Most cost-effective way to get into 500mm focal length photography?

[loccdor]

I have a 500mm f/8 lens, 4 elements, made by Kimunor, these are the same as lenses sold by Bower and other brands. It needs a stop down to f/16 to get "almost-okay" resolution, and of course you're using a high shutter speed, which results in using 800+ speed film. I think I got it used for about $50.

The Carl Zeiss Jennar Sonnar 180mm f/2.8 with 2x Arsenal Teleconverter K-6B actually maintains a pretty good resolution and speed, but it's a medium format lens and a real beast to haul around a natural area. It's also not quite as long as I would like.

Excluding mirror lenses, what's an affordable lens of this focal length that delivers good results at a reasonable aperture, like f/8? Any decent options in the hundreds of dollars range on the used market? I'd be willing to buy a camera to go with the lens if it's a good enough deal.

I'd like to be able to make a decent 12 to 15 inch print with it at least.

Thanks

 

[Paul Howell]

Depending on the mount, in AF the Sigma 170 to 500 5.6, stopped down to F6 to 11, but I would go with a Sigma or Tonkia 400 APO 5.6 I have both in Minolta A mount, pretty sharp, I made 11X14 with some crop without issue. I think the Sigma is a 6 element lens, not sure about the Tonika. Tamron also made a 400 5.6. The sharpest mirror lens is the first generation Vivitar S1 600mm f6, made by Perkin-Elmer.

 

[xkaes]

Since we have little idea what lens mount you are looking for, here is a rather long list of lenses that came in various mounts:

http://www.subclub.org/minman/lenstable.htm

 

[1957ExaktaVarexIIa]

My "solution" is the Carl Zeiss Tele-Tessar 300mm f/4 C/Y plus Mutar II 2x. Both are pretty cheap today.

Michael

 

[MattKing]

Is there any chance that the issues you are experiencing are being contributed to by camera movement and atmospheric haze?

 

[loccdor]

Is there any chance that the issues you are experiencing are being contributed to by camera movement and atmospheric haze?

I don't think so, I'm using tripods/monopods, 1/1000 shutter, and minimum focus distance for some shots, the 500mm Kimunor also suffers from very heavy chromatic aberration so I only use it with black and white. Even with f/16, it achieves about 2 megapixels of detailed resolution, maybe good for a 7 inch print. My cheap Epson flatbed outresolves it.

Here's an example 35mm frame, this is about as sharp as it gets. I compared it with an off-brand 70-210mm f/3.8 lens and at f/8 that lens is achieving around double the dpi even though it's nothing special.

Compared to 70-210mm f/3.8 @ f/8:

 

[ags2mikon]

Past 300mm things get more complicated so here is my 2 cents. A good 300mm with a 1.4x converter is about 420mm e.f. I have 2 lenses that have been pretty good. One is a Nikkor 300mm f4 af with a Nikon 1.4x converter and I use it on my Nikons. The other is a Tamron 300mm f 2.8 with a Tamron 1.4 converter. Because of the interchangeable mounts it fits all my other cameras and my Nikons. I also have a Tamron SP 500mm mirror lens that I bought for less than a hundred bucks. All of them need real sturdy support and attention to details. I know you discounted mirror lenses but I'm happy with mine. I also use it with my Nikon scope converter at the range. It's not quite a Kowa but close.

 

[loccdor]

My "solution" is the Carl Zeiss Tele-Tessar 300mm f/4 C/Y plus Mutar II 2x. Both are pretty cheap today.

Michael

That does look decent and affordable! Thanks.

 

[Donald Qualls]

I'm not sure why you're excluding mirror lenses. I've got a 500 f/8 mirror lens for my Nikkormat FT2 that's very good, and focuses down to (IIRC) about ten feet. It's actually lighter than the 400 f/8 I have in Adaptall/M42 mount, as well as easier to steady because there isn't that long, hollow tube to vibrate.

 

[Laurent]

I'm very happy with a 300/2.8 in Fd mount, plus 1.4x and 2x converters. Depending on light and subject I use either the 300 alone, 420mm or 600.

Very seldom the two converters, as 800mm is quite difficulté to'use, but the 600/5,6 is a hood combination.

I paid 500 for the lens, and about 150 for the converters

 

[loccdor]

Depending on the mount, in AF the Sigma 170 to 500 5.6, stopped down to F6 to 11, but I would go with a Sigma or Tonkia 400 APO 5.6 I have both in Minolta A mount, pretty sharp, I made 11X14 with some crop without issue. I think the Sigma is a 6 element lens, not sure about the Tonika. Tamron also made a 400 5.6. The sharpest mirror lens is the first generation Vivitar S1 600mm f6, made by Perkin-Elmer.

Thank you for the leads!

 

[loccdor]

I'm not sure why you're excluding mirror lenses. I've got a 500 f/8 mirror lens for my Nikkormat FT2 that's very good, and focuses down to (IIRC) about ten feet. It's actually lighter than the 400 f/8 I have in Adaptall/M42 mount, as well as easier to steady because there isn't that long, hollow tube to vibrate.

