Lucky Films

[Sirius Glass]

If you accept Lucky's flaws (anti-halation coating, weak tape in 120 as already mentioned), the major issue ...

Hey, I got divorced, so I do not have to accept flaws.

Unless that is what you'all walk on!

Steve

 

[Robland]

On the 120 I have 3 of 9 rolls the paper backing and the film separated. I have the 10th roll in the fridge and I'm afraid to use it. I'm not a seasoned pro but no issue with Kodak film. I won't be using again.

 

[JBrunner]

Well, if it was more then a couple of years ago, there was Konica, who had their own film and paper manufacturing, we saw their colour stuff in Canada, not sure about B&W or what happened to the facility after they sold out to Sony. I used their film occasionally and it definitely wasn't re-badged Fuji either.

The film and packaging in question couldn't be anything but Chinese. Just the finish work on the paper packaging alone... a Japanese company would committed collective suicide over it.

 

[Sirius Glass]

On the 120 I have 3 of 9 rolls the paper backing and the film separated. I have the 10th roll in the fridge and I'm afraid to use it. I'm not a seasoned pro but no issue with Kodak film. I won't be using again.

You will not use which Lucky or Kodak?

Please advise, interested readers want to know!

Steve

 

[McFortner]

If you accept Lucky's flaws (anti-halation coating, weak tape in 120 as already mentioned), the major issue ...

Hey, I got divorced, so I do have to accept flaws. I'm on long term disability right now and can't be as choosy as I would like to be. I'm gonna take a roll out and run it through my pinhole camera as soon as it is is ready to be swapped out. But, hey, if anybody has any Lucky in 35mm they don't want, then they can feel free to send it my way and I promise I will dispose of it properly!

Michael

 

[wogster]

The film and packaging in question couldn't be anything but Chinese. Just the finish work on the paper packaging alone... a Japanese company would committed collective suicide over it.

In that case....

Back to the topic at hand, I see enough cheap Chinese made junk every day, they will be issuing an extreme cold weather alert in Hell before any Chinese made film sees the inside of any of my cameras.

 

[Sirius Glass]

In that case....

Back to the topic at hand, I see enough cheap Chinese made junk every day, they will be issuing an extreme cold weather alert in Hell before any Chinese made film sees the inside of any of my cameras.

Ahhh, a truly wise man.

Steve

 

[JBrunner]

Well, I strongly believe the J&C Pro100 was Lucky film for the reasons above, however I can't be certain, because I don't know for a fact that it was.
If I got a hold of some in 8x10 and shot it, I could probably tell you within 99%.

I can say that it was good film in the old style, expanded and contracted well with a near text-book expansion. These days I struggle with some otherwise fine films in that department, and keep returning to older style films, even though there are disadvantages. It wasn't particularly fine grained, but not a factor for 8x10. The emulsion was soft, but not as soft as Efke. It did not handle flare like a modern emulsion with a good AHL, but that is one of the reasons I liked it for certain things. IRRC its AHL was green. It was very good when I wanted a film that behaved with these legacy qualities. I wouldn't doubt it would be a middling film in 135, particularly on a thin base, but for LF it had some nice things going for it.

 

[fschifano]

It might have been ERA or Shanghai. I've seen 4x5 sheet film from one or the other of these brands. I've used 35 mm roll film from both these companies and trust me, they were a lot better.

 

[cmo]

TMY-2 is fantastic stuff. First time I developed a roll of the stuff, I was sold and I didn't even shoot it. A friend of mine picked up a few rolls and shot them in a Pentax 645 on the streets of midtown Manhattan. Now, anyone who's got any powers of observation and has ever been here on a sunny day will tell you that the contrast range of a scene can be completely off the hook.

Oh, I know... I messed up some shots in summer in Manhattan with Tmax 100. Tri-X was much better.

 

[cmo]

I can't tell you if it was Mandarin, but it wasn't film from Fuji, and that pretty much narrows it down to China, unless the North Koreans have a film coating facility tucked away under a missile bunker.

