Mystery Camera #5

[PGraham3]

Howdy, APUG! This camera and lens look super cool! Looks like a Leica M2, M4 or M5, right? What do y'all think? What do you think that lens is?
Also, trying to figure out when this picture was shot. Tank and soldier generally look like from the Vietnam War, but could possibly be from another skirmish somewhere in the late 1950s?
Thanks, APUG!
-Paul

 

[E. von Hoegh]

M4(?) or MP(?), Summicron, Leicameter. Viet Nam.

 

[AgX]

Mystery photographer?

 

[E. von Hoegh]

Mystery photographer?

With a stud in his ear...

 

[choiliefan]

Catherine LeRoy? Googled femme vietnam photog...

 

[E. von Hoegh]

Catherine LeRoy? Googled femme vietnam photog...

I think you may be correct!
Damn, we're good!

 

[macfred]

He is a she - Dickey Chapelle https://petapixel.com/2015/12/29/di...ork-of-the-legendary-female-war-photographer/

 

[AgX]

With a stud in his ear...

That is why I asked.
There were not that many female professional photographers in Vietnam I assume.
There had been thousands of women in the US forces there, but how many of them had a Leica M? And I do not know US uniforms for details.

 

[choiliefan]

It's Dicky. EVH: we weren't that good after all.

 

[AgX]

Yes, Dickey Chapell.

But... why was she wearing a gun?

 

[E. von Hoegh]

It's Dicky. EVH: we weren't that good after all.

Hey, we were 90% there...

 

[E. von Hoegh]

Yes, Dickey Chapell.

But... why was she wearing a gun?

View attachment 194446

Posing for a picture?

 

[Paul Howell]

She was killed not long after that shot was taken, 1965.

 

[AgX]

I am asking as I wonder whether a civilian was allowed to wear a gun, even a combat gun in seemingly a US military surrounding.
For me European that may be more puzzling as to you Americans, used to civilians doing so even in civilian surrounding.

 

[Paul Howell]

The photo posted by OP was taken in the states by a Marin Corps Photogprher. She was killed by an IED late in 65, another JP took a photo of her being given her last rites.

 

[E. von Hoegh]

I am asking as I wonder whether a civilian was allowed to wear a gun, even a combat gun in seemingly a US military surrounding.
For me European that may be more puzzling as to you Americans, used to civilians doing so even in civilian surrounding.

That's not as prevalent as some media would lead you to believe. I have never seen a civilian carrying a firearm in any other settings than the target range and the wilderness during hunting season. This may be different in the uncivilised regions of the U.S., such as Texas and some urban areas.

 

[Paul Howell]

It was a stage photograph, civilian PJs were for the most part not allowed to carry weapons. When I was still in high school I remember reading about and seeing her work and was surprised when she was killed, at the time being young I had a hard accepting the idea that woman would be killed in action, such a long time ago, much as changed including my innocence. There is an online article from the Washington Post dated 2015 about her with a nice sampling of her work.

 

[PGraham3]

Interesting history. Good researching, everyone.
Leica M4/MP, I suppose.
Always makes me wonder, wouldn't a rangefinder be kinda difficult to focus amid a firefight or something? I've used a few rangefinders, and I noticed it always take a little longer to figure out that I'm in exact focus for what I want to shoot. Amid a firefight, I wouldn't want to be sticking out trying to focus, etc. I figured back in the day a Nikon F/F2 would be a sure shot and fast focus in these types of situations.
-Paul

 

[E. von Hoegh]

Interesting history. Good researching, everyone.
Leica M4/MP, I suppose.
Always makes me wonder, wouldn't a rangefinder be kinda difficult to focus amid a firefight or something? I've used a few rangefinders, and I noticed it always take a little longer to figure out that I'm in exact focus for what I want to shoot. Amid a firefight, I wouldn't want to be sticking out trying to focus, etc. I figured back in the day a Nikon F/F2 would be a sure shot and fast focus in these types of situations.
-Paul

What rangefinders have you used? With a good one and some practice, they are very fast to focus.

 

[John Koehrer]

The camera doesn't seem to have a RW knob like an M4, not familiar with the MP but don't the newer ones have the older style knobs?
That would make it M2, M3, or MP(?)

In the A Shau valley Joe Galway was armed so never say never. Read "We Were Young Once"

 

[Paul Howell]

When I was a working PJ in the 70s and 80s I carried a SLR and most often a rangefinder, as a second body, either a Leica IIIG or Canon 7s with a 50mm or 28mm. Both were fast, the Canon with lever film advance faster than the IIIG, easy to focus, when in the Air Force we used Leica M2 and 3s, faster to change lens, but slower to load. Never had the money, but wanted a Nikon SP with motor drive.

 

[Trask]

I think it’s possible that her “carrying” that weapon is an illusion. Doesn’t it look unusually huge, extending from below her knee to the bridge of her nose? And her body posture doesn’t seem consistent with her carrying an item that heavy. And look at the shadow of the gun on the sandbags right behind her — note the shadow of the carry handle and the barrel, both of which are very large because the rifle is actually not in the same plane as her body. Somehow that weapon is propped up vertically in the foreground, and she is behind it, creating the illusion it is on her shoulder. And look at her body language and face — does she appear to be in a situation where she’d have that rifle on her shoulder, while walking around with a Leica and Visoflex on a tripod?

 

[drkhalsa]

I think it’s possible that her “carrying” that weapon is an illusion.

Yes, the rifle and mortar tube appear to be in the same plane in the foreground. She is beyond the rifle.

 

[Theo Sulphate]

I think it’s possible that her “carrying” that weapon is an illusion. ... And her body posture doesn’t seem consistent with her carrying an item that heavy. ....

I think it is an illusion and I'll explain why below.

But it's not that heavy at all. I believe it's a Colt 603 / XM16E1 based on the triangular handguard, 3-prong flash hider, and, more importantly, what appears to be the outline of the newly-introduced forward assist. I could be wrong. I'm not an expert on these rifles because varmint-caliber rifles which foul their own chamber aren't my idea of a good military weapon. I have much better weaponry at my Summer home, but I digress...

So, what strikes me is the angle of the rifle. If she did have the strap properly slung over her shoulder, the rifle would tilt with the top of the receiver away from us, but the grip and magazine would angle towards us.

 

[AgX]

At second look I got that impression too. But at third look I saw the strap of the gun running over her shoulder.
And that is why I raised that issue of a civilian wearing a gun.

But maybe we better go back to cameras...