Printing on transparency film

[frankg]

No, I think he means to centre and tape a sheet of film on a piece of paper, before running it through the printer. That's what I used to do when I had the 4000. Never have had pizza wheel issues with the P400, unless I was laying down too much ink.

Sorry to be so dense about this. I can't visualize it. See attached image - do you mean something like this - transparency image taped onto a sheet of paper

I'll try to lay down less ink and see if that helps.

Choose Premium Glossy paper instead of Ultra Premium Glossy
And Choose Photo instead of Best Photo

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

Sorry to be so dense about this. I can't visualize it. See attached image - do you mean something like this - transparency image taped onto a sheet of paper

I'll try to lay down less ink and see if that helps.

Choose Premium Glossy paper instead of Ultra Premium Glossy
And Choose Photo instead of Best Photo

Yes, that is correct!

 

[nmp]

Yeah that's it. I apply small pieces of removable tape all around making sure none of them are sticking up - otherwise head strikes will happen. Some transparencies curl up quite a lot on the inkable side (that is another good way of finding the right side to print on) so it is imperative that they are taped sufficiently, also resulting in head strikes as a result otherwise. The backing sheet I use is a RC type smooth paper so the tape comes off easily after printing and same paper can be used over and over again.

Now for the pizza wheels, remove only the ones that would come in contact with the transparency (or the largest image width.) They are easy to take out, but I am not sure how they are to put back - so do it only if you are sure. I suspect your warranty will be voided too if you still have it.

Another way to do without taking out the pizza wheels is use the front feed. For that I use a thicker 4 ply cardboard as carrier instead. The whole pizza wheel assembly disengages in that case so none of them come in contact with the transparency. I used it this way until I started using QTR and found that QTR didn't allow the front feed option.

:Niranjan.

 

[frankg]

Yes, that is correct!

Thanks.
Since you have a P400 printer would you mind sharing your print settings?

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

Thanks.
Since you have a P400 printer would you mind sharing your print settings?

I use QTR driver. It overrides the printer's driver. It's far more superior.

 

[frankg]

I use QTR driver. It overrides the printer's driver. It's far more superior.

Understood.
thanks

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

Sorry I couldn't be more helpful.

 

[frankg]

Col handling=Ps manages col
printer profile=photo paper glossy --> SC- P400 series Ultra Premium Photo Paper Glossy PK


rendering=Perceptual
Bl Pt compensation checked

Print Settings -
Source=Rear fine art --> Sheet
Media= Ultra Premium Photo Paper Glossy
Mode=Black/Greyscale --> (Is this Color?) Color
Output res=Photo (where is this?) In print Quality --> Go with Quality Option 5 with SuperPhoto, Microweave on
HiSpeed & Gloss optimiser=Off
Col Mode=Off

Feed the transparency like a regular sheet. If that gives you a problem you might have to use a carrier/backing sheet (or some other gimmick to fool the printer.) But try the above first. It's too thin to be used in the Rear Fine art mode.

:Niranjan.

Thanks. I fear the Ultra Premium Phot paper Glossy & output res may be laying down too much ink contributing to the 'pizza wheel' marks

 

[frankg]

Sorry I couldn't be more helpful.

 

[koraks]

Since you have a P400 printer would you mind sharing your print settings?

Note that @Andrew O'Neill is referring to digital negatives. You're now printing regular images for your transfer experiments. This means that his earlier comment about e.g. chartthrob is something to file away for the moment you get to printing negatives.

Not that QTR can't be used for regular prints - that's what it's intended for first and foremost. But I don't think you really need it to make decent prints with your printer on transparency materials. This is where Andy's other advice comes in: give the generic screen printing inkjet film a try. It's milky white stuff that's fairly cheap and can be had from (web) shops that specialize in screen printing materials. I've tried this as well as Fixxons and the main difference was that Fixxons was much more expensive. The Fixxons holds a tiny bit more ink, but the difference is so small as to be irrelevant in practice.

PS: Good job fixing much of the print quality issue so far; I agree with the others that the remaining few white dots are the dreaded 'pizza wheels'. I'm quite familiar with them as a fellow Epson user (3880 instead of P400 though). I hope @nmp's trick of using the different paper path works. I know some people go so far as to remove the wheels altogether. I'm not sure I'd recommend that.