Cynical interjection:

You can't do film coating in an environment with that much radiation. Their leader has a radioactive hobby, and now he got cancer - Kim Jong is ill.

 

[Ian Grant]

It might have been ERA or Shanghai. I've seen 4x5 sheet film from one or the other of these brands. I've used 35 mm roll film from both these companies and trust me, they were a lot better.

I think you're right, probably ERA. I have a pack that one of the moderators threw in when I bought a lens from him, seemed quite a good film.

Ian

 

[2F/2F]

Oh, I know... I messed up some shots in summer in Manhattan with Tmax 100. Tri-X was much better.

I like this pic. I would be proud to have taken it!

 

[arigram]

Regarding the script, one way to tell if it was chinese or japanese is to note if it only uses ideograms as the Chinese do, or its a mixture of ideograms and syllabary (the rounded, simple, repeating figures of the hiragana are pretty obvious) as the Japanese do. After all, kanji is still chinese even if there are some differences.
As for the quality of chinese products, I wouldn't be so quick to condemn them especially since a lot, if not most of the bona fide, official products Westerns use by big name brands are constructed in mainland China or Taiwan and in some cases even designed there. There is a lot of production of good quality and bad quality copies (yes, there is such thing as good quality copy), a tradition in all the places in the world where copyright and copyright enforcement is very loose, especially of products by non native companies.
For example, the vast majority of bicycle frames is constructed in China. Almost all (with some notable exceptions) of cutting edge, high tech carbon fiber components are made and often designed in China, because they are in possession of the best technology, the largest factories and the know-how. It just happens that it isn't the Germans, the Japanese or the Americans that are the top in everything technologically and manufacturing wise.

I have not tried any of the Lucky film as they are not to be found around here. I have stuck with Ilford as not only they are common, they can be found in good prices and they give me what I want. Most of the time. I have found flaws in Ilford films, including manufacturing and wrong design choices, so just because you stereotypically brand someone as good or bad based on their ethnicity, it doesn't mean it is always like that.
As I have no experience with said film or their manufacturing process and technology, I cannot make a comment.
But of course, they could well be at the bottom of the barrel, but their price and availability is not an indication.

 

[railwayman3]

As for the quality of chinese products, I wouldn't be so quick to condemn them especially since a lot, if not most of the bona fide, official products Westerns use by big name brands are constructed in mainland China or Taiwan and in some cases even designed there. There is a lot of production of good quality and bad quality copies (yes, there is such thing as good quality copy), a tradition in all the places in the world where copyright and copyright enforcement is very loose, especially of products by non native companies.
For example, the vast majority of bicycle frames is constructed in China. Almost all (with some notable exceptions) of cutting edge, high tech carbon fiber components are made and often designed in China, because they are in possession of the best technology, the largest factories and the know-how. It just happens that it isn't the Germans, the Japanese or the Americans that are the top in everything technologically and manufacturing wise.

I'd agree with that, I only have to look around my own house to see how many products are now Made in China...top-end hi-fi, DVD player,microwave, clothes (big-name brand), high quality art books, etc.

China has been able to set up, from scratch, state-of-the-art factories able to manufacture on a large scale, and it seems that most goods from there are now high quality, with just a few sources still making low-end stuff and copies.

Broadly speaking, Japan started in the same way after WW2, then developed and innovated over the years.

No politics implied in my comments.

 

[nocrop]

The film and packaging in question couldn't be anything but Chinese. Just the finish work on the paper packaging alone... a Japanese company would committed collective suicide over it.

Have you been to Asia?

 

[wogster]

I'd agree with that, I only have to look around my own house to see how many products are now Made in China...top-end hi-fi, DVD player,microwave, clothes (big-name brand), high quality art books, etc.

China has been able to set up, from scratch, state-of-the-art factories able to manufacture on a large scale, and it seems that most goods from there are now high quality, with just a few sources still making low-end stuff and copies.

