New Kickstarter: Mercury, a universal, open camera system

[rhizomeblur]

Moopheus, these Instax backs are already real. Beyond the Kickstarter pledges, I've begun taking additional orders. There is certainly a lead time for these, but I'm selling a limited number to raise additional funds for Mercury development. If anyone is interested, send a PM or email me at mercurycameraworks@gmail.com

 

[AgX]

Thanks. It's a good thing you ask about the country; where I am, it's unthinkable to order antyhing from outside the EU, since customs will add months to the delivery (and with no communication!) and hundreds to the price (it can more than double, it's not just sales tax).

Customs are the same in all EU, and VAT is quite the same.

This does not exclude that I myself am reluctant to import anything from outside the EU, but this rather is based on the behaviour of german customs authorities and the hassle and harm involved by that, not the customs and tax figures as such.

 

[Antonio Marques]

Customs are the same in all EU, and VAT is quite the same.

Do you have a reference for that? I'm not familiar with the behaviour of customs authorities in other countries, can they all be as noisome as the Portuguese?

- VAT is defined by each country, though the rates are within the same order of magnitude (15 vs 25 for instance).
- Customa duties are equally defined on a country basis, I expect there must be a minimum so as not to create a customs haven, but otherwise I'm not aware that the values are EU-coordinated.
- Bur then you have yet another customs 'fee', which is the amount they want for having had the trouble to take your package apart and examine it.
- And the taxes are applied over the full cost of the order, including shipping (yes, you pay customs over the shipping...)
- And the wildcard in it all is that just because the documents say your camera cost $360, they won't have it, they'll use as a basis (to compute all the other taxes) the value they think it really should have costed. Unless the item is both new and not discounted, you're in for a significant upwards 'correction' of the value, so no good deals or bargains.
- Once in a blue moon, an order will get through customs without even the taxes it would be justly due. It's either oversight or giving you false confidence.

Once I ordered a plain used $30 book from the US and it was quite difficult to get hold of it. I had thought there was no risk for such a small item, I was proved wrong.

My impression is that US authorities don't work that way, or Americans wouldn't be ordering so many items from Japan. Thus Anerican companies may not be aware of how complicated it is for Europeans to order their products.

 

[AgX]

-) as you agreed VAT is rather equal in the EU with few extremes
-) custom duties are equal in all member EU states (part of the idea behind the EU)
-) shipping costs are part of the import and thus will be accounted for in the VAT-calculation (import=material+effort)

-) there are no customs handling costs in Germany, but you would have to pay postal COD-fee at your door for the duty/VAT payment

-) what differ between EU-countrie are minimum free limits, on which no duty or VAT will be claimed

-) but shipments getting lost at customs,
being sent further in unclosed box and thus getting damaged,
not letting be passed for lacking an included invoice, though the official customs-declarations just gives the same details.
countless rides to the custom office
is too much hassle and harm for me.

 

[xya]

as I live in germany and france and as I buy a lot from the US, china and japan, I can add some experiences:

it all depends on the carrier. most non-post-office carriers in germany and france do the custom works for you quickly and completely. they advance all fees. so the item arrives quickly at your door and will not get lost. you will on the other hand pay a handling fee (~20$ + vat), full custom fees and full vat.

german customs are a pita for postal items. you have to pick up the item personally, otherwise it may get lost in the process. only a value of 22 euro is free. this includes shipping costs. so any item from US and japan is due to vat.

it's much easier for postal items in france. paris airport customs are slow, but items don't get lost. up to 150$ item value they are rarely interested in calculating vat. so if delivery is not urgent, try postal service (SAL in japan, USPS in the US). you may even be lucky to get items with much higher value without vat, if you are not living in the paris region. I would not recommend to lie on the item value. if they get you, you're cooked.

 

[Njord]

I'm looking forward to my Mercury... A 6x9 w/Instax. Since I already shoot a Graflex Century Graphic, I'll have several compatible accessories. When I'm ready, this camera will allow me to move to 4x5 in a relatively compact unit. I'm looking toward to the potential for some of my Mamiya lenses/ I have two with built in shutters (that will likely be a bit of an experiment!). All the best of luck to the project!!!

 

[Antonio Marques]

I would not recommend to lie on the item value. if they get you, you're cooked.

It's disturbing the number of sellers who offer to put a 'gift' label in the package (as if it were of any avail!). But the issue here is that you're done for as well if you got a good deal or discount.

But we're straying. The topic here is the Merc and this customs thing was just to hammer in the need for a business to have 'proximity' distribution.

 

[farmersteve]

Crap I missed this whole thing. I see it's closed now. What they plans after the Kickstarter orders are fulfilled. Are you selling this at retail?

