Paper Developer

CMoore · Sep 9, 2017

I doubt i will ever do much with Single Grade FB paper.
I pretty much stick with Ilford, Pearl, VC.
I have been using Liquidol from PF. As far as i know it works fine.
But i am wondering about the 5 Liter Bottles from Ilford.
Do any of you guys have much experience with Using/Trying both the Ilford
PQ Universal
and
Multigrade
formulas with RC Pearl Paper.?
Is there any big advantage of using one over the other.?
Thank You

Svenedin · Sep 9, 2017

I would worry about keeping 5 litres of concentrate for a significant length of time. I sometimes use Bromophen -it's cheap (a powder) but like Xtol film dev you have to be able to store 5 litres with minimal air (division into smaller bottles).

Alan9940 · Sep 9, 2017

IMO 5L is a lot of developer to store, unless you do a lot of printing or print very large prints. I mix my own D-72 (neutral tone), ID-78 (warm tone), or Amidol which keeps everything nice and fresh, and I can mix only what I need.

tedr1 · Sep 9, 2017

I use the Ilford MG dev that I buy in smaller (1L?) sizes

MattKing · Sep 9, 2017

Liquidol was co-designed by PHOTRIO's Photo Engineer (Ron Mowrey} so if you use it, you can say you sort of know its designer .
You could always buy a larger quantity.
With most developers, you generally only buy larger quantities if you are planning to do lots and lots of pints.

CMoore · Sep 9, 2017

Ah...OK.
I would assume then that i would be smarter to order a few of the One Liter bottles.....maybe 2 or 3 and then i am only opening One bottle at a time,
And one liter is a more reasonable amount to use up for a simple hobbyist. I do not suppose that having a one liter bottle open for a month or two should be a big deal.?
Thanks Again

Svenedin · Sep 10, 2017

A month or 2 should be OK but it depends how you store it. High temperatures will kill it faster. If you can buy 5 litres much more cheaply than 5 x 1 litre you could split into 1 litre bottles. It is mainly contact with air that degrades the dev. The concentrate lasts quite well but the diluted working solution has a short life especially in open trays. I found Ilford MG dev would last about 24 hours in an open tray as a working solution. I wasted so much that I moved to a slot processor which is far better for keeping diluted chemicals going. I have also found that Tetenal Eukobrom lasts better than MGIV once diluted but that's just my personal experience.

RalphLambrecht · Sep 10, 2017

CMoore said:
Ah...OK.
I would assume then that i would be smarter to order a few of the One Liter bottles.....maybe 2 or 3 and then i am only opening One bottle at a time,
And one liter is a more reasonable amount to use up for a simple hobbyist. I do not suppose that having a one liter bottle open for a month or two should be a big deal.?
Thanks Again

consider mixing your own D72 from bulk chemicals and avoid a lot of the problems above.That way, You always have fresh processing solutions.

tezzasmall · Sep 10, 2017

I buy 5L bottles of the developer and then divide them up into good thick plastic 1L bottles, topping them off with a good squirt from the cans of gas that you can buy to keep the oxygen out.

5L costs about the same as 3 x 1L bottles, so basically I am getting 2L free!!!

My last bottle was bought a few years ago,along with 5L of fix, which is decanted exactly the same way.

These chemicals are then diluted and used in a Nova slot processor. To date, both chemicals are still clear in the bottles left that I am using. I'm surprised not to hear of not many others doing the same.

Terry S

Svenedin · Sep 10, 2017

tezzasmall said:
I buy 5L bottles of the developer and then divide them up into good thick plastic 1L bottles, topping them off with a good squirt from the cans of gas that you can buy to keep the oxygen out.

5L costs about the same as 3 x 1L bottles, so basically I am getting 2L free!!!

My last bottle was bought a few years ago,along with 5L of fix, which is decanted exactly the same way.

These chemicals are then diluted and used in a Nova slot processor. To date, both chemicals are still clear in the bottles left that I am using. I'm surprised not to hear of not many others doing the same.

Terry S

Sounds a good system!

CMoore · Sep 10, 2017

tezzasmall said:
I buy 5L bottles of the developer and then divide them up into good thick plastic 1L bottles, topping them off with a good squirt from the cans of gas that you can buy to keep the oxygen out.
Terry S

Could you explain how that works exactly.....what gas it is, where you buy it, what type of Container/Delivery is used for the gas, etc etc
Thank You

darkroommike · Sep 10, 2017

CMoore said:
Ah...OK.
I would assume then that i would be smarter to order a few of the One Liter bottles.....maybe 2 or 3 and then i am only opening One bottle at a time,
And one liter is a more reasonable amount to use up for a simple hobbyist. I do not suppose that having a one liter bottle open for a month or two should be a big deal.?
Thanks Again

I would buy a 5L if there was a substantial savings and then divide it into brown glass bottles with cone type seals on the lids, full up (but leave a little headspace), there's no need for gas or any of that other rubbish. But it would have to be a substantial savings. Else just make D-72, etc.

