Nova quad print unit power question

odell1618photography · Aug 22, 2019

I got a great deal on a Nova Quad, $100.00. It is new but had a crack that I repaired.
I purchased a 110 / 230 transformer, BUT I found that the Nova needs EU 50 hz frequency not USA 60 hz.

Frequency convertors are expensive.

What would happen if I tried using the Nova at 50hz. Blow up ? Catch Fire ? Fry?

Any advice is welcome.

Thanks

shutterfinger · Aug 22, 2019

There are minor differences in the design of of a 50Hz power supply and a 60Hz power supply. The 60Hz running on a 50Hz design will likely have a slight amount of AC ripple on the DC output of the power supply but it will likely not affect performance of the unit.
AC in - transformer primary - transformer secondary(s) - AC to DC converting electronics - motor, timer circuit, light circuit, and similar circuits.
Shouldn't hurt anything.

Neal · Aug 23, 2019

If it uses AC motors they will run faster.

bdial · Aug 23, 2019

In the case of the OP's Nova, we're talking about a heater for the water bath and its associated temperature control circuitry.

odell1618photography said:
...What would happen if I tried using the Nova at 50hz. Blow up ? Catch Fire ? Fry?...

Actually, on Nova's (The Imagingwarehouse) website they specifically state that the unit is not compatible with 60 hz

IMPORTANT NOTE:-
EUROPEAN & WORLD Customers (excluding USA and Canada) - A UK 3 Plug is fitted as standard to all our equipment but an optional European 2 Pin Plug adaptor can be purchased to assist you to connect to your electrical supply.
USA & CANADA Customers - Unfortunately, this product is unsuitable for use in the USA & Canada owing to highly sensitive electronic microchip controls which require a 230 volts 50Hz electrical supply. Although a step up transformer can be used to create 230volts from 110volts, the standard frequency of 60Hz also has to be converted to 50Hz in order for the unit to work. You can use a frequency converter but they tend to be expensive.

link

Unless you're planning to use it for color, leaving it unplugged and using it at room temperature is probably fine. I have an older quad with a US-compatible heater, which I keep set for 68° F. It's handy in the winter here, but not truly necessary even then.
If you are handy with electronics, especially micro-controllers, it might be possible to dissect the heater and replace the temperature control portion.

john_s · Aug 23, 2019

I think that the electronics are not simple in this case. However, with the right voltage even with the wrong frequency I would be tempted to try it in the hope that you would just need to make a compensating adjustment in the temperature setting. Be advised that I am not an expert. The downside would be that the heating system is ruined.

If you're in a cold environment, and really need the heating function, an alternative might be to connect the heater directly to a low voltage variable DC supply and set the current by trial and error. Maybe someone with experience in aquarium heaters could help.

odell1618photography · Aug 24, 2019

john_s said:
I think that the electronics are not simple in this case. However, with the right voltage even with the wrong frequency I would be tempted to try it in the hope that you would just need to make a compensating adjustment in the temperature setting. Be advised that I am not an expert. The downside would be that the heating system is ruined.

If you're in a cold environment, and really need the heating function, an alternative might be to connect the heater directly to a low voltage variable DC supply and set the current by trial and error. Maybe someone with experience in aquarium heaters could help.

Thanks everyone for the advice. Keeping the heaters and replacing the power supply and circuits seems viable.

AgX · Aug 24, 2019

As indicated already for a heating element nothing will change.
The AC-DC converter for an electronic control circuit will not be affected either as the rectifying stage will care of both, 50 and 60 Hertz.

A issue to think of are time controlled circuits (electronic clockworks and counters).
In the long past they relied on the mains frequency, even in absence of small motors. However with the availability of cheap quartz frequency bases there is no longer need for a specific mains frequencies at such circuits.

odell1618photography · Aug 24, 2019

AgX said:
As indicated already for a heating element nothing will change.
The AC-DC converter for an electronic control circuit will not be affected either as the rectifying stage will care of both, 50 and 60 Hertz.

A issue to think of are time controlled circuits (electronic clockworks and counters).
In the long past they relied on the mains frequency, even in absence of small motors. However with the availability of cheap quartz frequency bases there is no longer need for a specific mains frequencies at such circuits.

I’m wondering now if the information and advice from the manufacturer is just to address warranty, liability, or anything unexpected when operating in the US.

AgX · Aug 24, 2019

john_s said:
...an alternative might be to connect the heater directly to a low voltage variable DC supply and set the current by trial and error.

The heater is driven by DC? For a power device to be connected to the mains such makes no sense at all as it would have necessitated a power transformer and resp. rectifyer.
The only heaters driven by DC that come to my mind are low power, auto-regulated solder-irons.

Maybe someone makes me wiser on this.

BMbikerider · Aug 24, 2019

Neal said:
If it uses AC motors they will run faster.