 

[beakhammer]

I like this idea a lot, and hope to see these cameras and modules available for sale some day. This type of open-source approach could should lead to a blossoming of cottage industries making and marketing specific parts to add to the constellation of modules that begin with the Mercury. This is what the graphlock back was all about in the first place, but extending the mix-and-match capacity of large-format kit to include more of the Medium-Format lenses and related gear is an excellent idea.

 

[rhizomeblur]

Crap I missed this whole thing. I see it's closed now. What they plans after the Kickstarter orders are fulfilled. Are you selling this at retail?

Perhaps some day! I'm sorry you missed the KS. Go here to signup for the mailing list for updates on future sales, availability, etc. Also, for anyone who is considered jumping off a bridge or something because you missed this, just email us at mercurycameraworks@gmail.com and we may still be able to add you as a backer!

 

[rhizomeblur]

I like this idea a lot, and hope to see these cameras and modules available for sale some day. This type of open-source approach could should lead to a blossoming of cottage industries making and marketing specific parts to add to the constellation of modules that begin with the Mercury. This is what the graphlock back was all about in the first place, but extending the mix-and-match capacity of large-format kit to include more of the Medium-Format lenses and related gear is an excellent idea.

Thanks for your comment! This is exactly what I hope will happen, and the driving force behind the Mercury project.

 

[Down Under]

This thread has been very quiet (read = silent) for some months.

Would Rhizomeblur care to give us an update on what has been happening with his new camera? Or would any of the backers of this interesting project, care to tell us how they are doing with their cameras?

Waiting with ba(i)ted breath...

 

[TheToadMen]

There is a new update on the Kickstarter page, Dead Link Removed.

And I received this email on January 1st, 2017:

You're receiving this email because you subscribed, sometime during 2016, to the Mercury Mailing List. This list has lain dormant for awhile, but we're kicking off 2017 by activating it!

IMPORTANT: This list is about two-way communication. We will use it occasionally to send you info about new items, updates on availability, and info about new content added to the website. But it is also how we keep track of you and your photography preferences, to understand the Mercury community better. Over the past year, we have gradually refined the set of information that we're asking about you. If you signed up in the past month or two, you probably entered everything.

If you signed up over the summer, however, you probably weren't asked much at all, and we need you to update your profile! The latest version of the profile asked if you were a Kickstarter backer or not. If you don't remember getting this question, your profile is probably out of date.

Please take a moment to update your profile.

In other news, yesterday we posted an important update on Kickstarter. We made this one visible to anyone, so you can read it even if you aren't an official KS backer. Check it out Dead Link Removed.

The final bit of news: We are locking in orders and starting full production very soon, so if you are not an official backer but would like to get in the queue anyway, this is your last opportunity to sign up. Just email us if you'd like to pre-order via Paypal.

Here's wishing you a happy, productive, and creative 2017!

Zach Horton,
Mercury Works

 

[kb244]

but I already have a Mercury II, it only shoots half frame though.

The modular camera reminds me a lot of the Omega Rapid.

 

[kb244]

For 35mm this could be an insane tilt/shift setup with a larger coverage.

 

[flavio81]

It reminds to me the concept behind the Silvestri cameras (silvestricamera.it). The goal is to have a lighter and especially cheaper product.

I understand the rationale behind this project, and I think it would have been great at the time of film photography.

Now, with all the interest that I can have in this endeavour, I agree with @EdSawyer that this effort goes, somehow, in the wrong direction.

The film photography "ecosystem" is in danger not for want of film cameras, but for want of chemicals, laboratories, printers, film variety, specialized repairers. Film cameras will survive if the entire "film ecosystem" survives. A new camera, however interesting, imaginative, and revolutionary, is probably, in this particular "historical" juncture of film photography, a step in the wrong direction. In a few years, things might be very different and the project might be quite successful.

I wish you all success for this endeavour, but not without saying that, personally, I would have found more interesting a firm producing an equivalent of the Jobo drum processors, or a simple versatile drying cabinet, or a firm devoted to recreating by machining any spare part not any more available. Maybe an enlarger, a slide projector, especially for APS format. Maybe a firm which produces 126 and 110 cartridges.

For instance, a product which solves the single problem of using Instax material with decent real-glass lenses would be immediately useful for the photographic community. An "Instax evolution" camera (with another name obviously) obtained by accurately coupling a quality lens to an Instax camera. A simpler project with a possible wider audience, IMHO.

In any case, I wish your project all the best!

I was going to write the same. Diapositivo's post (above) is excellent, my feelings exactly.

As for the camera, i wish them all the best, but i can't understand what is the advantage compared to a normal large format camera -- which can also mount "any" lens and you can fit many kinds of different film formats at the back. The proposed "Universal" camera adds no rangefinders or reflex devices to bring something new to the table.

