New Ilford products due to launch tomorrow (2021-09-18)

[Auer]

"A built-in air vent at base of the darkroom allows for an optional fan / air blower to be used and once sealed the incoming air will also expand the inner dimensions. A smaller vent is also included closer to the top of the darkroom to attach air extraction tubes (not included)."

Nice.
I suppose you should have some kind of filter if using a fan?

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

Nice.
I suppose you should have some kind of filter if using a fan?

You would think so. I certainly would want something, especially in such a confined space.

 

[NB23]

No no nooooo! TMY-2 is the very best. It’s a testimony of how good a film can be made. Even the spectral sensitivity is perfect. No BW film look better.

Every time I print from this film I’m floored at how everything falls into place.

If finer grain is your only criteria - sure. Everything else is subjective. TMY-2 requires more post-scanning shenanigans to shake off the "metallic" scent and add the warmth I want my photos to have. Delta 400, on the other hand, is almost perfection after a slight gamma adjustment. And then there's the pure perfection - HP5+. I know, this sounds hand wavy, but since you used the word "compete", Delta 400 out-competes TMY-2 in my universe on every single criteria I care about (including silly things like packaging. I avoid films that aren't sold in individual carton boxes because I need the film tab). Even if it was $3/roll I still wouldn't use it. Different strokes, as always.

 

[Nicholas Lindan]

I do not understand the logic of the tent.

It isn't hard to black-out a room, so I can't see an advantage to using the tent indoors. I have blacked out rooms in my parent's house when I was growing up; blacked out dorm rooms at university, blacked out apartment kitchens and presently use a blacked-out bedroom. For printing the black-out requirements are pretty modest. I often printed in the mostly blacked out kitchen with the living room's sliding doors open to the night air.

If you need in-the-field prints then I can only surmise it is a commercial enterprise and surely a digital camera and a printer (and a power inverter, if needed) are the way to go.

A source of power is a must - for running the ventilation fan, the enlarger, the safelight and other accessories. Either run a long extension cord or carry gel-cells and an inverter.

Making prints usually requires running water nearby (either water running through a pipe or the photographer running with a bucket). Stabilization processing makes some sense, but it has no benefit to a customer over an ink-jet print.

As for developing film in the field to insure you got the image - all you need is a changing bag and a daylight tank (used in real natural daylight, imagine that).

It makes sense for wet-plate/tintype photographers where an on-site darkroom is required. But Ilford, TTBOMK, doesn't make or sell wet-plate materials so I'm not sure how this fits their business.

The tent can't be made using Ilford's present manufacturing capability. This makes less and less business sense. I imagine someone developed the tent and approached Ilford to distribute it for them.

The Nova tent isn't carried by B&H, which says something about demand for it. It also costs ~$750-$1,000; decidedly a specialty item.

 

[Pieter12]

Too bad Ilford didn't come through with more paper sizes--square ones to be more precise--rather than waste time, energy and resources to out-source this tent thing that seems of dubious value.

 

[AgX]

I do not understand the logic of the tent.

It isn't hard to black-out a room, so I can't see an advantage to using the tent indoors.

It depends on the architecture, the environment and living conditions within the appartment.

I can think of situations:
-) where blacking out a room is at least the same hassle as erecting such tent.
-) where it is not possible to black out a room as others have to use it the same time too.
-) were there is no dark night.

Also such tent gives confinement which may be seen as benefitial, even when basically a whole room could be used.

 

[faberryman]

Presumably Ilford conducted some market research and determined the tent would appeal to a certain segment of film photographers. But maybe not. Maybe they are just taking a flier on it. The upside is now film photographers won't have an excuse for not making wet prints.

 

[pentaxuser]

I think they still do - but the distribution was not great outside of the UK. I think Ilford have identified that their film developing kit has helped sales of film & chemistry, and people's biggest reason for not printing on darkroom paper is 'lack of a darkroom' - or in the last 18 months, lack of access to one, and it's in Ilford's interests to resolve that.

Yes it seems to me that Ilford is trying to promote darkroom work with what I assume to be an easily erected darkroom that is collapsible as well so the space used can be instantly converted back to its normal use. As AgX says this may well be a better solution for some people who cannot alter a bathroom which is needed for its prime purpose and other than very large cupboards which not everyone has, the tent may well be the only solution

It suggests that it is maybe getting a little concerned about sales of darkroom paper and wants to try to encourage those who home process film but then go "hybrid" via scanning and/or inkjet printing to try darkroom printing instead

Based on Ilford figures on film and darkroom paper sales it would seem that it is the latter that is suffering.

pentaxuser

 

[Dismayed]

TMY-2 is really in a league of its own. Delta 100 is a good competitor to TMX but I don’t know if Delta 400 would really compete with TMY-2 other than on price alone (TMY-2 is expensive).

