Positive News from Tetenal

[138S]

Alaris is not in general on sale, only parts may be offered for sale (no real definite / final / official statement about it so far).

What was/is for sale is PPF (paper, photochemicals and film) division, the one it's interesting for us. The whole lot or in pieces:

"In the meantime, the KPP2 trustees have instructed the directors of Kodak Alaris to ‘undertake the exploration of an orderly disposal of the Group or its component businesses…’ according to the Kodak Alaris document."
https://www.insideimaging.com.au/2019/exclusive-kodak-up-for-sale/

We know they sold the component it was easy to sell:

https://petapixel.com/2020/07/13/kodak-paper-and-chemistry-business-sold-to-chinese-company-report/

The (still not sold) jewell of the crown is the exclusive commercialization rights of pictorial Kodak film, a sort of Droit du seigneur over what Kodak manufactures, it mainly consists on an Notarized paper stating that Droit. Mostly the Chinese don't buy that kind of things, they want to manufacture things to the industrial advantage, so it's still for sell, also evident political issues are in the middle...

For the rest, the Alaris erratic behaviour has mostly damaging the photo community, at one point they inflated many prices to show value to potential investors, and taking as much cash possible before divesting. Not nice, some Kodak products are critical for the film flourishment, and when they have "irregular" interests they harm all of us.

Alaris and Tetenal are making big profits because of their pricing policy. (???)

Alaris and Tetenal are very different cases, you know it well. Alaris is pure chaos, a mess resulting from a EK debt to the superannuation UK pension plus, they signed a contract made while thinking that film would not survive much, but they were wrong.

The Tetenal case is quite different, of course, their photo division was in shape but external problems came in. Fortunatelly the brand is recovering, me I'm the first I'm totally happy with that and I (modestly) support them by buying some products, I've always loved Tetenal products, but I totally disagree with their amateur color chem policy because I think it does not promote film flourisment, but the counter.

It is not impossible they take a look at this forum, if it is the case they would have some feedback.


I would ask them to sell again a 5L kit made of two 2.5L kits in the same carton, but with the FD and STAB still in a single 1L bottle to avoid the kit being split in two in the commercialization. The two additional bottles would add some 1€ overcost ex-factory, they would serve customers and they would show a commitment with the community.

Market has changed a lot, chemical photography is no more a need, and not many Pros are there. A Pro would pass the cost increase to their customers, and if having a need you pay. Today market is made of enthusiats, they defend film and they promote it. Industry has to realize that it has to answer to that by also supporting the community because an enthusiast is a very particular kind of customer, you can trust that customer, but don't play dirty with him, because if not all the support you are obtaining from him turns in another thing, a nasty one.

 

[dmtnkl]

It would sound from what Henning said that a third film is perfectly possible without compromises to quality. When you do a third film what have you found in the negatives of that third film that suggests it may not be OK or is it that your cross processing is a "better safe than sorry" approach in case there is a problem?. It might well be worth the risk to find out.

pentaxuser

I have also developed three rolls with very good results. All of them came out looking excellent, but in the third one the film edge codes were a bit more towards orange instead of bright yellow, so i guess i should have compensated my times to account for developer exhaustion.

I have noticed that if i develop two rolls straight away in the same weekend and while my mixed solutions are still fresh, i do not really need to change my timings. Maybe a tiny bit for the color developer but i am still not 100% sure. The slides look brilliant and the edge codes look light yellow. Always using 250ml solutions and inversion agitation with a Cinestill TCS-1000 for temperature control.

The choice of cross processing for the third roll is based on a "better safe than sorry" mentality, because at that point i feel i might need to start adjusting my times to get correct results. And in any case, xpro and ektar gives interesting slides

On a side note, the only real problem i have noticed, even with completely fresh solutions is countless flakes sticking on kodak films. Both Ektachrome and Ektar. It happened twice and i still do not understand why, as Fuji films always came out completely clean. I then started cleaning all solutions with coffee filters and since then i never had this problem again.

 

[Sal Santamaura]

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Dear Sal, I am not writing for the 'undiscovered genuises' here who know all about things they have never done by themselves .
I just hope at least some of my info is helpful for all the other members. Nothing more, nothing less. I've got lots of feedback from members (also via conversations) saying that is the case, and asking me to continue.

Best regards,
Henning

After more than two decades of "fighting the good fight" on photography forums, I've run out of energy to do what you're now doing. May you maintain sufficient fortitude to continue many more years into the future.

Today, unless it's in the Soap Box where matters are critical to our future, I mostly just shake my head and move on. Keep on keepin' on, Henning.

