Suggestion: find a good lover ( woman in my case), or let one find you.
.... Suggestion: find a good lover ( woman in my case), or let one find you.
Last time I did that, my photographic productivity plummeted...
She's by my side now.
I'm just throwing this out here to see if others feel this way, too.
When I was young (and dinosaurs roamed the earth) this whole "interweb" thing did not exist. We had great photo magazines like the British Journal of Photography, Modern Photography and Popular Photography. And we had "gurus" that wrote monthly columns; folks like David Vestal and Cora Wright Kennedy, etc.
These folks and many others wrote monthly columns mostly detailing their own adventures in the darkroom. There were other mags and other writers but I noticed a trend, more and more folks writing to ask, not for advice, but rather for validation for whatever hair-brained half-cocked exposure or processing notion they had already conceived. If the columnist, based on "lo their many years doing something the right way" told the newcomer it won't work, the newbie would start an argument. Later in my timeline the columnists started suggesting an experimental method the newcomer could use to test his idea in the laboratory/darkroom and would again get ignored.
It seems to have got worse as things progressed (especially after Al Gore invented the Internet). Not so much on this forum which is well moderated and screwed down (in a good way) but groups on less moderated forums. It's been a downhill slide progressing from BBS's, Newsgroups, Chat rooms, Yahoo groups and now Facebook. And all the replies on such forums have equal weight, with only a casual read you never know if the responder is a 21st. Century version of Ansel Adams, Geoff Crawley, etc. or some "fauxtographer" that got a film camera just this week, loves shooting "redscale", Chardonnay (some of them process their film in wine) and long walks in the moonlight. And these folks are quite willing to squirt Canon AE-1's full of WD40, take apart Compur shutters for CLA's, and fix their own cameras.
I don't consider myself an expert but I've done a photographic thing or two in 50 years taking pictures and 40+ years developing my own stuff, I have a huge reference library which includes some heavy hitters which I won't bother to list here. I can do computers, math, and chemistry. And I can make Internet search engines "sing"; I did it for a living when I did computer tech support. So if someone asks and I don't know the answer I can refer them to someone or some published work that really knows how to do these things.
I guess what I'm saying is that these NOOBS aren't asking for advice, are not seeking the right way to do things, they are just bragging about their way of doing it and seeking validation. What's your take? I don't really know how to parse this as a poll, but if someone else would create one, I'll participate.
Look into Match.com.
This is a very old thread and seems to have wandered off course. So let me see if I can give it a bit of a steer. My observations are not about noobs in general, we were all noobs once upon a time, and I still learn a thing or two from this board and other forums every week. My point was more along the idea that some folks found this forum without knowing how to use Google and Google actually powers the Photrio search engine, so it would be great if you searched existing threads before posting. And secondly there is a subset of novice darkroom types that read something here and something there and borrowed a little bit from what Joe said and have somehow created a process that they are sure works and then post something along the line of "I have never done this before but this is the way I plan to do it by golly, what do you think, and please don't be negative." As I said , not really seeking advice just validation.
Noob aka Newb is short for Newbie - as in someone who is brand new to a particular activity.Well - that are fine conclusions we may hear from you - meanwhile. Best wishes.
PS : Somewhere in the future I may have a look what the meaning of "noobs" aktualy is. I realy can't imagine but it seams to be something about to be new in the neighborhood of photographers a.s.o.
Well - that are fine conclusions we may hear from you - meanwhile. Best wishes.
PS : Somewhere in the future I may have a look what the meaning of "noobs" aktualy is. I realy can't imagine but it seams to be something about to be new in the neighborhood of photographers a.s.o.
I think your complaint, as I understand it, doesn’t relate so much to photography as the human condition. Validation is human nature. No one likes being told they’re wrong. People naturally confuse belief with knowledge. Plus there’s the famous Dunning-Kruger effect. The more you learn, the less you know.This is a very old thread and seems to have wandered off course. So let me see if I can give it a bit of a steer. My observations are not about noobs in general, we were all noobs once upon a time, and I still learn a thing or two from this board and other forums every week. My point was more along the idea that some folks found this forum without knowing how to use Google and Google actually powers the Photrio search engine, so it would be great if you searched existing threads before posting. And secondly there is a subset of novice darkroom types that read something here and something there and borrowed a little bit from what Joe said and have somehow created a process that they are sure works and then post something along the line of "I have never done this before but this is the way I plan to do it by golly, what do you think, and please don't be negative." As I said , not really seeking advice just validation.
"... how do you make chemical photography in a wet darkroom resonant to someone younger than The Internet itself? It's a collision of two media that have little in common, so there's going to be a big mess made while the relationship is figured out."
Would we want to make 36hp VW bugs or or 45rpm records or trapdoor woolen underwear "resonant to someone younger than..." ?
Seems like most Photrio contributors are old folks (film era) like me. The "noobs" are probably mostly elsewhere, especially the film makers.
What an ugly thing to say, I am merely saying that if they have already decided on a course of action contrary to the ways that not me but Kodak, Ilford, Agfa, Foma, etc. etc. etc. etc. say will work why post for validation? What is the point in someone just getting started, posting something along those line. No photos, no results, just "this is the way I am doing it".Why are you raising a big middle finger to the next generation of photographers, telling them that if they don't use your preferred media the way YOU want them to, then they can go piss off and die? If you want your film, paper and chemicals to still be around in your lifetime, you better damn well hope they become resonant to the under-30 crowd or they'll just stop being made and become unavailable at any price.
Actually, I think it is the other way around. I have only so many years left as an active photographer. So my interest in film availability is relatively short term. It is the younger folks who ought to be worried about the long term availability of film. They had best not rely on the older generation of photographers to continue shooting film to sustain the industry. And it's fine if film resonates with the under 30 crowd; if not, that's fine too. Things change. Why all the drama?If you want your film, paper and chemicals to still be around in your lifetime, you better damn well hope they become resonant to the under-30 crowd or they'll just stop being made and become unavailable at any price.
This is a very old thread and seems to have wandered off course. So let me see if I can give it a bit of a steer. My observations are not about noobs in general, we were all noobs once upon a time, and I still learn a thing or two from this board and other forums every week. My point was more along the idea that some folks found this forum without knowing how to use Google and Google actually powers the Photrio search engine, so it would be great if you searched existing threads before posting. And secondly there is a subset of novice darkroom types that read something here and something there and borrowed a little bit from what Joe said and have somehow created a process that they are sure works and then post something along the line of "I have never done this before but this is the way I plan to do it by golly, what do you think, and please don't be negative." As I said , not really seeking advice just validation.
And I like to think we are sitting in for David Vestal... I know I don’t have the wealth of knowledge he had. But collectively we come close.
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