Nova Processors do not have a motor.

rbrigham · Aug 24, 2019

my heater broke and i just replaced it with aquarium heaters from amazon i think I payed £20 and they slotted strait in ...

John51 · Aug 25, 2019

The heaters will be run from the mains. It's the circuitry that turns the heaters on and off that needs 50Hz.

I've just had a look at mine. I strongly suspect that all the control circuitry is contained in the plug. With the exception of the temp sensor. (Why would they surround electronics with water?)

Does anyone have a dead Nova and up for a little reverse engineering?

If the plug is cut off, I'd expect to only find wires to the heaters and wires from the temp sensor. Don't blame me if it isn't like that!

If it is, an Inkbird temp controller is inexpensive and easy to wire up. Once the wires are identified, the conversion will take a matter of minutes.

odell1618photography · Aug 25, 2019

John51 said:
The heaters will be run from the mains. It's the circuitry that turns the heaters on and off that needs 50Hz.

I've just had a look at mine. I strongly suspect that all the control circuitry is contained in the plug. With the exception of the temp sensor. (Why would they surround electronics with water?)

Does anyone have a dead Nova and up for a little reverse engineering?

If the plug is cut off, I'd expect to only find wires to the heaters and wires from the temp sensor. Don't blame me if it isn't like that!

If it is, an Inkbird temp controller is inexpensive and easy to wire up. Once the wires are identified, the conversion will take a matter of minutes.

The inkbird temperature controller does look like the way to go. The Nova has two separate water baths with heating units in each. The temp sensor from the ink bird could control the developer side. The other side may run slightly cooler.

Now the question is, should I plug it in as is to see what happens? If the temperature control circuitry at the plug fails I can go inkbird. If the heaters fail then they would fail using the inkbird as with inkbird in place there will still be US 60hz going to the heaters.

odell1618photography · Aug 25, 2019

If I figure out the wiring to the Nova temp probe I can wire that to the inkbird.

pentaxuser · Aug 25, 2019

OP just as a matter of interest, have you asked the seller if it worked when he/she had it, assuming it was purchased from a 60 Hz resident?

pentaxuser

odell1618photography · Aug 25, 2019

pentaxuser said:
OP just as a matter of interest, have you asked the seller if it worked when he/she had it, assuming it was purchased from a 60 Hz resident?

pentaxuser

It’s a new unit, never used. I bought it at a local camera store, it had a crack from shipping, so they had never sold it. Their original thinking was to use it with a power converter but had never considered the frequency issue.

AgX · Aug 25, 2019

John51 said:
The heaters will be run from the mains. It's the circuitry that turns the heaters on and off that needs 50Hz.

Thank you for confirming that the heater is running on the mains
As indicated above I doubt the control unit of such processor will need any reference frequency, let alone one taken off the mains.

bdial · Aug 25, 2019

AgX said:
Thank you for confirming that the heater is running on the mains
As indicated above I doubt the control unit of such processor will need any reference frequency, let alone one taken off the mains.

One would think that it shouldn't matter, but Nova specifically states it will not work. Presumably they have some specific reason.

Sirius Glass · Aug 25, 2019

odell1618photography said:
It’s a new unit, never used. I bought it at a local camera store, it had a crack from shipping, so they had never sold it. Their original thinking was to use it with a power converter but had never considered the frequency issue.

You could ask the store, but the manufacture does not offer it is in the US because of the voltage and AC frequency. They have stated categorically many times that it is too hard to convert their products to work in the US. I have spent a lot of time researching this. Better change the 120 volt AC to DC and then convert it to 240 volt 50 Hertz.

mshchem · Aug 25, 2019

Before the national grid in the USA the Western USA was on 50 Hz. All the electric clocks went to the dump.

odell1618photography · Aug 25, 2019

Sirius Glass said:
You could ask the store, but the manufacture does not offer it is in the US because of the voltage and AC frequency. They have stated categorically many times that it is too hard to convert their products to work in the US. I have spent a lot of time researching this. Better change the 120 volt AC to DC and then convert it to 240 volt 50 Hertz.

There are converters from 60hz to 50 hz. They are very expensive, simply not cost effective.

MattKing · Aug 25, 2019

My guess is that the temperature monitoring system includes some sort of timing circuitry that controls how frequently the temperature is checked, and that circuitry is affected by the mains frequency.

odell1618photography · Aug 25, 2019

MattKing said:
My guess is that the temperature monitoring system includes some sort of timing circuitry that controls how frequently the temperature is checked, and that circuitry is affected by the mains frequency.

We are getting very close to plugging the Nova in to see what will happen...

mshchem · Aug 25, 2019

Yes, you might or might not damage the unit. I doubt it would work correctly in any case. I would find an electrical engineer friend.

mshchem · Aug 25, 2019

odell1618photography said:
We are getting very close to plugging the Nova in to see what will happen...

I'm curious .

Nova quad print unit power question

Moderator

Privacy & Transparency

Privacy & Transparency