Paterson Major Print Washer - Is there still an issue with 12 x 16 paper?

[hoffy]

Hey Folks,

I am thinking of getting my hands on a new Paterson Major Print washer, but I found this thread from 2011:

https://www.photrio.com/forum/threa...sed-papers-is-really-for-12x6in-papers.73435/

TL;DR, the 12x16 print washer won't take Fibre papers of that size, due to the paper swelling and expanding

As I am currently printing 12x16 fibre paper, this is of concern.

Has anyone bought one recently? Does the issue still exist? I might still get one, but I just want to make sure that I know what I am buying.

Cheers.

 

[tezzasmall]

I just went and measured my second hand Paterson FB print washer that I've had for a while, and it turns out mine is a 'mini' model and only takes prints up to 12" x 10". Until now I never knew that there were two different models!?! Great washer though.

Another confusing thing on the Paterson website is info for it's enlarging lens and universal enlarger. The info for the enlarger quotes a 'universal' 39 mm thread but the Paterson lenses available for them are quoted as a 42mm thread BUT it states that they fit the enlarger?!?!?

http://www.patersonphotographic.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/paterson-darkroom-brochure.pdf

Great products Paterson (I have loads!) but you need to get someone to proof read and double check your design sizes it seems!

Terry S

 

[Stephen Prunier]

I just went and measured my second hand Paterson FB print washer that I've had for a while, and it turns out mine is a 'mini' model and only takes prints up to 12" x 10". Until now I never knew that there were two different models!?! Great washer though.

Another confusing thing on the Paterson website is info for it's enlarging lens and universal enlarger. The info for the enlarger quotes a 'universal' 39 mm thread but the Paterson lenses available for them are quoted as a 42mm thread BUT it states that they fit the enlarger?!?!?

http://www.patersonphotographic.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/paterson-darkroom-brochure.pdf

Great products Paterson (I have loads!) but you need to get someone to proof read and double check your design sizes it seems!

Terry S

Thanks for posting the link for the Paterson brochure. I'd like to know more about 12' x 16" model too.

 

[Maris]

I have and use a Paterson Major Print Washer in my darkroom. It is possible to shove 12"x16" paper into it but not if the paper is straight. It needs several bends to effectively shorten it. In other words the washer is not truly 12"x16" capable and the mis-description has been part of the Paterson literature for decades. I trim 12x16 down to 12x15 to avoid hassles when loading and unloading this washer.

 

[hoffy]

I have and use a Paterson Major Print Washer in my darkroom. It is possible to shove 12"x16" paper into it but not if the paper is straight. It needs several bends to effectively shorten it. In other words the washer is not truly 12"x16" capable and the mis-description has been part of the Paterson literature for decades. I trim 12x16 down to 12x15 to avoid hassles when loading and unloading this washer.

That is what I expected. I'm Just curious to know whether they have rectified the situation......

Do you need to trim a full inch off? I was thinking of printing @ 12x15 anyway (as it suits the 4x5 ratio better), but would like to leave a little bit of a margin on the end for testing.

Cheers for your reply.

 

[NJH]

Makes a lot of sense that, print 11x14 onto paper trimmed to 12x15. Its what I will be doing.

I have this washer but haven't been able to use it yet due to its requirement for water at a certain pressure (basically lack of old fashioned taps in our house, its a long story).

 

[Maris]

That is what I expected. I'm Just curious to know whether they have rectified the situation......

Do you need to trim a full inch off? I was thinking of printing @ 12x15 anyway (as it suits the 4x5 ratio better), but would like to leave a little bit of a margin on the end for testing.

Cheers for your reply.

Paterson haven't rectified anything. I just measured the Paterson Major Print Washer basket and it is, to my eye, exactly 16 inches or 40.6cm between its end stops. But 12"x16" fibre base photographic paper is only 16" long when it is new in the box. When it is wet processed it stretches in the machine direction by some millimetres and (annoyingly!) just won't slide into the print washer basket. Forcing it in and dragging it out causes edge damage to the paper which will have to be trimmed if neat white borders are required. Even 16" resin coat paper, which does not swell when wet is fiddly to insert into the print washer basket. There is no leeway, not even a millimetre, to help get that floppy wet sheet of photographic paper into the washer.

I trim an inch off 12"x16" photographic paper to ease all those hassles. The off-cut makes a useful test strip.

 

[Marco Gilardetti]

As unbelievable as it seems, the Paterson Major Print Washer is not apt to process the paper size it was "engineered" for, and for which it is sold (at a very high price). I also had to carry a very cumbersome and expensive rotary trimmer inside the darkroom to trim the paper in the dark, which is annoying to say the least. Forget also about the automatic agitator: it gets constantly stuck, whatever the water flow. The draining cap/pipe combo also never works, no matter what you do. Worst of all I have written to Paterson's customer service to complain about all these defects, and they didn't even care to answer.

 

[lantau]

I recently bought the Major Print Washer. I used it for the first time now. The agitator works just fine in my case. I had a little trouble getting the drainage to work. I don't have a sink available, only a tap and a drain in the floor. That is why I really needed that washer. So I attached 3m of clear tubing to the drain. It's not as flexible as the short rubber hose that came with it. I finally managed to arrange the tubing such that I got a proper drainage flow. Before I must have had some air bubble effect which I cannot explain. The washer simply overflowed.

The one design flaw is the rubber plug that make the drain into a siphon for emptying the washer. It is a little too long. And because it is hollow the compression will warp the shape of the plug. It will not close the opening airthight and the siphon isn't working. You'll have to use some adhesive tape to close it effectively. I'm thinking about filling the inside of the plug with silicone sealant. Maybe that will help.

I haven't used 30x40 paper yet. I have one pack of RC paper in that size waiting for its first use. I quote the Foto Impex product description:

Warning: The 30x40 cm washer is cut exactly to 30,5x40x5 cm. Some papers, however, are cut slightly larger. Soaking wet fiber paper tends to swell to a size of around 40,7 cm. When this happens, the sheets don't fit cleanly into the washer. If you find that you are having this problem, you'll need to trim your paper a few centimeters before exposing and processing it.​

Sounds to me like I may have to cut off 5mm at worst. I'm using a rotary cutter in my darkroom all the time, hence no big deal.

 

[hoffy]

OK, a couple of things to understand.

A print washer for fibre paper doesn't need a high water flow. High water flow does nothing but waste water. Fibre prints are more effectively washed by letting the chemicals diffuse out of the paper, which is more effectively achieved using a slow steady flow and agitation (granted, after a 5 or 10 minute wash in a try WITH high flow, to get the bulk of the chemicals off of the surface). There are some excellent write ups about washing fibre prints, so if you are not familiar with the process, do some searching (my current process flow, is 5 minute tray wash with regular water dumps, followed by a 10 minute soak in a Sodium Sulphite solution, and then a soaking wash in a try while siphoning the water out, for around an hour).

This is unlike Resin coated paper, which benefits from a quick, high flow wash

As for the operation of the washer. I already have the standard version of the Paterson at home, so I am aware of the principle. As long as there is flow and as long as there is agitation, then there should be no concern. My major issue was with paper size, which has been confirmed. As long as I know what to do from the outset, I am happy to deal with it.

Looks like I might get my hands on one. My darling wife said she would buy it for me, so that's always a win!

Cheers