Rare red dot Leica M4-2?

[Huss]

Leica made a small number of M4-2 cameras with the deliciously gaudy metallic red dot that they used on the M4-P.

Mine has that. Serial #1504101.

Here's the quandary, that serial # supposedly is not meant to have the red dot so this apparently is a 'fake' red dot M4-2.
But when I examine it, it is perfectly placed in the vulcanite - not a recovered camera - which could only have come from the factory. No aftermarket covering is the hard (and eventually brittle) vulcanite that I am aware of.

Leica often had weird production batches which were not meant to be were they were in the serial # order of things, so is this a real red dot M4-2, or a really good repro? Perfect example is trying to determine which are the real black paint M4 cameras. Those serial #s are also all over the place outside the main batches.

Hmm.

 

[faberryman]

Maybe it was sent back to Leica sometime in the 1980s for a new covering and they didn't have any replacement coverings except ones with a red dot.

 

[Huss]

Maybe it was sent back to Leica sometime in the 1980s for a new covering and they didn't have any replacement coverings except ones with a red dot.

I doubt it because the original cover would still have been relatively new. Vulcanite lasts decades before it starts to chip/crumble. The vulcanite on this camera has a small chip by the eyelet and by the base plate.
But who knows?

 

[madNbad]

It could have been a top plate that had been in stock for a couple of years and was used at the beginning of the M4-P run. Or maybe the original owner really liked that big red dot. Another Leica mystery.

 

[awty]

How embarrassing, wonder if you can have it removed.

 

[Huss]

How embarrassing, wonder if you can have it removed.

I'm looking for a way to add more, to have a red Leica polka dot M4-2.

 

[awty]

I usually carry mine in hand with a finger strategically covering the white Leica logo, be too hard to cover both by hand. Guess some duct tape would suffice.
I get a strong urge, when seeing someone with a red dot leica worn with a shoulder strap like a fashion accessory, to jam the camera into their face. Not sure why, not generally a violent person, but something just set me off.

 

[reddesert]

The really rare ones are the ones where the red dot was printed upside down.

 

[OrientPoint]

I have a M4-P with no red dot at all, and no indication it was ever applied. The covering is original. I'm told it's a "rare" dotless example. I'm just glad the dot's not there. Too gaudy for my taste.

 

[Huss]

I get a strong urge, when seeing someone with a red dot leica worn with a shoulder strap like a fashion accessory, to jam the camera into their face. .

it is admirable that you want to help them take pictures.

 

[Huss]

The really rare ones are the ones where the red dot was printed upside down.

Those are for the markets south of the equator.

 

[maddoc2021jp]

What does the seal look like, original?

 

[Don_ih]

Your serial number is 500 after mine. Mine has no red dot. Does that dot line up with where a self-timer might go?

 

[Cholentpot]

All a bunch of knock offs I say

This is the original red dot

Also, if someone has one of these that's dependable I'm open for negotiations. This one's rangefinder is uncalibratable. The screws are stripped out.

 

[Huss]

All a bunch of knock offs I say

This is the original red dot

Also, if someone has one of these that's dependable I'm open for negotiations. This one's rangefinder is uncalibratable. The screws are stripped out.

That masking tape is stunning.

 

[Cholentpot]

That masking tape is stunning.

I was supposed to cover the red dot...

 

[Huss]

Your serial number is 500 after mine. Mine has no red dot. Does that dot line up with where a self-timer might go?

Self timers ended with the M5.

But that is the thing with serial #s, Leica's production runs were (are?) haphazard. Which is why there are OG black paint cameras popping up randomly etc. Even though they 'shouldn't' be black paints w the serial # they have.

 

[Huss]

What does the seal look like, original?

Nope. But not sure what an original seal is meant to mean, apart from the camera never having being serviced. Almost as good as buying a 30 year old car with the original oil filter and oil..

 

[250swb]

I think if you do a Google search you'll find some more M4-2 with the red dot, and given not all red dot M4-2 are on the internet you can be sure there are a lot more around. In the era Leica did a lot of retrofitting parts, and rehearsing new parts. I would guess they were simply using up some old vulcanite and needed a logo to stick in the hole, but then maybe thought the red dot logo was a good look for the upcoming M4-P. The cart did come before the horse, you can find one on a Google search with the serial starting 1503xxx, so before the OP's camera. The Leica M4-2 brochure for Spring 1977 even shows the camera with a red dot.

 

[maddoc2021jp]

Nope. But not sure what an original seal is meant to mean, apart from the camera never having being serviced. Almost as good as buying a 30 year old car with the original oil filter and oil..

It could give a hint if the camera left the factory like this or was later modified by somebody else but I just googled the list of the different wax seals and it looks like Leica stopped using them starting with the M4-2.

 

[John Koehrer]

The original seal with "L" is new factory or factory service. There are some with other letters from non Wetzlar service.