Push process a Neopan 400 to 1600.

[chef_IBK]

Should I have to meter my ligth at 400 then process or set my ligth meter to 1600 asa for the shooting? I use Iflord Pq Uni developer is 1+9 and Ilford Rapid fixer 1+4. Film is 120.My average darkoom teperature is around 21.3°C =70.34°F .Chemicals are just new! Set up with a chair and a white background and a small ligth from top metered at 400 asa 1/15 shutter speed is f 2.8 and at 1600 asa 1/60 shutter f2.8 with a Minolta autometer III F. If I want to set my hassy at f 5.6 and 1/125 for the shot then push it to 1600 that means I have to shoot 2 t-stops lower. Or just set up my f at 5.6 and 125 shutter and then push it to 1600 in dev.
Ciao

 

[Tony Egan]

What are you hoping to achieve? Neopan is quite a contrasty film at 400 already with less shadow detail than most other 400 films I've used. Pushing it to 1600 and overdeveloping will get you very contrasty negs with very little shadow detail. May suit what you are trying to do if it is a very low contrast subject.

Pushing usually means giving the film less light than recommended by the "box speed" and then developing it for a longer time to push the highlights closer to "normal". So yes, it normally means 2-stops lower (2x less time, 2 stops smaller aperture (larger f-stop number) according to a meter set at 400. Or you could change the meter to 1600 ISO and just use those settings if you are metering for "average" incident light. Then again you could bracket down one, two or three stops and use the result that best meets your vision.

 

[chef_IBK]

So basically you mean that 1600 is too much should I just push it to 800 then...yeah cause I could not find any match with the developer and the Neopan film in dev times... so I dont even know how much are the normal dev times ..Still a lil bummed cause is my favourite film ever...!!!

 

[mablo]

My recipe for Neopan 400@1600 is D-76 stock, 24C for 9 minutes. It's quite okay but you loose shadow details.

 

[naugastyle]

Neopan 1600 is one of my favorite films (I don't find it too contrasty at all) and I've heard a few people say that Neopan 400 pushed to 1600 isn't too different from it. I haven't tried it in 35mm since I have plenty of 1600, but am planning to buy some 400 in 120 this weekend to test that theory. Would love another option for high-speed b/w in 120.

 

[Thomas Bertilsson]

Agree with the question Tony Egan is posing. What are you trying to achieve? A certain look? Shooting in low light? What is it about the situation you are photographing in that requires you to underexpose your film by two stops?

That will help in finding a good solution.

 

[pcyco]

hallo

emofin should work very good

 

[chef_IBK]

Hi and thanks for the answers!!! I just wanted to shoot yeah in low ligth and push process it.. And develop with the chemicals I have...But I really could not find any charts even on digitaltruth matching Ilford pq and neopan and any push process dev time...!!! I will just go for 1t stop push then...

 

[naugastyle]

I was really puzzled by your developer in the initial post but ignored it, but now that you mention it again, I'm just curious...isn't that a paper developer? I realize the MDC also gives times for developing film in Dektol but maybe there's a reason there's no published times for Ilford PQ?

 

[naugastyle]

Oh wait, I see it on there. Maybe you can try this to find your pushing times:

http://www.digitaltruth.com/devchart.php?doc=pushproc

 

[Tony Egan]

So basically you mean that 1600 is too much should I just push it to 800 then...yeah cause I could not find any match with the developer and the Neopan film in dev times... so I dont even know how much are the normal dev times ..Still a lil bummed cause is my favourite film ever...!!!

Nothing is ever too much or too little. It just depends on what you are trying to achieve. Seems like you are just "fooling around" with your available film and developer so anything goes! Are you planning to make a print of a particular subject or just curious? If it's curiosity and you have plenty of time to set up the camera why not start at normal exposure and go in a series to 4 stops under and overdevelop by 50%. This will give you a very good sense of how the shadow detail changes and when the highlights start to block up.

Don't worry, make mistakes, have fun!!

 

[Thomas Bertilsson]

When you 'push' process, try to slow down agitation to make your developing time longer. If your developing time is longer, you will get higher shadow density and increase effective film speed. You will, at the same time, by agitating less, control your highlights.

I would try some different exposures and development regimens before you do anything that truly matters.

Hi and thanks for the answers!!! I just wanted to shoot yeah in low ligth and push process it.. And develop with the chemicals I have...But I really could not find any charts even on digitaltruth matching Ilford pq and neopan and any push process dev time...!!! I will just go for 1t stop push then...

 

[Chris Lange]

PQ is a paper developer, I wouldn't push with it, or even develop neopan with it. Get a container of Acufine for like 3 or 4 dollars and follow those times, it will give an increase in speed naturally, and will likely give you better results than PQ or even most other normal developers.

