Printing black & white with color enlarger

tahoe4x5 · May 13, 2017

I have been doing contact prints and will now be doing enlarger prints in black and white. I just came into a color 4x5 enlarger, Durst Laborator 1000 with a Pavelle 401. I have been using Ilford contrast filters when I contact print. How might I use the contrast filters with this color enlarger? Ideas please. If I'm correct, some people use the color filters of the color enlarger as contrast filters? I would appreciate any input you may have.
Thanks!
Jon

Harry Stevens · May 13, 2017

Look on the multigrade instructions that come with the paper the grades are listed by manufacture for different colour enlargers.
Here's a Ilford example just scroll down (page 3) for grades.
http://www.ilfordphoto.com/Webfiles/2010628932591755.pdf

mshchem · May 13, 2017

I've used combination of M and Y for years, Beseler 45S colorhead. "Darkroom Dave Butcher " has a great youtube video(s) on split printing with Ilford under lens filters.

bdial · May 13, 2017

Every VC paper manufacturer has their own recommendations as to color filtration. For simplicity, I use Ilford's settings for everything.
You may find that the color head won't quite get to the same contrasts as Ilford's 0 and 5 filters. So you may want to keep the filters around for extraordinary situations. But for most negatives the color head will be fine. One advantage is that you effectively get infinite contrast grades since you can add yellow or magenta to get something in between the Ilford defined grades.

tahoe4x5 · May 13, 2017

Harry Stevens said:
Look on the multigrade instructions that come with the paper the grades are listed by manufacture for different colour enlargers.
Here's a Ilford example just scroll down (page 3) for grades.
http://www.ilfordphoto.com/Webfiles/2010628932591755.pdf

Thank you for the input Harry.

tahoe4x5 · May 13, 2017

mshchem said:
I've used combination of M and Y for years, Beseler 45S colorhead. "Darkroom Dave Butcher " has a great youtube video(s) on split printing with Ilford under lens filters.

Thanks for the reference mshchem.

tahoe4x5 · May 13, 2017

bdial said:
Every VC paper manufacturer has their own recommendations as to color filtration. For simplicity, I use Ilford's settings for everything.
You may find that the color head won't quite get to the same contrasts as Ilford's 0 and 5 filters. So you may want to keep the filters around for extraordinary situations. But for most negatives the color head will be fine. One advantage is that you effectively get infinite contrast grades since you can add yellow or magenta to get something in between the Ilford defined grades.

Thanks very much bdial.

Sirius Glass · May 14, 2017

I use a color head for printing black & white without any problems. Just follow the instructions that come with the variable contrast paper.

Patrick Robert James · May 14, 2017

I have always thought that using a color head for printing VC involved too much jerking around with too many knobs. Just use the below the lens Ilford filters. Much simpler.

tahoe4x5 · May 14, 2017

Patrick Robert James said:
I have always thought that using a color head for printing VC involved too much jerking around with too many knobs. Just use the below the lens Ilford filters. Much simpler.

Patrick, sorry for the ignorant response, but how do you attach the filters below the lens? I have the 6x6 filters that I use for contact printing. For that I use a shop lamp, for which I made a filter holder out of mat boards.
I appreciate the help.
Jon

Larry the sailor · May 14, 2017

My Beseler 45 has a "standard" under lens filter holder. I use the filtration built in to the dichro head but I also have the condenser head but have never used it.
There was a laminated "home made" card in with all the assorted stuff that came with the enlarger that listed settings for contrast grades.

Sirius Glass · May 14, 2017

Patrick Robert James said:
I have always thought that using a color head for printing VC involved too much jerking around with too many knobs. Just use the below the lens Ilford filters. Much simpler.

There is no jerking around. The Ilford data sheets provide the filter numbers, however since the filter value is dialed in, intermediate values are also possible.

tahoe4x5 · May 14, 2017

I went out and looked at the "stuff" that came with the enlarger. There is an under lens filter holder. Is there any negative to using the filter under the lens relative to print quality? I will now search for a manual online so I can learn about the general workings.

John Koehrer · May 14, 2017

tahoe4x5 said:
I went out and looked at the "stuff" that came with the enlarger. There is an under lens filter holder. Is there any negative to using the filter under the lens relative to print quality? I will now search for a manual online so I can learn about the general workings.

They're just delicate and don't like rough treatment or fingerprints.

MattKing · May 14, 2017

tahoe4x5 said:
I went out and looked at the "stuff" that came with the enlarger. There is an under lens filter holder. Is there any negative to using the filter under the lens relative to print quality? I will now search for a manual online so I can learn about the general workings.

