Recurrent black smearing / streaking on last frames of Kodak 35 mm films (since ~2020)

[Lachlan Young]

@Joerg Bergs . Can you explain your workflow, please?

• How you extract the film from the cassette for processing?
• Are the films processed by hand or machine?
• What type of machine?
• Do you use twinchecks to match film to docket/order pouch?
• What type (if any) of film clips do the lab use, for hanging negative strip prior to scan/print?

And the other question for @Joerg Bergs is: how many people are doing the loading, and is it all happening on one site?

With an awful lot of these intermittent faults, while there might have been small manufacturing changes (e.g. to plasticiser or gelatin extenders) that make the emulsions fractionally more sensitive to physical mishandling in some specific lab environments, I do also wonder if a significant percentage also relates to people advancing the film until it's taught at the end of the roll, then on rewinding it somehow ends up getting wound back into the cartridge the opposite way out - on thinking further about it, this was the one time I saw the fault (or something similar) to the one described.

And while all 135 Kodak colour is now on Estar, the B&W is (as far as I can tell) still on CTA - the bases are quite readily identifiable by handling characteristics on loading to reels.

 

[Joerg Bergs]

I have already described the equipment we use. The film shown here was exposed with a Leica M6, so there was no fast-forwarding followed by exposure. The Kodak black-and-white film used is also coated on Estar base.

We label films with double numbers, but this is unrelated to the issue described, as the problem occurs at the end of the film, not at the beginning.

I do not know which cameras our customers use. For scanning there is no need to clip the film. We use only clips for the dip&dunk, but not for the other machines.

 

[foc]

Is there a service engineer you can contact or another lab you are friendly with, and see if they can throw any light on your problem?

 

[brbo]

So, we have:

- more than one lab owner experiencing problem on virtually all Kodak films
- Photrio members that never experienced such problem (considering that Photrio is 99% talk and 1% shooting film this could be expected)
- Photrio members that never experienced such problem on Kodak C-41 film, but see it on almost all BW Kodak film


Strange.

 

[calebarchie]

Just another thing to throw in the mix; came across a roll of respooled 250D (2022) with the same issue.

 

[koraks]

Just another thing to throw in the mix; came across a roll of respooled 250D (2022) with the same issue.

Well, AFAIK Kodak doesn't do any respooling of this product.
I've shot heaps of 250D (and 50D, and Double-X) and found one single defect on it which I can't even tell for sure is on the film or a freak contamination incident on my end.

 

[calebarchie]

This had its remjet removed and confectioned in China, but may point towards some kind of damage in the confectioning process (could combination of manufacturing defect also).

 

[FredK]

Joerg, have you contacted representatives from Kodak Alaris with this concern? You should be sharing your images with them as well as your experience.

Back with Kodachrome 200, the flat t-grains would pressurize across the 37th frame that would only appear as a pinkish line in sky scenes, and only on some rolls I exposed. I gave up shooting the 37th frame to guarantee better images.

Relative to the rolls, if this is indeed in 36A, that is a concern they should address. If it is in the 37th frame, that is arguably, optional, as that is beyond the stated amount that is provided (36 exposures). This might be due to the process of attaching the film to the winding spindle/core.

 

[Joerg Bergs]

I have not contacted Kodak directly yet. The main reason is simply the current Christmas rush in our lab, which leaves very little time for escalation work outside daily production.

In addition, my former three technical contacts at Kodak are all retired, so I would first need to establish new technical people there. I did describe the issue to Kodak Alaris via a sales representative who is responsible for our region, but unfortunately I never received a response.

Regarding the frame position: in our case the defect is not limited to an optional 37/38th frame. It regularly often appears already within the nominal exposure range, typically around frames 36A / 36B, sometimes even earlier depending on how far the film advances before full take-up tension occurs. That is why we consider it a real quality issue and not simply “extra frame behavior”.

What makes this particularly relevant for us is that the same pattern appears across different Kodak 35mm films (color and black-and-white), different cameras, and completely independent of the development method (hanger, roller transport, rotary, or hand processing). This strongly points away from processing or camera handling and toward a manufacturing or base-related issue, possibly linked to how the film is attached to or tensions against the core during final winding.

Once the workload normalizes, I do intend to pursue proper technical contact and share representative samples. At the moment, however, that has not yet been possible.