Multi-Layer Platinum and Palladium printing

[michael9793]

Okay, I was doing some checking on the internet about some more info on 4 color gum printing when i came across an article which had some info on multi layer Pt/Pl printing. All I could get out of it was, that doing at least 3 layers gives you much better deep tones and your black are a lot more rich. from there I can not find anyone doing it or any articles on the layers of negatives used. Are they like the 4 color gum with different separation negatives exposing for different tones on the final print or are you using the same negative. I understand the registration thing. I do it all the time.:confused:

 

[Bob Carnie]

We are playing with this.In our case we are trying every possible combination and have been getting poor to wonderful results.
we are using a different negative for the second hit., some people use the same registered negative to build up Dmax.
In our case we are using a soft negative first and then a very shadow negative second and adding gum , cyanotype or a second hit of pd.
You will have no problem with this if you are already doing registration printing.

Okay, I was doing some checking on the internet about some more info on 4 color gum printing when i came across an article which had some info on multi layer Pt/Pl printing. All I could get out of it was, that doing at least 3 layers gives you much better deep tones and your black are a lot more rich. from there I can not find anyone doing it or any articles on the layers of negatives used. Are they like the 4 color gum with different separation negatives exposing for different tones on the final print or are you using the same negative. I understand the registration thing. I do it all the time.:confused:

 

[michael9793]

thanks, I may try the same way I do my 4 color dichroms and work with density and shadows and highlights to see if I can print 3 different negatives to enhance the print.

 

[wildbillbugman]

If you just wish to increasae D-max, Bostick &Sullivan has found that treating your dry paper with dry fumed silica prior to applyiung your Pt/Pd will do that for you.
Bill

 

[artonpaper]

My understanding is that Irving Penn used multi layer platinum printing. Again, I'm not 100% sure, but somewhere I remember reading that he used a different negatives to build up highlight detail and shadow detail and D-max. These are from enlarged negatives. The prints are mounted on aluminum, presumably for dimensional stabilization. I have seen the ones mounted on aluminum and they are quite beautiful prints.

 

[Davec101]

My understanding is that Irving Penn used multi layer platinum printing. Again, I'm not 100% sure, but somewhere I remember reading that he used a different negatives to build up highlight detail and shadow detail and D-max. These are from enlarged negatives. The prints are mounted on aluminum, presumably for dimensional stabilization. I have seen the ones mounted on aluminum and they are quite beautiful prints.

As the previous poster suggests multi-layer platinum/palladium printing was used extensively by Irving Penn, the article referred to in the original post I wrote in the spring of this year, for those people interested you can download a copy here

As I suggested in my concluding remarks ‘A multi-layered approach to platinum printing not only increases the density of blacks possible but gives the platinum printer greater control over the final print. This is a results of being able to craft individual negatives for each successive layer, using differing exposures times…as well as using different contrast mixes of platinum and palladium for each layer.

Multiple hit printing is not needed for every type of image and as mentioned in the article 'exquisite results can be achieved with a single hit approach,' however for certain types of images you can achieve results that are simply not possible with a one hit as Penn found out early on in his Platinum printing experiments, this again i refer to in the article and is shown below :

His initial results using a single layered approach to platinum printing were in his own words as being ‘less than satisfactory’. Through extensive research and testing he was able ‘to replicate the process, but not in spirit.’ However in an interview for the book between Greenough and Penn in 2003 he told her of the moment he had an epiphany, she states

Persistent, Meticulous, but also intuitive, Penn had a breakthrough while he was working on a television commercial for Nescafe. As he looked at the first platinum print he had ever made he realised “in a flash” that he needed to coat, expose and develop his print multiple times in order to achieve the richness and complexity he desired. Also he immediately understood that in order to coat and develop his print several times, he needed to ensure that the paper did not change size during its repeated submersions in chemicals. To do this, he realized, the paper had to be attached to a stable material, such as aluminium.

 

[michael9793]

As the previous poster suggests multi-layer platinum/palladium printing was used extensively by Irving Penn, the article referred to in the original post I wrote in the spring of this year, for those people interested you can download a copy here

As I suggested in my concluding remarks ‘A multi-layered approach to platinum printing not only increases the density of blacks possible but gives the platinum printer greater control over the final print. This is a results of being able to craft individual negatives for each successive layer, using differing exposures times…as well as using different contrast mixes of platinum and palladium for each layer.

Multiple hit printing is not needed for every type of image and as mentioned in the article 'exquisite results can be achieved with a single hit approach,' however for certain types of images you can achieve results that are simply not possible with a one hit as Penn found out early on in his Platinum printing experiments, this again i refer to in the article and is shown below :

His initial results using a single layered approach to platinum printing were in his own words as being ‘less than satisfactory’. Through extensive research and testing he was able ‘to replicate the process, but not in spirit.’ However in an interview for the book between Greenough and Penn in 2003 he told her of the moment he had an epiphany, she states

Persistent, Meticulous, but also intuitive, Penn had a breakthrough while he was working on a television commercial for Nescafe. As he looked at the first platinum print he had ever made he realised “in a flash” that he needed to coat, expose and develop his print multiple times in order to achieve the richness and complexity he desired. Also he immediately understood that in order to coat and develop his print several times, he needed to ensure that the paper did not change size during its repeated submersions in chemicals. To do this, he realized, the paper had to be attached to a stable material, such as aluminium.

This article is where I started this crusade. So, it was you that started me going crazy to learn this process. I wish someone had a good learning curve on this but I guess sometime we will have to dig into our brains and start experimenting and see if you can come up with a technique to do this. I know it is forbidden to talk digi negs but I think this would be the easiest way to create the density you would be looking for and if you feel you want to spend a year looking for film that would work to produce what you want then do so. I have spent sometime getting my pin registration system together and using it with my UV light system too. I can make some pics if you are interested in it. It did cost some money but nothing like some of them out there and the light source is not what most of you may think of using or purchasing. I have been told on this site that it would not work but it works much better than I ever thought. Again thanks so far for the info.