Svenedin · Sep 10, 2017

CMoore said:
Could you explain how that works exactly.....what gas it is, where you buy it, what type of Container/Delivery is used for the gas, etc etc
Thank You

One such gas is Tetenal Proctectan (I have not used it so cannot comment on it). Some people use nitrogen. I just ensure bottles are full and decant into smaller bottles as the liquid gets used up.

http://www.tetenaluk.com/protectan-spray-400ml-bogof.html

CMoore · Sep 10, 2017

darkroommike said:
I would buy a 5L if there was a substantial savings and then divide it into brown glass bottles with cone type seals on the lids, full up (but leave a little headspace), there's no need for gas or any of that other rubbish. But it would have to be a substantial savings. Else just make D-72, etc.

What are the Cone Type Seals you are talking about.?
Do you make D-76 and then store it in brown bottles.?
Thank You

Svenedin · Sep 10, 2017

CMoore said:
What are the Cone Type Seals you are talking about.?
Do you make D-76 and then store it in brown bottles.?
Thank You

Look up "polycone" bottle caps. They seal well and don't rely on a rubbish bit of cardboard like some bottle caps on the containers that photochemical are sold in.

Photo Engineer · Sep 10, 2017

Liquidol has a long shelf life but not infinite. When it is good it is clear or even yellow. The time to worry is when crystals form. This indicates that the oxygen has begun to turn the Sulfite into Sulfate and it begins to precipitate. Even then if it is not dark brown, the developer will still work, albeit with some slight loss in capacity and tray life.

PE

Vaughn · Sep 10, 2017

darkroommike said:
I would buy a 5L if there was a substantial savings and then divide it into brown glass bottles with cone type seals on the lids, full up ...

I use PQ Universal developer for film (I do not print on silver gelatin papers). If I can, I buy the 5 liter and likewise, divide it up into smaller bottles. Works fine.

Svenedin · Sep 10, 2017

For the paper developer I use, Tetenal Eukobrom, it costs £11.86 for a litre bottle or £21.58 for 5 litres. Similar story with Ilford Multigrade dev. It's a no brainer really.

CMoore · Sep 10, 2017

Svenedin said:
Look up "polycone" bottle caps. They seal well and don't rely on a rubbish bit of cardboard like some bottle caps on the containers that photochemical are sold in.

OK Great...Thanks
I have a bunch of Brown/Amber bottles from Specialty.. I will contact them and see if they sell those caps, or get the thread size and order some to fit.
Thanks Again

CMoore · Sep 11, 2017

For those of you that use something like D-76.....once you make it, and store it in bottles as best you can, how long will it last.?
Does it store as well as something like Liqidol or the other Liquid Concentrates.?
Thank You

MattKing · Sep 11, 2017

This is probably worth its own thread. But I think you will find that there are a few threads already that touch on the subject.
For any question like this, it would help if you indicated your expected usage over a period like six months.

CMoore · Sep 11, 2017

OK...i'll do a search.
Unfortunately, i do not have enough of a track record to even guess how much i might use.
I have a box of the Ilford stuff...is that ID-11.?
If i could mix that box and get 3-4 months, in a few 32 Oz bottles with no worries, i would probably be happy with that.
Unless i would be using it in a day or two, i would just be using the stock solution as a "One Shot" and not save it.
But i will punch ID-11 into the Forum Search and do some reading.
Thanks Matt

MattKing · Sep 11, 2017

Have you read the data sheet from Ilford? It answers your question.
(this is a trick to encourage you to find that data sheet and become familiar with it).

CMoore · Sep 11, 2017

.....am reading it online right now.
So just by dumb-luck...my estimate of 3-4 months is close to "right".
Thanks Matt

WORKING SOLUTION LIFE
PERCEPTOL, ID-11 and MICROPHEN stock
solutions should last for up to:-
6 months in full capped containers
1 month in a half full tightly capped container
.
4 months in a deep tank with a floating lid.
1 month in a deep tank without a floating lid.
PERCEPTOL, ID-11 and MICROPHEN diluted 1+1
or 1+3 should not be kept for more than 24 hours

Svenedin · Sep 11, 2017

CMoore said:
.....am reading it online right now.
So just by dumb-luck...my estimate of 3-4 months is close to "right".
Thanks Matt

WORKING SOLUTION LIFE
PERCEPTOL, ID-11 and MICROPHEN stock
solutions should last for up to:-
6 months in full capped containers
1 month in a half full tightly capped container
.
4 months in a deep tank with a floating lid.
1 month in a deep tank without a floating lid.
PERCEPTOL, ID-11 and MICROPHEN diluted 1+1
or 1+3 should not be kept for more than 24 hours

Ok but these are film developers. I thought you were asking about paper developers.

Paper Developer

CMoore

Svenedin

Alan9940

tedr1

MattKing

Moderator

CMoore

Svenedin

RalphLambrecht

tezzasmall

Svenedin

CMoore

darkroommike

Svenedin

CMoore

Svenedin

Photo Engineer

Vaughn

Svenedin

CMoore

CMoore

MattKing

Moderator

CMoore

MattKing

Moderator

CMoore

Svenedin

Paper Developer

Moderator

Moderator

Moderator

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