Negative stop bath

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chiller

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What if any differences are there in using Citric acid as opposed to Acetic acid for stop bath? -- Kodak indicator as an example?

Assuming both are correctly mixed to give the same pH is there some other chemistry at play?
 

MurrayMinchin

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MattKing said:
Psst Murray - I think it's 'Electric Koolaid Acid Test'

So sorry. My memory from that time in my life is a wee bit hazy...

Murray

P.S. Wasn't there, just read the book.
 

Q17

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MurrayMinchin said:
Whew...sure glad you aren't one of them hardcore 'Electric Acid Koolaid Test' & Rinse guys from the late sixties who's barely hanging onto their last shred of reality!

Murray

P.S. The young punks won't get that reference :wink:

Hey! I have a first edition of The Electric Kool-Aid Acid Test... and I'm hanging on to every shred of "young punk" I can!!!

(back to negative stop baths... sorry for the highjack)

=michelle=
 

Tom Hoskinson

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chiller said:
What if any differences are there in using Citric acid as opposed to Acetic acid for stop bath? -- Kodak indicator as an example?

Assuming both are correctly mixed to give the same pH is there some other chemistry at play?

Acetic Acid is a stronger acid (lower pH) than Citric Acid and has a stronger odor than Citric Acid.

Citric Acid based stop baths are essentially odorless.
 

Tom Hoskinson

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Kim Catton said:
soooo... water should be OK is what I can read from the many many Replies :O) Or at least, many of you guys says that water is OK. What should I do with the water? let it rins through the tank? agiation?

regards, kim

With a small tank that has a capacity of about 500 ml, I pour in about 300 to 400ml of water, invert the tank about 5 times (while rotating it) and then dump the water.
 

ricksplace

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I used to use stop bath (Kodak indicator) for film. I changed to water on the advice of a pro when I got a few pinholes in some lith sheet film. I've never looked back. I use water out of the tap at the same temp as the developer. I do 4 to 5 complete changes of the water with agitation at each change. Seems to work OK. No pinholes and the fix seems none the worse for wear.

Rick
 

Tom Hoskinson

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Rick, 4 to 5 complete changes of water (in lieu of stopbath) sounds like overkill to me - but, If it aint broke, don't fix it!
 

dancqu

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Kim Catton said:
Whats the best way to "stop" ?

Stop development that is. To do that the developer
with in the emulsion must be inactivated. No problem.

Water alone may well be a faster stop than any acid stop.
Water molecules are small, and fast, with long path. They will
reach deep within the emulsion far ahead of those large, and
slow, short path acid molecules.

Within a few seconds the developer's ph has dropped to a
level where it could, for any practical purpose, be considered
active. With in those same first few seconds a considerable
dilution of the developer takes place.

The amount of developer to be dealt with is almost non
existent. Some don't think it enough to bother with and skip
the "stop", whatever it might be. That is my usual method;
develop, fix. I use a metered amount of fix, use it once
and done with it. If I do use a water stop it is distilled
water at room temperature.

I place no value on a quick stop. Acid stops were the
norm for many years because acid hardening fixers followed.
To days films are prehardened. Dan
 
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Tom Hoskinson

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Alessandro Serrao said:
I feel the best way to make a stop solution is to use some citric acid. Any recipe you can get from Apug or the web will do.

Or read pages 1 & 2 of this thread...
 
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