 

[frankg]

Yeah that's it. I apply small pieces of removable tape all around making sure none of them are sticking up - otherwise head strikes will happen. Some transparencies curl up quite a lot on the inkable side (that is another good way of finding the right side to print on) so it is imperative that they are taped sufficiently, also resulting in head strikes as a result otherwise. The backing sheet I use is a RC type smooth paper so the tape comes off easily after printing and same paper can be used over and over again.

Now for the pizza wheels, remove only the ones that would come in contact with the transparency (or the largest image width.) They are easy to take out, but I am not sure how they are to put back - so do it only if you are sure. I suspect your warranty will be voided too if you still have it.

Another way to do without taking out the pizza wheels is use the front feed. For that I use a thicker 4 ply cardboard as carrier instead. The whole pizza wheel assembly disengages in that case so none of them come in contact with the transparency. I used it this way until I started using QTR and found that QTR didn't allow the front feed option.

:Niranjan.

Thanks. I’ll try the taping method. Not up for removing the wheels. Not sure how you position the film accurately for the print area on the paper. For example 8.5x11 on 11x17 (or 13x19)
Ive ver used the front feed but I could try that

 

[frankg]

Note that @Andrew O'Neill is referring to digital negatives. You're now printing regular images for your transfer experiments. This means that his earlier comment about e.g. chartthrob is something to file away for the moment you get to printing negatives.

Not that QTR can't be used for regular prints - that's what it's intended for first and foremost. But I don't think you really need it to make decent prints with your printer on transparency materials. This is where Andy's other advice comes in: give the generic screen printing inkjet film a try. It's milky white stuff that's fairly cheap and can be had from (web) shops that specialize in screen printing materials. I've tried this as well as Fixxons and the main difference was that Fixxons was much more expensive. The Fixxons holds a tiny bit more ink, but the difference is so small as to be irrelevant in practice.

PS: Good job fixing much of the print quality issue so far; I agree with the others that the remaining few white dots are the dreaded 'pizza wheels'. I'm quite familiar with them as a fellow Epson user (3880 instead of P400 though). I hope @nmp's trick of using the different paper path works. I know some people go so far as to remove the wheels altogether. I'm not sure I'd recommend that.

Your advice to realign the head was most helpful. Thanks.

 

[nmp]

Thanks. I’ll try the taping method. Not up for removing the wheels. Not sure how you position the film accurately for the print area on the paper. For example 8.5x11 on 11x17 (or 13x19)
Ive ver used the front feed but I could try that

Yeah it will take some trial and error...transparency will have to offset left to right since the wheels are not placed evenly and symmetrically and you will need to compensate the print position as well to reflect that - depending on which wheels you take out. But I too don't recommend it right now unless the problem is egregious. I suspect when you do the transfer, it probably won't matter. As for me I was using some serious ink densities (like 50% or more than standard) so I was getting pizza wheels galore. Even then my preferred way was to use the front feed, but QTR said otherwise. If you are not using QTR and still have unacceptable pizza wheels, that would be the way to go.

I don't recognize some of the terms you are using describe the options in printer driver - not sure if they different for Canadian version. Whatever they are, you should choose the parameters that slow the speed way down to lowest possible so the print has ample time to dry before it comes in contact with the wheels.

:Niranjan.

:Niranjan

 

[frankg]

Yeah it will take some trial and error...transparency will have to offset left to right since the wheels are not placed evenly and symmetrically and you will need to compensate the print position as well to reflect that - depending on which wheels you take out. But I too don't recommend it right now unless the problem is egregious. I suspect when you do the transfer, it probably won't matter. As for me I was using some serious ink densities (like 50% or more than standard) so I was getting pizza wheels galore. Even then my preferred way was to use the front feed, but QTR said otherwise. If you are not using QTR and still have unacceptable pizza wheels, that would be the way to go.

I don't recognize some of the terms you are using describe the options in printer driver - not sure if they different for Canadian version. Whatever they are, you should choose the parameters that slow the speed way down to lowest possible so the print has ample time to dry before it comes in contact with the wheels.

:Niranjan.

