Photograms

[mesh]

Apologies if this is in the wrong forum. My son and I were having fun with our first attempt at Photograms yesterday (I have become pretty proficient developing my negs, but this is my first step towards actually printing - so very much a beginner).

Every time I put the paper into the developer I got 'the image' for about 5 seconds and then paper kept going totally black... too long exposure or fogged paper I thought. But I tried a one second exposure with my light and other paper with same results.

I finally got one to work with a split second 'flash' of light and dev for about 10 seconds! Then a minute stop and a minute fixer. I am using Ilford RC grade 3 paper, Bromophen dev, Ilfostop and Hypam fixer. Safe light is Ilford 902 and a totally dark bathroom (taped up everything!) Dev is 1:3 from stock.

Is there anything stupid I am doing?

Thank you very much.

 

[MattKing]

My guess is that your light source is too bright.

Try something with much lower intensity - a diffused night light or small flashlight might work.

In my case, I would use an enlarger as the light source, but I'm assuming you don't as yet have one.

If you do, and you are using it as your light source, stop the lens way down.

 

[mesh]

Thanks - I didn't think of that. Just assumed a safe light was always safe ;-) I might have a globe with too high wattage perhaps? Thank you.

edit: sorry - you meant for exposure. Silly me.

 

[mesh]

One more thing please - I assume a normal dev would be about a minute? Would that be a good starting point? Thanks.

 

[Kevin Caulfield]

Yes, a normal dev would be around one minute. Anything from about 45 s up to 1.5 mins.

 

[mesh]

Thanks Kevin.

 

[Rick A]

When I teach kids, we start with photograms. Raise the enlarger head to expose for 8x10, stop the lens down to f8 or f11, and expose for a time that will give pure black in about 60 to 90 seconds in the developer. I like to teach the rascals that developing times under 60 seconds could cause uneven development and possibly some streaking.

 

[jvo]

met someone last week... photograms

i always did photograms using the enlarger - then develop and fix the paper as usual...

i met someone last week who takes the photo paper outdoors and exposes it for 3 or four HOURS, then puts it in water bath for a minute, then fix (no developer) and wash! she put the paper emulsion side up, then put objects on the paper, then a piece of glass on top- comes back 3-4 hours later. the resultant image sometimes look like they've been toned, other times less frequently like a bw photogram.

very unusual.

 

[pentaxuser]

i always did photograms using the enlarger - then develop and fix the paper as usual...

i met someone last week who takes the photo paper outdoors and exposes it for 3 or four HOURS, then puts it in water bath for a minute, then fix (no developer) and wash! she put the paper emulsion side up, then put objects on the paper, then a piece of glass on top- comes back 3-4 hours later. the resultant image sometimes look like they've been toned, other times less frequently like a bw photogram.

very unusual.

Interesting. So the objects on the print look as if they have been toned? Does this mean that the area inside the outline of the object is a kind of sepia instead of white as you'd expect? What colour is the area outside the objects' outline? Normally it would be pure black. Given that any paper exposed to white light will normally go black in dev and is only fit for the bin, what you have described suggests that such spoiled paper might be kept for photograms in sunlight with a water wash or in theory could exposed to a projected negative in an enlarger then "developed" in water and fixed and might not just be a black piece of paper?

I wonder what sunlight and water does that developes the picture?

Thanks

pentaxuser

 

[removed account4]

i always did photograms using the enlarger - then develop and fix the paper as usual...

i met someone last week who takes the photo paper outdoors and exposes it for 3 or four HOURS, then puts it in water bath for a minute, then fix (no developer) and wash! she put the paper emulsion side up, then put objects on the paper, then a piece of glass on top- comes back 3-4 hours later. the resultant image sometimes look like they've been toned, other times less frequently like a bw photogram.

very unusual.

bsdunek has a series of lumen prints in his gallery
that are as you describe.

they are pretty amazing !
(there was a url link here which no longer exists)

john