Recent APS Film Lessons Learned

[Wes/HikePics]

Since I have been shooting more film lately I had the curious idea to try some APS. I know, I know, everyone go ahead and roll their eyes! But my local lab still does process the film.

Anyway, I picked up a Canon EOS IX body because it can use my Canon AF lens. I looked on Ebay and settled on 3 rolls of Advantix 200. These rolls were not in the original box but clearly had the #1 circle indicated on the cartridge. I put fresh batts in the IX and inserted one of the rolls. The camera started winding the film with the LCD panel showing the film advancing. Then suddenly the film started to rewind, stopped and showed the icon on the panel that the film had completed. I thought this was rather odd so I turned the power off and on again and the same thing happened. I opened and closed the film door and got the same response. I opened the film door and tried to remove the cartridge. PROBLEM!

ALL of the film was still in the camera. After much prying and damage to the cartridge I finally got it out, but all the film is still in the camera. The rewind button won't work without a cartridge in it and the door closed. I have no idea how to get the film out short of breaking the camera apart, and even then I'm uncertain.

The other issue is that I could see the end of the film and it had already been shot and processed!! Being a rather ticked-off person at that time I busted into the other 2 rolls and BOTH were already shot and processed! I knew about the white indicator but failed to learn about the tab indicator. Even so, the white indicator should have been at the #4 position, unless it was tampered with. Right?!

My lessons : (1) Make sure I correctly purchase film and (2) APS cameras never had a "fail safe" mechanism to retrieve stuck film.

I am out $1.75 per APS roll. I might be out $18 for a nice used IX. Anyway, I'm fixing to find out what an IX looks like inside!

 

[Helios 1984]

Last time it happened to me, I've used a flat screwdriver to manually rewind the cartridge. It makes an unpleasant ratcheting noise but it works.
In your case, I'd start by unscrewing the rear cover and work from there. With a bit of luck, maybe there will be an opening from which you can pull the film.

Godspeed.

 

[AgX]

I am puzzled: why did the camera mess it up? Fault at the camera? Fault at the cassette?

 

[John Koehrer]

The negatives were stored in the cartridge after they were processed. The next is a GUESS that when exposed and installed in a camera
the full wind is normal. No rewind? No idea.

 

[Bill Burk]

Some APS cameras load the whole roll in when you load, and retract one shot at a time until the end of the roll.

I couldn't tell what yours is supposed to do (looking at manuals on Butkus). It shouldn't have tried loading if it knew the film were processed. But I hope you can find a way to retrieve that mess of film.

 

[Wes/HikePics]

After about 30 minutes of very careful work I was able to retrieve the film. After I removed the camera back I had to disconnect about 9 ribbons and a wire. With the ribbons taped out of the way 4 screws holding 2 items down were removed. After 4 corner screws were removed I was able to lift up what is essentially the pressure plate and film spool contact roller. I rolled off the film and there was a clicking gear sound coming from a brass gear. I gently blew out the film cavity of any dust and reassembled the camera, powered it on and it "seems fine". Which means I won't be able to know anything until another properly unexposed roll is used.

According to the manual: "If an exposed or processed film cartridge is inserted, the film cartridge icon will blink as a warning" - I couldn't find any information on how the cameras read or what information is read from the cartridge spool metal contacts, but I'm guessing this might be some of it. I also guess that when a roll has been completely shot the indicator shows #3, which is "Fully Exposed But Not Processed". During processing the tab is broken and the indicator shows #4. Wikipedia says "Additionally, a tab on this end of the cartridge indicates that the cartridge has been processed." The Kodak APS Fact Sheet says "An automatic reject device makes it impossible to load exposed or processed film, so there's no risk of accidental double exposure." When a processed roll is unwound at the lab for additional prints, it seems obvious that the cartridge will show "Processed" again when the film is wound back. There is a set of "notches" just under the indicator ring and a small black "finger" that keeps the spool from turning when the light door is closed. Opening the door with a pointed object lets the spool turn freely with a small flat head screwdriver. THIS is how I believe my rolls were tampered with. A roll (Kodak at least) could be fully exposed, rewound back into the cartridge and "made" to look like it was a new roll. And SOLD as new!

The issue of my Canon not "reading" that the roll was fully exposed or processed is concerning. APS cameras, especially SLRs, are very complex. Mine could have gone bad.

If you have read all this...many thanks! I'm just thinking out loud, it might help some one sometime. I feel I have just graduated from APS Film 101.

 

[Helios 1984]

When it happened to me, I was experimenting with a home processed cartridge and I wanted to know if I could trick the camera into thinking that it was a fresh roll. It didn't worked but I think that's because I had not properly repositioned the contact disk on the "unexposed" position.

 

[AgX]

Thank you for giving an explanation to this enigma.

 

[Wes/HikePics]

One last "lesson learned" and I guess this thread can trail off into history.

NEVER PUT A PROCESSED CARTRIDGE IN A CAMERA! Again....this is where that little tab being broken or not is seriously important.

I picked up 4 rolls of Advantix 400 still sealed in a blister pack. The first thing I did was load it into the IX. If the camera's transport was bad I wanted to know. The camera pulled the new roll in without a problem and so far it has been a joy to shoot with so far at 20 frames. I hope to get the film processed/printed this coming week.

It kinda funny, there seems to be an increase in APS film buying activity on Ebay. The cameras aren't selling much but the film is. ??