Newbie: Cheapest setup for a 6x17 camera?

jasonjoo · Jan 14, 2008

Hey folks,

I've recently switched over from digital to film. I've sold off much of my digital equipment and picked up two Rolleiflex 3.5E's (one needs a CLA badly) and an EOS 3 body as well. I really enjoy shooting MF and do like the square format, but I've been thinking about adding a 6x17 pano camera as well.

I'm really new to the analog world and would love to hear some of your input/advice into getting started with a 6x17 camera. From what I've read briefly, I can either go with a dedicated panoramic camera or use a large format camera with a panoramic back.

What's the best way to go about this?

Thanks,

Jason

Jim Noel · Jan 14, 2008

Probably the lowest cost way is a SHen HAo field camera and a Shwn Hao 6x17 back. Add a lens from 90 - 135 and you are ready to go.

David A. Goldfarb · Jan 14, 2008

Or even cheaper, look for a Crown Graphic and a 6x17 back. These backs work with any camera that has a Graflok or international type back. On my Linhof Tech V I use a DaYi 617 back, which I've been satisfied with. The Focus 617 back is an updated version made by the same company.

These 6x17 backs for 4x5 cameras work full-frame with lenses from 72-150mm, as long as they can cover the format, and as long as the subject isn't too close. Longer lenses, or lenses with in the range but at very close subject distances (like a 150mm lens closer than 6 feet) will vignette, but you'll still get a pretty long panoramic image--like 6x15 or 6x16.

If you get a Graphic with a rangefinder and a separate viewfinder for 6x17, you can even have a handholdable, rangefinder coupled 6x17 camera, with lenses around 120-150mm. I use 6x17 back this way on my Linhof Tech V with a rangefinder cammed 150mm lens and a Gaoersi adjustable 6x17 finder.

rkmiec · Jan 14, 2008

as far as a purpose built panorama camera the fotoman is the cheapest,1700 usd for body and focus mount plus lens.say 600 for a top of the line used lens maybe less.
the shen ho 5x7 and the 617 back would be 1900 plus lens.
the shen ho 4x5 and 617 back around 1200 plus lens.
also check the auction site as i have seen all the above equipment regularly.

Tim Boehm · Jan 14, 2008

Canham has a 6x17 automatic back that will fit onto their 5x7 cameras.

Here’s a picture of the MQC5x7 fitted with the 6x17 back:
http://canhamcameras.com/Roll film back.html

That back is $1195. He has a few 5x7 models; the MQC5x7 is $2650.

Fuji also makes a 6x17 camera, but it’s very expensive.
http://dannyburk.com/equipment_reviews.htm
http://dannyburk.com/fuji_gx680iii.htm

http://www.dannyburk.com has some great 6x17 color panos made with the Fuji.
He states on his site that he also has the Canham setup.

Tim Boehm · Jan 14, 2008

The items I cited in my previous post really aren't the "cheapest;" I'm just giving you other ideas. Good luck with that format, I really like it.

jasonjoo · Jan 15, 2008

Yikes, I guess this next camera of mine will have to wait a while longer! I knew it would be expensive, but this is a TINY bit over my budget

Thanks for the help. I'm sorry to say but, it may take a year or so for me to save up some more funds

Jason

Nick Zentena · Jan 15, 2008

Cheapest an old 5x7 with cropped film. Or a L dark slide.

Ian Grant · Jan 15, 2008

Actually the cheapest 6x17 camera is the Gaoersi, I bought mine last year direct from China. It's very different using a dedicated 6x17 and much more versatile and practical than using a 6x17 back on a 5x4 or 5x7 camera.

Ian

jasonjoo · Jan 15, 2008

This may be a long shot, but is it cheaper to go with a 6x12 setup? I'm guessing no, but I'd thought I'd try! I'm really fascinated by these pano-cameras. With digital it was very easy to stitch multiple images, but it never really intrigued me. However, being able to see the pano as I'm taking it is so much more... interesting.

Call me crazy! I'm really in love with analog photography! Hopefully I'll start developing my own negs and prints too!

Jason

David A. Goldfarb · Jan 15, 2008

Well, the Chinese made 6x12 backs are a little cheaper than the Chinese made 6x17 backs. The camera you attach it to is the same.

Nick Zentena · Jan 15, 2008

Unless you go to 5x7 then the 6x17 back is cheaper. But cropping a 5x7 sheet on a cheaper older 5x7 is hard to beat for price.

jasonjoo · Jan 15, 2008

David A. Goldfarb said:
Well, the Chinese made 6x12 backs are a little cheaper than the Chinese made 6x17 backs. The camera you attach it to is the same.

Well in that case, I'll have to hold off on this purchase for a while then!

As backwards as this sounds, I'm actually putting some serious money into a new computer (Mac Pro!). Well, I guess that's how life works

Thanks again guys. I'll be back soon (hopefully).

Jason

Jerevan · Jan 15, 2008

A cheaper way to get something at least close to panorama, would be to use one of your Rolleis with the panorama head accessory. From the examples I've seen, it works pretty great.

pauliej · Jan 15, 2008

If you really mean "cheap", you may want to build your own camera from black foam core, plywood, etc. Check the F295.org website for ideas on home-built or hand-made type cameras. They specialize in pinhole designs but you can add a lens/shutter if you want. Just dont let the pinhole police (or any of their ilk) catch you.

I hope this helps you.