 

[Team ADOX]

As a photo chemical manufacturer ourselves we can only emphasize that some members here are really underestimating the difficulties and challenges of chemistry production.
It is not so easy as some here in this forum think.

Raw chem market experimented a remarkable cost fall, ......... but what is the raw components they have record low prices.

That is not true. We've had significant price increases in lots of raw components over the years. Some very essential substances have even multiplied in the last years. The costs caused by new regulations have also significantly increased. Labor costs as well. And this year the Corona crisis has also created cost increases in some fields.
As a potential sale of the photo chemical business of KA was mentioned here, too: So far there is still some uncertainty about it, because there is no official and final confirmation yet.

ADOX - Innovation in Analog Photography.

 

[138S]

That is not true. We've had significant price increases in lots of raw components over the years. Some very essential substances have even multiplied in the last years. The costs caused by new regulations have also significantly increased. Labor costs as well.

What is that particular expensive chem ? Personally, what I witnessed is a crazy drop in the prices, and easy availability for the bulk chem.

Hydroquinone: $5 for a single 1kg (1 bought 1 kg there, so it's true)

Sodium Carbonate : $0.3 per Kg

Benzotriazole: Under $5 per Kg

Sodium Sulphite: $0.21 per Kg

CD-3 color developer !!!! Under $20 per kg !!!! (dosed 11gr per 1L !!)


Shipping cost from China to EU is around 33€ per 1000kg, so $0.03 per 1kg (https://kfkingfreight.en.made-in-ch...to-Netherlands-Rotterdam-Belgium-Antwerp.html)

 

[Alan9940]

I wish I could get excited by this news, but I sent an inquiry about ordering product from them over a week ago, and no response. Not that no response in the commerce world of today is particularly unusual, but I'm left wondering what the path back is going to be if they don't support their customers. I will wait until Freestyle starts handling Tetenal product, again, and order from them.

 

[pentaxuser]

That's a pity. I do wonder if re-start companies pay enough attention to their potential customers. Their resources may be limited and their concentration is centred on product but it is not enough to have the best mouse trap alone to get the customers. Those potential customers need a welcome and easy path to the companies door

Best example of easy path success is Amazon. It wins by making things competitive certainly but easy of purchase is a big part of it

pentaxuser

 

[Tom Kershaw]

As I've said on previous occasions it would be very helpful if Tetenal made documentation available for their various products and processes so as to make their range more understandable. In general Kodak is good at this; we can at least find the PDFs even if getting hold of a particular product may prove more challenging.

 

[138S]

What is clear is that we the enthusiasts have to support the photo manufacturers. At the same time we of course may complain, to provide them some feedback.

 

[cmacd123]

As I've said on previous occasions it would be very helpful if Tetenal made documentation available for their various products and processes so as to make their range more understandable.

I wonder if it is perhaps available IN GERMAN. since that is the language where they have their business. Translating technical documents is a slow and expensive process.

as they are launching and relaunching products, some of which they will have to reformulate as being technically a new company, they can no longer perhaps fall back on any "Grandfathering" that allowed the sale of preexisting products in spite of new rules.

In general Kodak is good at this; we can at least find the PDFs even if getting hold of a particular product may prove more challenging.

Many of the data files that come from Kodak are "lightly warmed over" versions of data sheets that were prepared ling before the reorganization. Kodak's corporate DNA - right from the founders instructions - was that they would sell more products if the make it easy for the customers to use them After the reorg, you can still find detailed instructions for products that they have discontinued and have no expectation of offering again, Just because the information was written in happier times.

 

[pentaxuser]

I wonder if it is perhaps available IN GERMAN. since that is the language where they have their business. Translating technical documents is a slow and expensive process.

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Well there is the extra cost of printing versions in other than German but given the superb fluency in English in the form of the written word as demonstrated here on Photrio by TEAM Adox I'd have thought that in terms of the actual translation of the sheets into English this wopuld be a relatively minor additional cost in terms of the benefit of penetrating the English speaking markets, especially the U.S.

pentaxuser

 

[CMoore]

I think the real winner here for Tetenal may be the tablets for C41 and E6. I don't do enough C41 to rid my mind of the dangers of wasting a lot of a kit designed for bigger volumes and I may not be the only one in this position. This kind of convenience offered by tablets and the peace of mind they bring has to give Tetenal the edge It will be a unique product in the C41 developer market, especially if the tablets can be used at a range of temperatures avoiding the need for 100 degrees Fahrenheit with almost no deviation

pentaxuser

I saw those tablets mentioned on their website.
That would be a great thing for the occasional user...... i would think.