Photographers Formulary 130 paper developer very dark

[DREW WILEY]

With 130 developer, it's GLYCIN, period. Making a substitution or adding a typo would turn it into something else, and turn the original thread into something else too.

Automated spell check is both a blessing and a curse, depending - mostly a curse.

 

[GregY]

There are a few B&W formulas that call for Glycine. I hope they didn't mean Glycin -- and vice versa

but the chemical in Photo Formulary 130 is glycin ....... no "e"

 

[Michel Hardy-Vallée]

Returning to the OP, the issue is whether the darker colour is a problem. In my experience, I would say no. I use 130 a lot, and it evaporates earlier than it goes bad.

The darkest I've seen 130 is when I let it sitting in trays for a couple of days (it was the pandemic and things were hectic, so this was a bad solution to a minor problem). It still worked, but it stained the paper base so I threw it away.

If you want to learn more about your developer, it could be worth buying a step wedge and use it for monitoring its activity. You'll see very quickly whether your contrast or your densities change between developer batches and/or over its lifetime.

 

[eli griggs]

One of the things I like about "Glycin" in Ansco 130 is that, once mixed, it'll last for years.

 

[xkaes]

Is that why some people like it?

 

[eli griggs]

I'll say that's a big part of it, second in importance only to the beautiful deep blacks it makes, which are second only to Amidol.

At least for me!

 

[arnie k]

I heard back from PF.

The prior suppliers of p-aminophenol, 1 of the chemicals we use in making Glycin, no longer manufactures it.
We have gotten our last supply from manufacturer in India. It comes to us a very different color than our prior supplies.
This color difference is passed onto our Glycin product.
The chemical structure of p-aminophenol is the same and works just like prior batches, but the current manufacturer uses different chemicals than what was used in the product made here in the states.
The market has changed so much over last few years, there is an issue of different manufacturers producing the same chemicals and reactions but with different appearances. The Metol and Hydroquinone are also different in appearance as it all changed when Kodak changed its supplies of Photo chemicals.

As I noted my developer is very dark brown so I may try it but will most likely toss it. PF also noted that they may replace the batch and asked where I bought it, B&H, I have not heard back on that but it is only a $30 problem so I am not going to lose sleep over it, but I appreciate the gesture.

 

[DREW WILEY]

This will need to be monitored. I remember when some Chinese amidol got into photographic distribution, including at PF, and it was contaminated with something, possibly nickel, which made it miserable to work with. I have a pretty good reserve of still white PF glycin powder in the freezer. But if there has been a resourcing of certain needed ingredients, let's hope the glycin really does function the same.

 

[eli griggs]

This will need to be monitored. I remember when some Chinese amidol got into photographic distribution, including at PF, and it was contaminated with something, possibly nickel, which made it miserable to work with. I have a pretty good reserve of still white PF glycin powder in the freezer. But if there has been a resourcing of certain needed ingredients, let's hope the glycin really does function the same.

Amen!

 

[Mike Lopez]

This will need to be monitored. I remember when some Chinese amidol got into photographic distribution, including at PF, and it was contaminated with something, possibly nickel, which made it miserable to work with.

I still have nearly a pound of that garbage in my basement. It'll never get used again. (It came from PF).

 

[DREW WILEY]

I forgot where I put my jar of it. But I soon thereafter acquired a pound of the excellent Euro amidol from Artcraft in NYC.

 

[juan]

I have a huge supply of the Chinese stuff, too. I found that washing the print in a big tub with an underwater aquarium pump to keep the print and water in motion eventually removes the yellow stain. PITA.

 

[DREW WILEY]

It's was hard to see the image developing in the tray due to all that orange; and it took an awfully long time to wash the stain out. Things like this are happening in the pharmaceutical trade too. The medicinal ingredient in a new generic pill might be the same, but the allegedly inert fillers can differ, leading to many incidents of certain people being allergic to those, or having unforeseen interactive side effects.

My hunch is that the generic amidol was being batched up in a big metal vat that wasn't chemically inert. Since amidol also has potential medical applications, this kind of carelessness could cause real harm if the product wasn't analytically tested for purity first. Whether nickel residue was actually detected or not by someone I can't say; but that was the rumor.

 

[john_s]

I heard back from PF.

The prior suppliers of p-aminophenol, 1 of the chemicals we use in making Glycin, no longer manufactures it.
We have gotten our last supply from manufacturer in India. It comes to us a very different color than our prior supplies.
This color difference is passed onto our Glycin product.
The chemical structure of p-aminophenol is the same and works just like prior batches, but the current manufacturer uses different chemicals than what was used in the product made here in the states.
The market has changed so much over last few years, there is an issue of different manufacturers producing the same chemicals and reactions but with different appearances. The Metol and Hydroquinone are also different in appearance as it all changed when Kodak changed its supplies of Photo chemicals.