:Niranjan

what I don't understand is why and how using a better print quality setting which means more ink laid down, aggravates the pizza wheels. And, I've never noticed them on regular paper prints

 

[koraks]

what I don't understand is why and how using a better print quality setting which means more ink laid down, aggravates the pizza wheels. And, I've never noticed them on regular paper prints

More ink density means that the ink lays in a thicker layer on the medium, making it easier for the pizza wheels to pick it up. It sticks to the pizza wheels better that way. This is exacerbated by the fact that a thicker layer of ink takes more time to dry, so it's more likely to be still wet as the pizza wheels hit the ink. This is also why increasing the pass time (allowing the ink more time to dry) often helps - at least a little.

The problem is more rate with regular paper prints because inkjet paper soaks up the ink much more readily due to its microporous, absorbent structure. As a result, by the time the pizza wheels hit the inked surface, the ink has already precipitated down into the top layer and doesn't stick to the pizza wheels anymore.

 

[frankg]

More ink density means that the ink lays in a thicker layer on the medium, making it easier for the pizza wheels to pick it up. It sticks to the pizza wheels better that way. This is exacerbated by the fact that a thicker layer of ink takes more time to dry, so it's more likely to be still wet as the pizza wheels hit the ink. This is also why increasing the pass time (allowing the ink more time to dry) often helps - at least a little.

The problem is more rate with regular paper prints because inkjet paper soaks up the ink much more readily due to its microporous, absorbent structure. As a result, by the time the pizza wheels hit the inked surface, the ink has already precipitated down into the top layer and doesn't stick to the pizza wheels anymore.

Thanks. Now I get it

 

[MattKing]

As far as positioning is concerned, could you use pre-printed graphing paper as the carrier paper?

 

[frankg]

As far as positioning is concerned, could you use pre-printed graphing paper as the carrier paper?

I’m not qualified to answer but Id think its not thick enough to be a support?

 

[nmp]

As far as positioning is concerned, could you use pre-printed graphing paper as the carrier paper?

Yeah, that's what I did - except I created my own graphing paper by printing a grid on a Epson glossy photo paper. I have marked where I should center the transparency and not forget to add X" (which turns out to be 0.5" in my case) to the left position before sending out the print. What I also like about doing it this way is I can pretty much print any size - even as small as 1" wide and 2" long. That helps if you are using the pricey Pictorico as your substrate.

:Niranjan.

 

[frankg]

Any ideas on how to slow down printing to give ink more time to dry?
I have Hi Speed turned off.

There used to be an option to deselect bi-directional printing but I no longer see it.
I turned on Thick paper option & check paper width

I realize everyones driver settings are different especially if you use Quadtone

Mac OS Ventura 13.6.6, Surecolor P400 driver 12.62

 

[koraks]

especially if you use Quadtone

This does not use the Epson drivers at all, so it's a bit of a different animal to begin with.
The P400 dialog is probably different; on my 3880, it's here:

In Printing Preferences, I clicked "Paper Config" to obtain the dialog to the right, which includes the drying time parameter.

 

[frankg]

Thanks. Very different. Lucky you

 

[nmp]

My P400 Windows driver looks like this:

In the Print Quality > Quality Options, I choose Level 5, Print Quality = SuperPhoto, High Speed = unchecked.

:Niranjan

 

[frankg]

My P400 Windows driver looks like this:


View attachment 370029




In the Print Quality > Quality Options, I choose Level 5, Print Quality = SuperPhoto, High Speed = unchecked.

:Niranjan

Thanks

 

[tnp651]

Ahead of ordering Fixxons or Pictorico (or similar) I am using a locally sourced Grafix Clear Film for Inkjet.
Never having printed on anything but paper I'm new to this & trying to get down some very basic settings to print on clear film; prior to using process specific curves/Luts.

I printed a 21 step wedge & am seeing an awful "pattern" or "texture" plus what may be pizza wheel marks (quick phone photo attached).
Can anyone help identify the problem/s & hopefully suggest a fix.

Ps 2024
Epson P400

Col handling=Ps manages col
printer profile=photo paper glossy
rendering=Perceptual
Bl Pt compensation checked

Print Settings -
Source=Rear fine art
Media= Photo Paper Glossy
Mode=Black/Greyscale
Output res=Photo
HiSpeed & Gloss optimiser=Off
Col Mode=Off

Thank you

Frank, see if you can download Epson Photo+ Tool. It gives greater control over B&W printing. My settings:
Printer Manages Color - Normal Printing
Print Settings > Printer Options > Printer Settings > change Color to Advanced B&W - Finest Detail
Under the Advanced Color Settings tab, choose Color Toning = Neutral, Tone = Darker