 

[Tom Stanworth]

What are you hoping to achieve? Neopan is quite a contrasty film at 400 already with less shadow detail than most other 400 films I've used. .

My results differ in that I find it delivers about the same speed as TriX and HP5+ and about the same as D400. I did a few side by side tests developed to the same approx contrast and could not see any meaningful difference in shadow detail at the same speed. If anything, I would say Neopan 400 was about a 1/3 stop faster than TrIX. This is in Xtol 1+2 and DDX.

If wanting to shoot at a true 1600, only Delta 3200 (the Kodak I have not tried) will come close with a true speed of about 1200 in DDX or Xtol 1+2. Neopan 1600 is about 2/3 stops faster than the 400 but still well short of 1600. I would not push Neopan 400 to 1600 unless I wanted underexposued shadows falling to black i.e less detail than would be the case were a film rated at its user's EI.

I used Neopan 400 at 250-400, Neopan 1600 at 500-800 and D3200 from 1000-1600.

 

[chef_IBK]

yeah this migth not be the result of this post but I wanted to share with you guys some of the stuff I shot and developed! Aigth both pics are : Ilford Hp4+ 125 120 taken with the Hassy 500 c Carl Zeiss Planar T* 80mm f1:2,8 125 shutter aperture f 4,5 two Metz 45 cl one with diffuser. Developed with Ilford Pq uni for 6,30 min fixed with Ilford rapid fixer for 5 min rinsed for 15 min

http://www.flickr.com/photos/th3ch3f/4197867637/

this one is : same film, same camera, same flashes, shutter 500 and aperture 8 developed for 7 min fixed for 4 min rinsed 15 min

http://www.flickr.com/photos/th3ch3f/4197867843/in/photostream/

need feed back..!!!

 

[2F/2F]

You don't seem to grasp that shutter speed affects exposure, as you think that what you want to do will only underexpose the film by two stops. Basic, basic knowledge here. Reading a beginning photography textbook before shooting a Hasselblad and asking questions on the Internet might be a good idea. Sounds to me like you will be underexposing your film by five stops if you use the shutter speed and aperture that you want to use. Your meter says to use '15@f/2.8, and you want to use '125@f/5.6. In terms of rerating your film (not a helpful way to look at the situation anyhow, IMO), this would mean rating your Neopan 400 at 12,800, not 1,600. If I read what you wrote correctly, you are shooting a still life (a chair on a white background). In this case, why would you need to underexpose your film so much to get a shot? Put the camera on a tripod, and you can use any shutter speed you want, and any film that you want. More basic, basic knowledge.............

 

[chef_IBK]

hey dude try to make those same skate shots on the flickr link just above... then hit me back...

 

[2F/2F]

hey dude try to make those same skate shots on the flickr link just above... then hit me back...

Ah...stacking nonsensical arrogance on top of unintelligible ignorance..always a sure bet for success. WHAT exactly are you saying with your above statement? How about a real response to the technical issues brought up, instead of a statement that means absolutely nothing?

 

[chef_IBK]

ah yeah I forgot I have the hassy since a month!!!

 

[jtzordon]

Some examples of a Neopan 400 push to 1600 in D76 at http://www.flickr.com/photos/jasonthomas/tags/1600/. Definitely losing shadow detail.

 

[Tom Stanworth]

you are pushing the film (either film) too far. If you get 1/15 at 2.8 at EI 400, why not just shoot at 1/4 at 5.6 using a tripod?

If for whatever reason you must shoot hand held, you are wasting your time trying to push a 400 speed film by five stops (two stops to get from f2.8 to f5.6 and then another three to get from 1/15 to 1/125. You wont even get close with Delta 3200 and some microphen/DDX/Xtol.

You need a tripod or strudio lights/flash.

 

[chef_IBK]

I didn´t want to be mean and arrogant sorry, my bad... I just wanted to know if I can Push process neopan 400 with the chemichals I have..that´s all..Actually I have just develop kinda 15 rolls or something! Really at the beginning but so stoked !
@Tom I did not mentioned that I used a tripod but I thougth was assumed...
Hey Tom check this out http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2640/4199531133_5538370e8c_b.jpg
This one taken with a Lubitel 166+ Ilford HP4+ 125 asa expired in 2006 1/250 f8, two Metz 45 cl and two home made softboxes made out of carton-box sticked up with ducktape and cutted a pice of bed sheet I found...Temperature of the Darkroom 22.3°C=72,1°F(that is actually my shit-toilet) developed in Ilford PQ for 6.40 min fixed for 4.40 min with Ilford rapid fixer and rinsed under running water for like 30 minutes. Again in need of feed...
Ciao Chef