I prefer TMY-2, but Ilford isn't offering a competitive product in 4x5. Yes, Delta 400 isn't as nice, but it's the closest that Ilford gets.

What would really excite me is if Ilford purchased the Fujifilm film business. They could sell color film, and revive the Neopan emulsions.

 

[Pieter12]

Yes it seems to me that Ilford is trying to promote darkroom work with what I assume to be an easily erected darkroom that is collapsible as well so the space used can be instantly converted back to its normal use. As AgX says this may well be a better solution for some people who cannot alter a bathroom which is needed for its prime purpose and other than very large cupboards which not everyone has, the tent may well be the only solution

It suggests that it is maybe getting a little concerned about sales of darkroom paper and wants to try to encourage those who home process film but then go "hybrid" via scanning and/or inkjet printing to try darkroom printing instead

Based on Ilford figures on film and darkroom paper sales it would seem that it is the latter that is suffering.

pentaxuser

You're probably right. I see a great number of the members here who do not wet print. Do they print at all?
I still would like some 12x12 neutral FB paper.

 

[Lachlan Young]

Yes it seems to me that Ilford is trying to promote darkroom work with what I assume to be an easily erected darkroom that is collapsible as well so the space used can be instantly converted back to its normal use. As AgX says this may well be a better solution for some people who cannot alter a bathroom which is needed for its prime purpose and other than very large cupboards which not everyone has, the tent may well be the only solution

It suggests that it is maybe getting a little concerned about sales of darkroom paper and wants to try to encourage those who home process film but then go "hybrid" via scanning and/or inkjet printing to try darkroom printing instead

Based on Ilford figures on film and darkroom paper sales it would seem that it is the latter that is suffering.

pentaxuser

I think the outcome of their research matches what I have found out there in the real world - people really want to make darkroom prints (and not necessarily big ones either - most are happy with 8x10-9.5x12) but the lack of access to darkrooms for various reasons & the difficulties in setting up semi-permanent home darkroom facilities is what is stopping them. The Nova tent was heavily promoted in the past by Roger Hicks & Frances Schultz - and similar devices used to be pretty common for demos at exactly the kind of show Ilford introduced this tent at. The dimensions are plenty big enough for something like a Focomat II(a or c) and even an Omega 4x5 or a De Vere 504 could be persuaded to fit with space to spare for trays etc.

I prefer TMY-2, but Ilford isn't offering a competitive product in 4x5.

Ilford could offer a competing product, but have chosen not to. From a purely manufacturing standpoint, I imagine they'd rather dump HP5+ and make Delta 400 (as it is made on their latest, most efficient emulsion plant) - but people keep insisting on buying HP5+ in preference. The reality is that there are probably too many 400 speed B&W films in the marketplace right now - Adox have essentially said as much.

What would really excite me is if Ilford purchased the Fujifilm film business. They could sell color film, and revive the Neopan emulsions.

Ilford has pretty close business relationships with Fuji - close enough that if Fuji decided to revive Neopan 400 and 1600, Ilford could probably make them (as they apparently may have done in the past).

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

I've done side by side comparisons of TMY-2 and Delta 400. The differences are quite subtle, even with Delta's slightly more sensitivity to red. If you don't have any red objects in the shot, you'd be hard pressed to spot the differences. Both are excellent films...

 

[Pieter12]

difficulties in setting up semi-permanent home darkroom facilities

I don't know. You need space for that tent, you need to haul water in and out, run an electrical cord to it, hang a safelight somewhere inside and vent it (it seems awfully small to leave unvented). A lot of hassle for a casual printer, not terribly convenient for someone who needs to print regularly. Maybe they should have introduced a larger one while they were at it?

 

[Lachlan Young]

I don't know. You need space for that tent, you need to haul water in and out, run an electrical cord to it, hang a safelight somewhere inside and vent it (it seems awfully small to leave unvented). A lot of hassle for a casual printer, not terribly convenient for someone who needs to print regularly. Maybe they should have introduced a larger one while they were at it?

It's the same size as the Nova tent. it is not intended to be plumbed - print washing is to be done elsewhere.

The tent is about 50x50" floor area internal.

 

[Willyekerslike]

I think the tent idea is first class. It is larger than my darkroom which measures 103cm x 135cm, quite a bit less than 48" x48".

