Only shooting B&W - the colour editing faff.

[P1505]

Hi.

I don’t know if this is the right place to ask this. I don’t know what I’m asking I guess. Maybe I’m over reflecting again.

Editing, specifically editing colour, kills my flow. I have thousands of images I’ve not looked at and more I’ve looked at end ignored for now because I find editing colours a chore.

This post by the way may end with me solving my own problem and deciding to sell a lot of cameras.

I love the act of photography and I love editing and making hand made books. But getting the colours to look how it felt when I made the photograph I just despise. I don’t want to sit for hours adjusting sliders or trying presets. I can’t stand it.

I’ve thought about removing the burden and buying a Monochrome camera and shooting colour film where I seem to just never need to edit after the scan. Sell the GFX etc and buy a Q2 Mono and shoot Kodak Gold on the film cameras. Or keep the GFX to scan the film, I dunno.

I need to simplify. I want things easier so I can focus on what I already do, photographing, but get more images out the other end. If I keep going as I am I’ll have 50k images I can’t be bothered to look at.

My thinking is to force the simplicity. Maybe I should spend a bit of time finding a look I like for each project and applying that preset or maybe I should find an editor to do that for me.

I don’t know what I’m asking, so I guess I’m looking for debate and conversation about the benefits of limiting yourself to monochrome or one colour film stock.

 

[xkaes]

You don't have to limit yourself, although there are LOTS of people (the majority???) that just shoot color OR b&w, but not both.

I started out shooting only color, but when I discovered B&W, I shot mostly B&W. I eventually added more color, but it's still largely B&W.

In other words, there's no perfect balance. It's up to you, and it can & will change from time to time, and subject to subject.

One "project" might be "best" in all B&W, and another in Color, and another in a mix.

It's just another tool for you to use.

 

[jeffreyg]

I agree on why limit. Shoot bw film and leave the digital color which you can convert to monochrome. That’s the approach I take. I rarely print color mostly pt/pd these days. I also make an occasional hand made book and I’m doing one now but in bw

 

[P1505]

I agree on why limit. Shoot bw film and leave the digital color which you can convert to monochrome. That’s the approach I take. I rarely print color mostly pt/pd these days. I also make an occasional hand made book and I’m doing one now but in bw

I think I’d go the opposite - I just don’t like the colour from digital cameras.

 

[xkaes]

I think I’d go the opposite - I just don’t like the colour from digital cameras.

Do you like the color from film?

 

[P1505]

Do you like the color from film?

Yes. I seem to prefer it. Massively less perfect and clinical. I can see where this is headed!

 

[P1505]

You don't have to limit yourself, although there are LOTS of people (the majority???) that just shoot color OR b&w, but not both.

I started out shooting only color, but when I discovered B&W, I shot mostly B&W. I eventually added more color, but it's still largely B&W.

In other words, there's no perfect balance. It's up to you, and it can & will change from time to time, and subject to subject.

One "project" might be "best" in all B&W, and another in Color, and another in a mix.

It's just another tool for you to use.

I wonder if limitations, or less choices, will make the editing process more enjoyable.

I guess I should try it for a month.

 

[xkaes]

Yeah, your question about B&W vs Color ends up being -- why not both.

And about Film vs Digital? Why not both?

 

[cerber0s]

I had the same problem. I stopped shootong digital last year and went all analog. I’m much happier now, and I think my hit-rate (good photos) increased.

 

[Sirius Glass]

You don't have to limit yourself, although there are LOTS of people (the majority???) that just shoot color OR b&w, but not both.

I started out shooting only color, but when I discovered B&W, I shot mostly B&W. I eventually added more color, but it's still largely B&W.

In other words, there's no perfect balance. It's up to you, and it can & will change from time to time, and subject to subject.

One "project" might be "best" in all B&W, and another in Color, and another in a mix.

It's just another tool for you to use.

I shoot both black & white and color, switching backs or cameras on some subjects as I walk around. If I am traveling I generally will only shoot color. YMMV

 

[Alan Edward Klein]

Shooting color film still requires editing colors after the scan. Why not just shoot BW with film and then scan the film to print digitally? Simpler still, just shoot BW digitally requiring minimum editing, and then print?

 

[P1505]

I find editing colour scans takes about 30 seconds, because the colours are baked in and look good by default.

My gut is saying to try shooting film exclusively for colour for a while and see how it goes. It’ll certainly help me avoid the editing phase, at the cost of cash. Each shutter actuation will be ~80 UK pence if I exclude scanning hardware costs.

That adds up fast.

 

[koraks]

I find editing colour scans takes about 30 seconds, because the colours are baked in and look good by default.

I'm very skeptical about claims like these. https://tinker.koraks.nl/photography/all-over-the-place-the-problem-with-color-negative-film-scans/
Of course, if you're happy with how your scans come out, that's great. You'll hear no complaints from me! But the concept of "baked in" colors - nah. There's too much going on with scans for that to be an accurate description. Speaking about color negative, of course. Positives are a different story. Those are beautifully WYSIWYG.

 

[brbo]

OP is probably talking from a point where he gets scans done by a lab and considers those as basically finished images (with "baked in" colours/contrast/wb...).

