Making a glass holder- nikon 9000

weasel · Jan 31, 2008

I have a nikon 9000 scanner, and for mf work the holder really does not hold the film flat well. The glass carriers seem awfully expensive for what they are, and for what Nikon charges for the scanner it is obscene that a glass carrier is not included.
At any rate, has anyone made their own? It looks like if I cut a piece of anti newton glass to the right size, it could be laid on top of the negative in the existing holder and hold it flat.
Anybody try this, or something similar?

donbga · Jan 31, 2008

weasel said:
I have a nikon 9000 scanner, and for mf work the holder really does not hold the film flat well. The glass carriers seem awfully expensive for what they are, and for what Nikon charges for the scanner it is obscene that a glass carrier is not included.
At any rate, has anyone made their own? It looks like if I cut a piece of anti newton glass to the right size, it could be laid on top of the negative in the existing holder and hold it flat.
Anybody try this, or something similar?

Google is your friend; Ref.:

http://photo.net/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg?msg_id=00BwYx

Don Bryant

weasel · Feb 1, 2008

Thanks. I did a google but didn't find that link.

Greg_E · Feb 1, 2008

If you are going to go through the trouble, why not go the whole way and fluid mount the film:
http://www.scanscience.com/Film_Scanners.html

Waiting for my 8000 to arrive before I order a kit.

weasel · Feb 2, 2008

That looks like an awful lot of work for most scanning. Are the results really that much better?

Pinholemaster · Feb 2, 2008

Time is money.

I applaud those who have the time to make a holder from scratch.

My learning curve means it would end up more expensive then buying one from Nikon. I got the Nikon version.

Make sure you cut masks the correct way for the Nikon software recognizes the various formats you'll be using. Each mask made by Nikon has a special code cut into the mask.

Greg_E · Feb 2, 2008

I can let you know after I order mine. In reality the potential is yes it does make that much difference. And at least you would know the film is flat and there won't be any Newton rings.

You could always scan the film dry to weed out the less than wonderful frames, then wet scan just the frames that you want to keep.

weasel · Feb 2, 2008

The nikon holder I use now has no masks. What do you mean?

I have not had time to try it yet, but $6 got me a piece of etched antireflective glass cut to fit my negative carrier. I think this laid over top of the film should go a long way towards holding it flat.

toadhall · Feb 5, 2008

Don Bryant said:
Google is your friend; Ref.:

http://photo.net/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg?msg_id=00BwYx

Don Bryant

I did this a couple of years ago, and it works like a charm.

John

jordanstarr · Jan 20, 2010

I have also done this with my Nikon 8000. I just took off the clips, lay down the glass ontop of the negative (smoky side down), tack it still with electrical tape and the difference is amazing in my opinion. Check it out for yourself. I know the example should be made a little bigger, but if you look at the far left side of the frame, you can see the basket and far left side of the zucchini are sharper. You'll have to spend more time removing dust in the editing process, but it's worth it in my opinion.

nsouto · Jan 27, 2010

I have used AN glass from these folks:

http://www.fpointinc.com/glass.htm

to improve both the MF and the 35mm trays in my 9000.

For 35mm, I've made a brass wire frame that hinges on the original holding flap and is held in place by 4 swing tongues I've added. The film strip goes in the normal way, then two of the 35mm strips from the site above go on top, AN side in contact with the film, then the frame closes and holds everything perfectly flat.

Not only has the film curling disappeared but I also get near perfect focusing flatness across each frame.

For the MF tray, I use one or two of the MF-size AN glass strips from the above site, depending on how curled the film is.

For one strip, film goes in first emulsion side down, then glass strip goes on top with AN side down, then I close the original clips as they have plenty of give.

For two strip use I just remove the two original clips, lay on strip of glass with the AN side down, then the film - emulsion side down - then the top glass strip as before and sticky tape holds the lot together. The lot is like a sandwich with the film as the meat.

The reason for the bottom strip having the AN side down is that most film has a reasonably rough emulsion side and there is no need for AN to be against it.

But some of the modern films have a smooth emulsion side, and for those I use AN sides against the film in both top and bottom strips.

As I said, this is only needed for badly curled film. For most normal flat film, just one strip of glass is enough.

If you want photos of the whole thing, I'll see what I can do.

jjustad · Jul 11, 2010

Modified 869S Holder

I modify the 869S, adding 1 piece of ANR and 1 piece of clear for the Nikon 8000/9000. I charge $88, which includes shipping and have satisfied customers
and an 100% ebay feedback on this service. Note: I use genuine ANR glass
which is NOT the same as anti-reflective glass.

Also, I'm new to Hybrid Photo. Am I violating any rules by posting this?

Thanks, jj

you can contact me at: jjustad@gmail.com

drmoss_ca · Jul 13, 2010

Curiously, I managed to get an 869G today, and I'm surprised at how much "medium format shallow DOF" has gone away when the few negs I have tried this evening are flat!:rolleyes: An enormous difference.