Filters can fade over time, so you need to make sure your filters are still in good shape.
Under the lens filters are in the light path, so if they get sufficiently scratched or dirty they can impact print quality.
With respect to the "jerking around" observation, it is probably a reference to the potential of jarring or otherwise inducing vibration to the enlarger head when one adjusts the filter settings. That can be a problem if one is using split contrast printing.
My current enlarger has contrast controls in a separate control/timer unit, so there is no problem with it.
My other (currently in storage) Beseler Dichro 67 enlarger has filter controls on the head, so I have to be reasonably careful to rotate them without inducing vibration. It is sufficiently rigid to permit that, partially because of how one adjusts those settings.

afriman · May 14, 2017

Below-the-lens filters are different from the square above-the-lens filters. They are optical grade and shouldn't have any significant impact on image quality.

Neal · May 14, 2017

Dear tahoe4x5,

Free yourself from the shackles of contrast grades! If you need a little more or less contrast, just dial it in.

Good luck,

Neal Wydra

M Carter · May 14, 2017

MattKing said:
...My other (currently in storage) Beseler Dichro 67 enlarger has filter controls on the head, so I have to be reasonably careful to rotate them without inducing vibration. It is sufficiently rigid to permit that, partially because of how one adjusts those settings.

When I used a smaller enlarger (Beseler 67C, single column but a pretty beefy piece of gear considering how relatively compact it was) with the filter slot, I was concerned about split filter printing for 16x20. I made a plywood "box" that screwed to the ceiling joists and clamped to the top of the column (which was maybe 10" lower then my ceiling). The head used to be able to sway a few mm; that made it rock solid. Really recommend some sort of top-level brace when you push your enlarger to its size limits - with that and good alignment, I got some really snappy prints, corner to corner (I also made a DIY glass carrier since the 67 series never offered one). Really amazed at the quality I could get from that thing.

Patrick Robert James · May 14, 2017

Sirius Glass said:
There is no jerking around. The Ilford data sheets provide the filter numbers, however since the filter value is dialed in, intermediate values are also possible.

Like I said, jerking around. Not to mention Ilford filters are speed matched, and your dichro head isn't. More jerking around. And of course your next rebuttal will be that you can dial in neutral density with the cyan filters, but that is still even more jerking around. Just grab a filter and throw it under the lens. Done. No jerking around.

Eric Rose · May 14, 2017

with a condenser enlarger I use ilford filters but if I have a dichro head I use the built in filters. No big deal really as I usually use an analyzer to set exposure.

bdial · May 14, 2017

Patrick Robert James said:
Like I said, jerking around. Not to mention Ilford filters are speed matched, and your dichro head isn't. More jerking around. And of course your next rebuttal will be that you can dial in neutral density with the cyan filters, but that is still even more jerking around. Just grab a filter and throw it under the lens. Done. No jerking around.

If you use Ilford's yellow/magenta combination settings you get the same speed matching you get with the separate filters.
But opinions of what constitutes jerking around vary, to each their own. For me, swapping filters in and out of a file and in and out of a filter drawer or one of the below lens holders amounts to jerking around. A plus on the dichroic color head side is that the filters are permanent and not subject to fading.

But, everyone gravitates to a workflow and gear that suits them, as long as it results in good prints, the mechanics of getting there don't matter.

fdonadio · May 14, 2017

To each his own, I guess.

Try filters under the lens, try a dichroic head, whatever.

Stick with the one you like better.

tahoe4x5 · May 14, 2017

Thanks guys! I appreciate everyone taking the time to provide input. I need to get to know the enlarger. Hope to make the effort this week!

RalphLambrecht · May 15, 2017

tahoe4x5 said:
I have been doing contact prints and will now be doing enlarger prints in black and white. I just came into a color 4x5 enlarger, Durst Laborator 1000 with a Pavelle 401. I have been using Ilford contrast filters when I contact print. How might I use the contrast filters with this color enlarger? Ideas please. If I'm correct, some people use the color filters of the color enlarger as contrast filters? I would appreciate any input you may have.
Thanks!
Jon

That works just fine.the paper instruction leaflet will have filtration values to start with.more yellow will make it softer.more magenta harder.change to taste.

Craig75 · May 15, 2017

Personally i would just use a stepwedge and colourhead to find what grades you can get out of your head and paper combination. Takes 10 minutes and $20 or whatever a stouffer step wedge costs

Printing black & white with color enlarger

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