 

[koraks]

That's possible, although I regularly read similar comments about colors being somehow inherently encoded into negative film. I think that's a problematic point of departure as it can result in a wild-goose chase for getting "correct" colors from color negatives.

 

[GLS]

Positives are a different story. Those are beautifully WYSIWYG.

Assuming your scanning workflow & monitor are calibrated, that is.

 

[P1505]

OP is probably talking from a point where he gets scans done by a lab and considers those as basically finished images (with "baked in" colours/contrast/wb...).

Nope, I scan myself. And post conversion I find I just done need to do much if anything.

There is something so perfectly imperfect about them that I cannot get to with digital colour. It all seems so fake.

Anyway, made my decision. New macro, scanning bits, and a ton of film ordered. The Q2M will likely be ordered within 1-2 months.

 

[MurrayMinchin]

Not claiming to be an expert of any kind here, but I enjoy the amount of control one has making B&W prints from digital colour files.

When taking B&W images in digital monochrome or with B&W film you can, for example, put an orange filter on the lens to deepen a blue sky, but when editing a colour digital file as a B&W image you can still use the colour editing controls, even when the final print will be B&W.

This means you can deepen the blue sky, lighten that red building, make those yellow flowers pop, and lighten the green grass...all at the same time.

Sure, a monochrome digital camera would probably give more detail, but I never print larger than 11x14 (even from 4x5 negatives) so the digital prints look pretty good to me.

 

[P1505]

Not claiming to be an expert of any kind here, but I enjoy the amount of control one has making B&W prints from digital colour files.

When taking B&W images in digital monochrome or with B&W film you can, for example, put an orange filter on the lens to deepen a blue sky, but when editing a colour digital file as a B&W image you can still use the colour editing controls, even when the final print will be B&W.

This means you can deepen the blue sky, lighten that red building, make those yellow flowers pop, and lighten the green grass...all at the same time.

Sure, a monochrome digital camera would probably give more detail, but I never print larger than 11x14 (even from 4x5 negatives) so the digital prints look pretty good to me.

It’s that level of control I’m hoping to avoid. I want to get 80% there and be done.

My goal is to spend less time editing, more time shooting, while avoiding chemicals.

 

[MurrayMinchin]

It’s that level of control I’m hoping to avoid. I want to get 80% there and be done.

My goal is to spend less time editing, more time shooting, while avoiding chemicals.

I used to do pin registered sharp and unsharp masking in the darkroom...what I described can be days faster!

 

[Lachlan Young]

although I regularly read similar comments about colors being somehow inherently encoded into negative film

It's more that there was/ is some data to tell the scanner which baseline correction routine to do for base/ mask - i.e. Fujicolor, Gold (same difference with analogue machine printers with different channels for different stocks/ manufacturers) etc, and then baking whatever LUT etc on top of that. They were designed to let largely semi-skilled operators produce better than acceptable results fast - they can improve truly awful negs quite a bit, but on a really good neg are often quite some way from what a high end scan or darkroom print can deliver. At some point, I guess I should dig out the Portra Printer Control negs I've got here and see what people make of them.

 

[beemermark]

Sorry I got lost at the OP. What is colour editing faff. I wish some poster would realize some of us are over 30.

 

[Romanko]

@P1505 I periodically experience the exact same problems that you described.

You feel like you have taken a ton of images already and you want to shoot even more, yet you don't want to spend too much time editing your film images, and it bothers you that you don't do much with them. My situation is even worse because I also shoot digital and end up with even more images waiting to be edited and printed.

I partially solved the problem by revising my workflow and eliminating the steps that I do not enjoy doing or require too much time. I stopped repairing my old cameras and only use a few that I know work. I found a good film lab that I can trust with developing my colour negatives and slides (I still develop B&W). I developed a camera scanning workflow that allows me to get consistent results from my scans with minimum effort. I moved from Darktable to Affinity Photo which I actually enjoy using. And finally, I bought a Canon Selphy printer and started printing the images that I like most.

I am now going through the photos I taken this and last year (a lot of them are digital). My plans are to compile a body of work that I can have printed as a portfolio similar to what Kyle Mcdougall did with his Slate Country series and the prints what Ben Horne is producing annually.

Also, as others said you do not need to limit yourself to shooting only colour or B&W if you enjoy both. Focus on your projects and artistic goals and they will dictate the choice of media. (Ideally). Life is more complex of course.

 

[brbo]

You feel like you have taken a ton of images already and you want to shoot even more, yet you don't want to spend too much time editing your film images, and it bothers you that you don't do much with them. My situation is even worse because I also shoot digital and end up with even more images waiting to be edited and printed.

I gather that OP shoots a ton of digital images, doesn't like editing them and sees the solution in shooting only film for colour images since his scanning works very well for him and scans need no or very little editing to get him to what he likes.

 

[Romanko]

I gather that OP shoots a ton of digital images, doesn't like editing them and sees the solution in shooting only film for colour images since his scanning works very well for him and scans need no or very little editing to get him to what he likes.

Oh, that solves the problem! Shoot too much film and you go broke quicker than you expected.

Jokes aside, if @P1505 loves shooting colour film and the look of it when scanned this is great. I wish I could say the same. Hybrid colour negative process is still a bit of a struggle for me but I am getting better at it.