Paul

JBrunner · Jan 15, 2008

I have the Fotoman 6x17, and it is great. The view camera with back is going to br the cheapest. If that's still too rich and you want more of a dedicated camera, consider a Widelux. Not 6x17, but there is still a fair amount of real estate to the neg, and you can print it with a smaller enlarger. If you hope to print your 6x17's start looking for a 5x7 enlarger.

Trevor Crone · Jan 15, 2008

Indeed it's well worth considering what Jason said with regard to a Widelux. Certainly an affordable way into the wonderful world of panoramic photography. I use a 35mm Noblex which is however quite an expensive camera but it has great specs. and is very reliable. The 35mm neg. is 24 x 66mm and the lens has an angle of view on the diagonal of 135 degrees.

I also use a 6 x 12 cm back on my 4x5 camera. Very versatile with a good range of lenses giving full coverage with this format. I go as wide as 35mm (Apo Grandagon) which just about covers this format. The Horseman 6 x 12 roll film back is quite affordable and is readily available second hand.

Good luck,
Trevor.

jasonjoo · Jan 15, 2008

Aside from the camera itself, how do people print large prints from a 6x17 negative? I'm assuming that with all that detail, most people would want a rather large image to hang up somewhere. Would these prints have to be made at a special facility or pro-photo lab? I can't imagine seeing someone printing a large pano image in a bathroom darkroom

Shawn Dougherty · Jan 15, 2008

jasonjoo said:
I can't imagine seeing someone printing a large pano image in a bathroom darkroom

I print 8x10 inch negs in my supersmall, plane-jane darkroom without running water. It's really not that big a deal.

JBrunner · Jan 15, 2008

jasonjoo said:
Aside from the camera itself, how do people print large prints from a 6x17 negative? I'm assuming that with all that detail, most people would want a rather large image to hang up somewhere. Would these prints have to be made at a special facility or pro-photo lab? I can't imagine seeing someone printing a large pano image in a bathroom darkroom

You could make nice contact prints without an enlarger, just about 7 inches long, nice super sharp 3d lookin little jewels. Most persons enlarge them, and as I said you need a
5x7 enlarger. Thats hardly "special", although much less common than a 4x5 or smaller.

Most labs would use a hybrid aproach, and it would most likely end up on color paper, but with such a nice neg, thats kind of icky. There are some labs that still do B&W printing. Elevator for one (Bob Carnie).

You are moving a bit out of the bathroom realm when you start using 5x7 negs, but it depends on how large your bathroom is, and how convinced you are that the enlarge just has to be in the bathroom. If I had to bathroom print here, I'd make the room adjoining light tight, and use the bathroom for the wet work.

Once you start making negs with a 6x17 (or any biggish neg), you will itch to print them your self.

jasonjoo · Jan 15, 2008

Hmm, I'm not at this point myself yet, but I hope to one day have my own darkroom. As of now, I'm able to use my universities darkroom to develop and print, so I'll take advantage of this as long as I can.

BTW Jason, I've seen your youtube videos and I think they are brilliant. I enjoyed each one! Thanks

Mark Fisher · Jan 15, 2008

I just finished (like tonight) a 6x15 (maybe 6x14) camera. I bought an old Kodak Autographic 3A....wierd camera....it has shift and rise but no way to frame it if you use it....but I digress. The camera originally took postcard sized negatives on roll film. That film is long gone unfortunately. With a bit of sheet metal (new pressure plate and film gate), black out cloth (to recover the bellows) and adapters for 120 film made from 120 film reels, I was able to fashion a panaramic camera for about $50 total. It came with a decent 170mm rectilinear (Kodak Angstimat I think) lens that just needed cleaning so I used that. My plan is to just use it to make small platinum contact prints and this lens is much more than adequate. I've heard of people using 90mm Angulons for this sort of conversion also. Other than a foamcore or cardboard camera, I can't think of a cheaper way to go. By the way, I did the whole conversion with an exacto knife, tin snips, a small hammer, a drill and a dremel tool......nothing too fancy.

nsurit · Jan 16, 2008

OK, how about $250. Check out this 6X18 pinhole by eightbanners (Dead Link Removed). I have there original wooden camera and it works great. I scan the negatives on an older Epson scanner, although I've just purchased a 5X7 enlarger and look forward to printing them from an enlarger soon. <[B^) Bill Barber

Ian Grant · Jan 16, 2008

Now stick a lens & focussing mount on that camera and it's very cheap option

Ian

DougGrosjean · Jan 16, 2008

3 different ways to get where you want to go are illustrated in the URLs below.

Kodak Panoram - about $400, shoots on 120 film.
35 mm Widelux - I'm guessing about $750.
Rollei panoramic mount - maybe $100, plus computer.

Results from the above cameras, shown on sites below.

Route 66, 35mm Widelux and 120-film Kodak Panoram:
Dead Link Removed

Trip home to Ohio from Santa Monica, via UT / CO, Widelux only:
Dead Link Removed

And here's an example of a Rollei pano head attached to a Rolleiflex, then the images Photomerged:
Dead Link Removed

Your head spinning yet?

Doug Grosjean

Newbie: Cheapest setup for a 6x17 camera?

jasonjoo

Jim Noel

David A. Goldfarb

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rkmiec

Tim Boehm

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Ian Grant

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Jerevan

pauliej

JBrunner

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jasonjoo

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JBrunner

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Newbie: Cheapest setup for a 6x17 camera?

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