The advantage I have is I can have shelves on the wall and my enlarger is wall mounted. I use Nova vertical processors for developer, stop and fix, prints are then transfered to the bathroom for washing. Maximum print size I can work with 12" x 16" and it is a push at that size. I actually do dish developing mostly and have two fixer slots in the Nova. So small spaces can be used if you are prepared to accept the limitations.

 

[Alex Benjamin]

It depends on the architecture, the environment and living conditions within the appartment.

I can think of situations:
-) where blacking out a room is at least the same hassle as erecting such tent.
-) where it is not possible to black out a room as others have to use it the same time too.
-) were there is no dark night.

Also such tent gives confinement which may be seen as benefitial, even when basically a whole room could be used.

This.

I don't have a single room in my house that can be easily made light-free, for various reasons. I have a room in the basement at my mother's house that I was planning to transform into a small darkroom, but that meant months of work. Now, I'll I can just fit the tent in there and not worry about building walls and all.

Comments have focused on printing, but I see much more use to this. This will make my life so much easier in terms of loading and unloading 4x5 holders! And since the environment is small and closed, with ventilation, it might also be very practical for hanging films to dry.

The one thing I'm curious about is electricity. How do you run an electric cable in and out of this thing (for the enlarger, timer, etc.) without breaking the light seal? Ilford?

 

[pentaxuser]

Certainly when I was on my night school darkroom course it was the printing that attracted me. Yes, learning how to develop film was interesting but once I had my first set of negs I couldn't wait to have a go at printing and this was true of all my fellow students. The tutor had to practically throw us out of the darkroom when the evening session ended.

I was able to convert a spare bedroom to a darkroom but I fear that most of my fellow students who were much younger and were either still living at home or in rented accommodation had no such opportunity. I did not keep in touch with any of them but I fear that the night school may have been their only chance to do any darkroom work

Most camera clubs were in the process of changing to digital and were simply enthralled at the prospect and those who had small darkrooms were not bothering to use them.

We may be seeing a revival of film but from what I can see this certainly has not translated into new public darkrooms within anything like easy travelling distance of where I live.

So producing the equipment to create a temporary darkroom may be what Ilford feels is a way and perhaps the only way it can help with to tempt film users to take the next step into darkroom printing

pentaxuser

 

[Alex Benjamin]

Most camera clubs were in the process of changing to digital and were simply enthralled at the prospect and those who had small darkrooms were not bothering to use them.

We may be seeing a revival of film but from what I can see this certainly has not translated into new public darkrooms within anything like easy travelling distance of where I live.

Same in Montreal. The few remaining labs have seen their workload increased, but the few places where you could rent darkroom time have closed or haven't yet reopened.

 

[calebarchie]

This looks strikingly similar to the one I made some 6 years ago, even down to the table and shelving setup
https://www.thecontainerlab.com/blog/2019/7/27/early-days

 

[MattKing]

The tent looks to be very useful for the large percentage people of young people who are living in spaces that are 500 square feet or smaller.

 

[NB23]

This looks strikingly similar to the one I made some 6 years ago, even down to the table and shelving setup
https://www.thecontainerlab.com/blog/2019/7/27/early-days

Let’s agree that it would have been very difficult to come up with anything different... except if they went artistic with an exterior look akin to a Castle with Cornices

This being said, I applaud you for your ingenuity and design. Are you still using your tent?

 

[calebarchie]

Let’s agree that it would have been very difficult to come up with anything different... except if they went artistic with an exterior look akin to a Castle with Cornices

This being said, I applaud you for your ingenuity and design. Are you still using your tent?

It wasn't anything particularly novel I think I looked to Nova's solution at the time, didn't end up using it for very long - working on something better (see newer blog posts). Wasn't all that practical for enlargement, I used it mostly for digital neg contact prints.

 

[Don_ih]

Why is no one excited about the calendar?

 

[foc]

I am delighted to see Ilford introduce innovative/new products.
I think their simplicity starter kit was a great idea to introduce people to B&W home film developing.
Now the popup darkroom tent is a logical follow-on to this idea.
It is basically a portable pop-up darkroom that can be used for print or film developing, tanks loading, sheet film , etc.

I can't imagine Ilford introducing any products "on the fly". They would have done their market research (like any other company) and chosen the product/s best suited to their objectives.

Personally, I look forward to the 12 days of film calendar. It sounds like a bit of fun.

 

[Tom Kershaw]

I can't imagine Ilford introducing any products "on the fly". They would have done their market research (like any other company) and chosen the product/s best suited to their objectives.

It is good that "ILFORD" are considering products that match their target market, but it also seems clear that some of the emphasis from the management buyout days of communication on this forum and to established darkroom workers seems to have been de-emphasised.