Well, it's the character of the bokeh that really rubs me the wrong way with them. If it weren't for that, I think they would work great for me.

 

[xkaes]

Well, it's the character of the bokeh that really rubs me the wrong way with them. If it weren't for that, I think they would work great for me.

If you mean the donut holes, that only happens some of the time, and is usually easy to control by moving the camera slightly to avoid small, bright spots. Otherwise, I find the bokeh to be pleasing -- but that's a matter of taste.

I have a great Sigma APO 500mm f7.2 and a Spiratone (Yashica/Tomioka) 500mm f8 CAT and I get great results from both of them. I recently stumbled across a Shutterbug -- that's really the name -- 500mm f6.3 CAT (also sold under the Vivitar Series 1, Kenko & other labels) for next to nothing due to its name & a minor problem that was easily fixed. I've only taken a few test shots so far, but the results are so good, I'll probably sell my Yashica CAT. Sure, the narrow DOF with a CAT is somewhat of a limitation, but the DOF is pretty good at a distance -- which is what you normally use with a long lens, Plus CATs are immune from chromatic aberration -- and smaller and lighter, and less expensive (did did mention least-expensive in the thread title).

Pick your poison, but don't knock it til you've tried it.

Another great CAT is the little-known Soligor C/D 650mm f8.5 CAT (also sold under the Bell & Howell and Osawa labels). Made by Tokina, but never sold under the Tokina label. Uses a T-mount and has a rotating, locking tripod socket. Slightly bigger than a 500mm CAT, but just as fast.

 

[Paul Howell]

That does look decent and affordable! Thanks.

Are you shooting Contax Yashica mount?

 

[Paul Howell]

Thank you for the leads!

You can pick up a Minolta 7XI or 800Si for very little money just to use with good quality 400 3rd party lens. The 7XI like the 9Xi used those terrible function cards for advanced features like auto bracket, I only use my 7 and 9 in manual mode and when shooting sports or wildlife I never bracket or use multiple exposure cards so in world of affordability a 7xi with a Sigma 400. Just need to be careful, Sigma made a 400 that will only work the 7000 and 9000.

 

[abruzzi]

this one--APO 50-500mm F4.5-6.3 DG OS HSM--is usually relatively popular among the birding crowd (I don't know what most of those letters mean. DG is "full frame", i.e. 35mm, OS a HSM I have no idea):

APO 50-500mm F4.5-6.3 DG OS HSM | LENSES | PRODUCTS | Sigma

This page is about Sigma's APO 50-500mm F4.5-6.3 DG OS HSM.

www.sigma-global.com

It comes in Canon EF, Nikon F, Pentax K, and Sony A which is that same as the Minolta AF right?

 

[Paul Howell]

this one--APO 50-500mm F4.5-6.3 DG OS HSM--is usually relatively popular among the birding crowd (I don't know what most of those letters mean. DG is "full frame", i.e. 35mm, OS a HSM I have no idea):

APO 50-500mm F4.5-6.3 DG OS HSM | LENSES | PRODUCTS | Sigma

This page is about Sigma's APO 50-500mm F4.5-6.3 DG OS HSM.

www.sigma-global.com

It comes in Canon EF, Nikon F, Pentax K, and Sony A which is that same as the Minolta AF right?

Sony used the Minolta A mount, but some Sony are SSM (micro motor driven, others are gear driven) and only the Minolta 7, 5 and factory updated 9 will work with SSM lens. Sony has discontinued the A mount line, body and lens for the Mirrorless E mount.

 

[benveniste]

this one--APO 50-500mm F4.5-6.3 DG OS HSM--is usually relatively popular among the birding crowd (I don't know what most of those letters mean. DG is "full frame", i.e. 35mm, OS a HSM I have no idea):

APO 50-500mm F4.5-6.3 DG OS HSM | LENSES | PRODUCTS | Sigma

This page is about Sigma's APO 50-500mm F4.5-6.3 DG OS HSM.

www.sigma-global.com

It comes in Canon EF, Nikon F, Pentax K, and Sony A which is that same as the Minolta AF right?

"DG" = Sigma's way of saying it was optimized for Digital use. They never did say what that optimization was.
"OS" = optical stablization
"HSM" = Hypersonic Motor

I had a Sigma 150-500mm f/5~6.3 for a while. It was, well, adequate if not spectacular. But with any pre "Global Vision" Sigma, compatibility can be a real problem, especially in Nikon mount.

 

[abruzzi]

"DG" = Sigma's way of saying it was optimized for Digital use. They never did say what that optimization was.

Interesting, in that, while you're probably right, it has come to be an identifier for "full frame" since its either that or DC which are "crop" APS-C lenses. But thats digital talking--I'll go do penance.

 

[loccdor]

I ended up going with the Canon New FD 300mm f/4 L lens and Canon 2X-A Extender. Together it cost $300. Looks sharp and free of chromatic aberration.

The more recent Sigmas are really great, but I've had problems with older Sigma's focusing motors going out. And then not being able to manually focus them either.

Thanks for the assistance.