Chris

glhs116 · Sep 30, 2010

I have just wasted an unreasonable amount of time trying to see any improvement at all from using the Focal Point glass. I must conclude that these aids will only help if you are having real problems with film curl. For my fairly flat film I so no measurable benefit and a slight loss of sharpness.

glhs116 · Oct 1, 2010

I would just like to clarify my above statement. The Focal Point products are good. I received some very nicely cut pieces of glass that fit properly and look of good quality. It's just that unless your film is actually curled beyond what the very good Nikon holders can flatten there is absolutely no benefit that I can detect, at least with dry use.

I suppose I should explain that I was vaguely confident that the AN glass might diffuse the light a little and therefore noticeably reduce the "pepper grain" effect of grain accentuation that seems typical of the Coolscans. I saw no evidence of this. Probably because it is not really a diffuser, just something that slightly blurs the light.

Secondly, I thought there might be some small sharpness benefit going from "pretty flat" to "utterly flat". However, it seems that what you lose by going through some glass more than makes up for whatever tiny depth of field benefit you gain.

I am glad to have the products and I'm glad to see how easy Nikon have made it to remove and replace the flaps on the holders. I've certainly learned more about scanning. I'm still quite interested in some sort of diffusor material like the Scanhancer product. From sample images I've seen it seems to deal with the pepper grain in a similar manner to wet scanning but without the hassle and mess.

pschwart · Oct 1, 2010

glhs116 said:
I would just like to clarify my above statement. The Focal Point products are good. I received some very nicely cut pieces of glass that fit properly and look of good quality. It's just that unless your film is actually curled beyond what the very good Nikon holders can flatten there is absolutely no benefit that I can detect, at least with dry use.

I suppose I should explain that I was vaguely confident that the AN glass might diffuse the light a little and therefore noticeably reduce the "pepper grain" effect of grain accentuation that seems typical of the Coolscans. I saw no evidence of this. Probably because it is not really a diffuser, just something that slightly blurs the light.

Secondly, I thought there might be some small sharpness benefit going from "pretty flat" to "utterly flat". However, it seems that what you lose by going through some glass more than makes up for whatever tiny depth of field benefit you gain.

I am glad to have the products and I'm glad to see how easy Nikon have made it to remove and replace the flaps on the holders. I've certainly learned more about scanning. I'm still quite interested in some sort of diffusor material like the Scanhancer product. From sample images I've seen it seems to deal with the pepper grain in a similar manner to wet scanning but without the hassle and mess.

This was not my experience. My 120 negs appeared to lay flat, but I could not achieve edge-to-edge sharpness until I used the glass I got from Focal Point.
In my experience, using the standard holder seriously limits what can be achieved. Of course, not all negatives are pretty flat -- some buckle, and others are on film bases that seriously curl. For these a glass holder is mandatory.

GKR1 · Nov 19, 2010

nsouto said:
I have used AN glass from these folks:

http://www.fpointinc.com/glass.htm

to improve both the MF and the 35mm trays in my 9000.

For 35mm, I've made a brass wire frame that hinges on the original holding flap and is held in place by 4 swing tongues I've added. The film strip goes in the normal way, then two of the 35mm strips from the site above go on top, AN side in contact with the film, then the frame closes and holds everything perfectly flat.

Not only has the film curling disappeared but I also get near perfect focusing flatness across each frame.

For the MF tray, I use one or two of the MF-size AN glass strips from the above site, depending on how curled the film is.

For one strip, film goes in first emulsion side down, then glass strip goes on top with AN side down, then I close the original clips as they have plenty of give.

For two strip use I just remove the two original clips, lay on strip of glass with the AN side down, then the film - emulsion side down - then the top glass strip as before and sticky tape holds the lot together. The lot is like a sandwich with the film as the meat.

The reason for the bottom strip having the AN side down is that most film has a reasonably rough emulsion side and there is no need for AN to be against it.

But some of the modern films have a smooth emulsion side, and for those I use AN sides against the film in both top and bottom strips.

As I said, this is only needed for badly curled film. For most normal flat film, just one strip of glass is enough.

If you want photos of the whole thing, I'll see what I can do.

I would love to see some pics of the setup, I'm debating if I need to fork out more dollars for the Nikon stuff.
I think I'll pick up the the whoile set of glasses for the 9000 carries. Anyone use the 35mm glass top?

Thanks

glhs116 · Nov 20, 2010

Well, this is not how the product is intended to be used but it will give you an idea what it looks like:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/samagnew/5122344047/in/photostream/

I found that with my film and environment I did not have any significant film flatness issues. I am now using the AN glass inserts as diffusers for the light source.

GKR1 · Nov 20, 2010

Thank you for the reply.

Intresting that you lay the ANR on top.

Do you think Iwould be better of getting nikon glass holder or should I get the ANR glass from focalpoint for 135 tray and MF.

Thanks

glhs116 · Nov 20, 2010

The Focal Point product will retain the batch features and costs much less. The main selling point of the Nikon rotating glass holder is allowing the scanning of other different formats like panoramic or 8mm.

Making a glass holder- nikon 9000

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