As I noted my developer is very dark brown so I may try it but will most likely toss it. PF also noted that they may replace the batch and asked where I bought it, B&H, I have not heard back on that but it is only a $30 problem so I am not going to lose sleep over it, but I appreciate the gesture.

p-aminophenol powder goes brown quickly which I think is why the formulas for Rodinal use a different compound of it. I had a jar of p-aminophenol from Merck which was almost white at first but after a while became brown then worse. So maybe PF's supply of it is just old or badly stored? Being a simple compound i thought it would not be hard to source, but maybe that's not the case.

 

[David R Williams]

As a quick update to this thread:

I ordered a 4l package of PF 130 from B&H a few weeks ago which I had a similar problem as the OP. The packaged (and well sealed) Glycin powder was about the colour of milk chocolate, and after mixing, the resulting solution was pretty much the colour of coke/pepsi.

It didn't develop particularly well, and B&H has since refunded the purchase price.

Trying again, I ordered a 100g bottle of Formulary's Glycin from B&H - it arrived this afternoon and is a very light tan colour, so I'm hoping tonight's mixing session will be more successful.

...and the extra goes into the freezer for future use, and maybe to try a batch of TFX-2 film developer (which "the Cookbooks" indicate is basically FX-2 without the Pinacryptol Yellow).

 

[GregY]

As a quick update to this thread:

I ordered a 4l package of PF 130 from B&H a few weeks ago which I had a similar problem as the OP. The packaged (and well sealed) Glycin powder was about the colour of milk chocolate, and after mixing, the resulting solution was pretty much the colour of coke/pepsi.

It didn't develop particularly well, and B&H has since refunded the purchase price.

Trying again, I ordered a 100g bottle of Formulary's Glycin from B&H - it arrived this afternoon and is a very light tan colour, so I'm hoping tonight's mixing session will be more successful.

...and the extra goes into the freezer for future use, and maybe to try a batch of TFX-2 film developer (which "the Cookbooks" indicate is basically FX-2 without the Pinacryptol Yellow).

That should do the trick!

 

[Alex Benjamin]

As a quick update to this thread:

I ordered a 4l package of PF 130 from B&H a few weeks ago which I had a similar problem as the OP. The packaged (and well sealed) Glycin powder was about the colour of milk chocolate, and after mixing, the resulting solution was pretty much the colour of coke/pepsi.

It didn't develop particularly well, and B&H has since refunded the purchase price.

Trying again, I ordered a 100g bottle of Formulary's Glycin from B&H - it arrived this afternoon and is a very light tan colour, so I'm hoping tonight's mixing session will be more successful.

...and the extra goes into the freezer for future use, and maybe to try a batch of TFX-2 film developer (which "the Cookbooks" indicate is basically FX-2 without the Pinacryptol Yellow).

I shared your post at the end of this thread:

Ansco 130 user experience, questions, comments, appreciation...

Following comments by @chuckroast and @GregY in another thread, I thought I'd be nice to start a thread solely devoted to this interesting developer. Since I brew my own, I'll start by posting the formula: Normal use is 1+1.

www.photrio.com

 

[David R Williams]

I shared your post at the end of this thread:

Ansco 130 user experience, questions, comments, appreciation...

Following comments by @chuckroast and @GregY in another thread, I thought I'd be nice to start a thread solely devoted to this interesting developer. Since I brew my own, I'll start by posting the formula: Normal use is 1+1.

www.photrio.com

Thanks Alex!

 

[David R Williams]

As a quick update to this thread:

I ordered a 4l package of PF 130 from B&H a few weeks ago which I had a similar problem as the OP. The packaged (and well sealed) Glycin powder was about the colour of milk chocolate, and after mixing, the resulting solution was pretty much the colour of coke/pepsi.

It didn't develop particularly well, and B&H has since refunded the purchase price.

Trying again, I ordered a 100g bottle of Formulary's Glycin from B&H - it arrived this afternoon and is a very light tan colour, so I'm hoping tonight's mixing session will be more successful.

...and the extra goes into the freezer for future use, and maybe to try a batch of TFX-2 film developer (which "the Cookbooks" indicate is basically FX-2 without the Pinacryptol Yellow).

Houston, we have d-max!

The Glycin (and the 130) are working beautifully.

 

[Saganich]

One of the things I like about "Glycin" in Ansco 130 is that, once mixed, it'll last for years.

Yea, last a long time and it's easy to tell when your exhausting it. It turns very dark soon after using, i think regardless of the age of the glycin used. When I was printing vry large I would mix up like 10 gallons and print to exhaustion over several weeks. Then the leftover would sit for 6 or 9 months and so I would use it up on small prints and tests rather than drain it and was surprised how well it kept and how awful it looked.

 

[DREW WILEY]

I never ever mix up more than I need for a single session. It's so simple to do, anyway. Why gamble, when paper is getting so damn expensive? Sure, it keeps rather well in a full glass bottle - but using the same solution over and over again? Not for me.