Also, it can't truly "mount any lens" because the lens requires to have a shutter. If the camera had a focal plane shutter then it would be really universal, but I agree that would make it an extremely difficult project.

Now, if i can make a suggestion, it would be -- a modern version of the Kodak Medalist camera. Allow people to mount old, good, inexpensive 6x9 or 6x7 or 6x6 lenses with shutter (for example, Agfa Solinar lenses for the Agfa folder cameras in their Compur or Prontor shutters; and the japanese equivalents of said cameras) on a camera that provides a viewfinder and a rangefinder. All this with the advantage of modern ABS materials making it a very light camera. You can also 3D print custom 'rangefinder cams' to cater for the many lenses out there, in the common focal lengths to be found: 75, 80, 100, 105mm. Make the back a simple 120 film back for 6x7 or 6x9 or 6x6 or 6x4.5, but make the film backs interchangeable so it is quick. Add the helicoid as well.

This leverages your advantages - lightweight construction, novel nylon 3D printed helicoid. This could give a durable camera without, for example, the disadvantages of bellows (which are a bit delicate). Nodda Duma (optical designer) is here and perhaps could tell you that designing a rangefinder is not complicated (as long as the viewfinder and rangefinders are separate)

So the end product would be a camera cheaper than a Mamiya 7 while being a medium format rangefinder that is extremely light and that can mount inexpensive lenses.

 

[quixotic]

Any chance that a future iteration might have a bubble level and shift capability?

 

[beakhammer]

Any chance that a future iteration might have a bubble level and shift capability?

You can add your own bubble level, and with medium format backs you can use some available MF shift lenses, coupled with a special shutter.

The most obvious use for these Mercury cameras though is not to try and replicate the movements of large-format view cameras. If you want to play around with movements, get a view camera. The most practical use of a Mercury is to put together a much lighter and more flexible version of the classic press cameras. I have a Crown Graphic which I inherited from my dad and I am building a DIY field camera with movements, and I have also ordered the 4x5 version of the Mercury so that I can use the same lenses and film backs on all three of these cameras. I love my Crown Graphic, but I don't want to stuff it into a backpack and take it with me on a ski-mountaineering trip. That's what the Mercury is for. My Crown Graphic is a great camera, but the bellows focusing is over-kill when you want to work fast, and may be too delicate for more extreme conditions. The same goes for a view camera. I have some old folders that work pretty well for this kind of use, but they max out at 6x9, the lenses don't quite match my LF lenses and shutters for quality, they are limited to only "normal" focal lengths, and the folders are not as sturdy as I'd like. I will be able to shoot 4x5 with the Mercury. For my uses the big Fuji and Mamiya medium format range-finders are the most competitive option, but they are a lot more expensive, with fewer focal length and format options.

 

[beakhammer]

I was going to write the same. Diapositivo's post (above) is excellent, my feelings exactly.

As for the camera, i wish them all the best, but i can't understand what is the advantage compared to a normal large format camera -- which can also mount "any" lens and you can fit many kinds of different film formats at the back. The proposed "Universal" camera adds no rangefinders or reflex devices to bring something new to the table.

Also, it can't truly "mount any lens" because the lens requires to have a shutter. If the camera had a focal plane shutter then it would be really universal, but I agree that would make it an extremely difficult project.

Now, if i can make a suggestion, it would be -- a modern version of the Kodak Medalist camera. Allow people to mount old, good, inexpensive 6x9 or 6x7 or 6x6 lenses with shutter (for example, Agfa Solinar lenses for the Agfa folder cameras in their Compur or Prontor shutters; and the japanese equivalents of said cameras) on a camera that provides a viewfinder and a rangefinder. All this with the advantage of modern ABS materials making it a very light camera. You can also 3D print custom 'rangefinder cams' to cater for the many lenses out there, in the common focal lengths to be found: 75, 80, 100, 105mm. Make the back a simple 120 film back for 6x7 or 6x9 or 6x6 or 6x4.5, but make the film backs interchangeable so it is quick. Add the helicoid as well.

This leverages your advantages - lightweight construction, novel nylon 3D printed helicoid. This could give a durable camera without, for example, the disadvantages of bellows (which are a bit delicate). Nodda Duma (optical designer) is here and perhaps could tell you that designing a rangefinder is not complicated (as long as the viewfinder and rangefinders are separate)

So the end product would be a camera cheaper than a Mamiya 7 while being a medium format rangefinder that is extremely light and that can mount inexpensive lenses.

You can do exactly what you describe here using existing Mercury components, except for your idea for a coupled rangefinder. Someone will have to work on that.