Metz 45 CL4 fill flash

[Gary Holliday]

I took a portait using fill flash using Fuji NPH 400 and overcooked the fill slightly. The lab technician suggested that modern films don't require so much fill as they have excellent shadow detail.

I set the fill flash on the Metz 45 CL4 to around 2 stops below the ambient reading on auto mode.

Eg: 250s@ f8 ambient reading.
f4 auto mode on the Metz.

I'm not sure what went wrong, but how do I fool the flashgun into delivering less light?

Increase or decrease the ISO on the flashgun?
Drop it down to f2.8 on the flashgun?

My tests using the auto fire on the Metz gave the same reading when changing the aperture when it was unconnected to the camera. I'm confused!

I own the SCA adapter but have been reluctant to use it.



Haselblad 503CW
Metz 45 CL-4
Stofen diffuser
Minolta IV-F meter.

 

[Nick Zentena]

I set the fill flash on the Metz 45 CL4 to around 2 stops below the ambient reading on auto mode.

Eg: 250s@ f8 ambient reading.
f4 auto mode on the Metz.


I own the SCA adapter but have been reluctant to use it.



Haselblad 503CW
Metz 45 CL-4
Stofen diffuser
Minolta IV-F meter.

Was there anything in the scene to confuse the flash sensor? Black/dark colours? Were you too close?

I don't know about the Hassleblad module but the ones I've tried all work fairly well.

If you're outdoors doing lots of fill I adjust the film speed and leave the aperture to match the camera.

 

[David A. Goldfarb]

It sounds like you set it up the fill ratio right. Two stops under ambient should produce a very subtle effect, and it has nothing to do with how modern films hold shadow detail. Could you post a scan?

Are you sure it's not just a matter of the negs (i.e., misjudging the ambient exposure) or the proofs (i.e., the lab's mistake) being overexposed? 250 sec. at f:8 ambient exposure should be about right for open shade with an ISO 400 film.

 

[Gary Holliday]

Was there anything in the scene to confuse the flash sensor? Black/dark colours? Were you too close?

I don't know about the Hassleblad module but the ones I've tried all work fairly well.

If you're outdoors doing lots of fill I adjust the film speed and leave the aperture to match the camera.

Which direction do you turn the film speed on the flash? If using 400 ISO, does 1600 ISO on the flash produce less light?

I've misplaced the lead, so it looks like I'll have to use the SCA adapter. Will changing the ISO on the flash have the same effect on the SCA (TTL) mode?

 

[spijker]

If you expose at 400 ISO & F8, setting the flash to either 400 ISO & F4 or 1600 ISO & F8 should be correct to get the flash 2 stops below ambient. Why don't you meter the flash output with your Minolta IV-F meter. Then you know exactly how much light the flash gives.

When you use the SCA module for TTL flash metering, the camera electronics determine the flash's light output. Then it all depends on the Hasselblad's "intelligence". Again, measure the flash with the Minolta to get a reading on the flash's output.

You can also set the flash to manual mode (1, 1/2 or 1/4) and meter with the minolta. Then pick the setting where you get 2 stops below ambient.

Menno

 

[Nick Zentena]

Yes going to a higher film speed setting will lower the light output.

You've misplaced the SCA adapter? If you're in auto mode the flash takes the film speed from the setting on the flash. If you hadn't set it right in your first posting then it might have caused the problems.

 

[Gary Holliday]

Why don't you meter the flash output with your Minolta IV-F meter.

Menno

For some reason, I could not get accurate results from the light meter. Surely if I set f8 on the flashgun in auto mode, the IVF should also read f8 with the same ISO settings??

To answer Nick, I've lost the lead which goes from the Metz to PC connector, so I'll be using the SCA set up which I rarely use. Not exactly keen on using a set up which I'm unfamiliar with.

 

[Nick Zentena]

If you put the flash in auto mode then the SCA connector will just be an expensive sync cable. So no different then what you're used to.

 

[Gary Holliday]

I've decided to settle on the full SCA TTL metering. I use 400 ISO film, so hopefully the Hasselblad's 1000 ISO limit will give a subtle enough fill flash. If I can't get my hands on some polaroid film tomorrow, I'll use your suggestion Nick!

 

[Ed Sukach]

I am really confused as to just what is going on here.

There are three "modes" possible here;

1. Manual: The only controlling factor is limiting the Metz internally to deliver a fraction of its possible output. Usually selected by "M 1/4; M 1/2; M 1 ... or something like that. The only connection necessary is a simple cable between the flash unit and the PC connector on the lens (I understand you are using a Hasselblad 503CW) for synchronizing the flash output with the shutter.

2. Auto: The flash is regulated by the FLASH UNIT itself ... with no connection to the metering system in the "Blad". The amount of light reaching the scene is "read" by a thyristor sensor in the flash unit - and when sufficient, the flash is turned off. It is necessary to set an aperture value AND an ISO film speed on the dials on the flash. A single camera-to-PC connector cable is necessary - again for synchronization.
It is important here to make sure that the thyristor sensor is not "blocked".

3. OTF or TTL: "Off The Film" or "Through The Lens - In the 503 CW and the 503Cxi - it is Off The Film. There is a sensing cell located IN the body of the camera and aimed at the central portion of the film - indicated by the circular area in the center of the groundglass. An ISO film speed is set on the dial on the camera body, and when the amount of light exposing the film, and reflected back to the sensing cell is proper, the flash itself is turned off.
Here, TWO cables, a synch cable to the PC connector on the lens, and an SCA cable from the multi-pin socket on the camera body to the Metz for transmission of the OTF information from camera to flash are necessary.

I'm trying to keep things simple here - and I have no idea how well I am succeeding. Bogen-Satter "handles" Metz Flash units in the USA - and they have proved themselves to be GOOD people. You might want to contact them for a copy of the Metz CT4 and SCA (Are you sure you have the correct SCA adapter?) manuals.

I have the Hasselblad "ProFlash 4504"; a Metz CT4 with a built-in SCA adapter. I use it in OTF mode ALL the time. I LOVE this puppy. I have done work where the model was standing in front of a spectacular sunset: first metering for the sunset, and then setting the OTF system to the proper film speed. The result: A well-exposed -- (ahem!!!) model in front of what appears to be a "Painted" sunset. I don't know of another system that would work as well - without all kinds of mathematical calculations.

Tell you what ... PM me an address, and I'll send you a copy of the ProFlash 4504 manual.

 

[arigram]

Its an old thread, but it still stands, especially the wonderful information by Ed.
I just want to inform people that Metz (and Hasselblad) has discontinued the SCA
390 adaptor that the Hasselblad bodies need for OTF metering. Just got an official
email from Hasselblad, reply to my query of its status.

Cameras and paper get all the publicity, but even small accessories like that can
seriously impact the use of film cameras.
One can no longer connect a Metz flash with a Hasselblad, which is not a small deal.

 

[Ed Sukach]

????

What the $*%^*% is the rationale behind that move by Hasselblad?

What COULD be the rationale?? - To effectively obsolete the OTF systems on all their 503 Series???

 

[arigram]

Hasselblad has been slowly discontinuing their V line.
An example of their new attitude is that their new repair/upgrade program is limited to H camera users.
Probably they think that photographers that use Hasselblad and flashguns, mostly wedding and fashion
pros are all switched to the H line.
Anyway, this is the email I got:

Dear Aristotelis,

the SCA 390 is no longer available as it has been discontinued from Metz.

Best regards,

Jan Pettersson

Hasselblad Technical Support
www.hasselblad.com

Pretty short and to the point: blame Metz.
Yet Metz's website still lists their flashguns as compatible with Hasselblads.
Maybe I should also email Metz.

 

[Nick Zentena]

390 I'm guessing is a 300 series module. Do they have a 3000 module ? Or whatever is the latest great version.

 

[arigram]

390 I'm guessing is a 300 series module. Do they have a 3000 module ? Or whatever is the latest great version.

Metz still provides the 300A and Hasselblad now only carries the 3902 which is for the H series.

 

[arigram]

Now the greek representative of Metz tells me that SCA 300A is not available anymore.
Damn it. Where am I going to find it?

 

[arigram]

Ok, so I got the SCA 300A (the greek store apparently -did- have atleast one in stock -typical), but is this the way it supposed to go?
I never seen anything more awkward and kludge in my whole life!
If you put the adaptor in the rail with the wires facing the lens, it refuses to go all the way in unless you give it space by turning the ISO dial down and thus locking the ISO at 3200 or 64 (can't see which). If you put it the other way with the label facing front, it goes in but the cabling is all messed up.