Broadly speaking, Japan started in the same way after WW2, then developed and innovated over the years.

No politics implied in my comments.

Yes, top end products that will be in land fill in 5 years, because as soon as the warranty is up, so are they, and they can't be repaired. Companies manufacture in China for one reason, and one reason only, cost. They get cheap labour and a government that doesn't care if they pollute as long as they bring in employment for the masses.

 

[cmo]

Yes, top end products that will be in land fill in 5 years, because as soon as the warranty is up, so are they, and they can't be repaired. Companies manufacture in China for one reason, and one reason only, cost. They get cheap labour and a government that doesn't care if they pollute as long as they bring in employment for the masses.

EXACTLY.

Plus two more.

First of all, it's a dictatorship (the regime formerly known as communism). Human rights translates to arbitrariness. You can see the real face of the rulers in Tibet and Urumqi. Most companies that shifted work from the USA or Europe to China stretched the rules and turned a blind eye to these facts - and the others didn't even care. So, if they don't care for their own people, do they care for their customers? I doubt it. Chinese milk powder contaminated with melamine sickened and killed babies, in China and abroad. Mattel had to recall millions of toys because of lead-based paint and loose magnets.

Secondly, product piracy is a chinese pest plant - and bad weeds grow tall. I doubt that Kodak was very happy after the cooperation with Lucky. Probably that chinese company just stole ideas and patents and cheated Kodak. It's the normal way how they demonstrate respect for western business partners.

And apart from all that, it's really a bad film

 

[Europan]

Fuji black-and-white film used to be made by Oriental Photo Industrial Co., Ltd., now Oriental Photo Corporation, Tokyo. I don't know whether that partnership still holds.

 

[aldevo]

Fuji black-and-white film used to be made by Oriental Photo Industrial Co., Ltd., now Oriental Photo Corporation, Tokyo. I don't know whether that partnership still holds.

And Oriental Photo Corp was outsourcing all of its photo paper production to China last I heard.

I doubt the partnership still exists.

 

[aldevo]

Yes, top end products that will be in land fill in 5 years, because as soon as the warranty is up, so are they, and they can't be repaired. Companies manufacture in China for one reason, and one reason only, cost. They get cheap labour and a government that doesn't care if they pollute as long as they bring in employment for the masses.

Yes, but cost is an advantage in manufacturing high-end products just as much as it is in manufacturing low-end.

Low cost does not always imply low quality. The joinery and overall fit & finish of Shen-Hao cameras, for example, embarrases anything Zone VI, Ron Wisner, or even Tachihara ever did. Very impressive. China has a lot of craftsmen; it isn't all just mass-produced garbage.

 

[darkosaric]

Couple of weeks ago I saw on ebay that together with new Diana you get 10 rolls of B&W (5 iso 100, 5 iso 400). I think it was Lucky film.
So if this film is crapy - it is perfect for holga and diana

 

[fotch]

Not in my Darkroom!

China manufactured products accounted for 67% of consumer product recalls in 2007
China, quality, you got to be delirious. Just some of the things that I never recall hearing problems with until China made them: Drywall, Dog food, Toys, Toothpaste, Tires, Clothing, Shoes, the list seems endless. Yes, the companies that imported this garbage are also the blame.
I would not bring CC (China Crap) into my darkroom and I try to avoid buying products made there. They do not last as long as when they were made elsewhere. However, it seems impossible to avoid buying CC.
JMHO

 

[wogster]

Yes, but cost is an advantage in manufacturing high-end products just as much as it is in manufacturing low-end.

Low cost does not always imply low quality. The joinery and overall fit & finish of Shen-Hao cameras, for example, embarrases anything Zone VI, Ron Wisner, or even Tachihara ever did. Very impressive. China has a lot of craftsmen; it isn't all just mass-produced garbage.

They may have some craftsmen, but those are probably hand built cameras, where the person making it, really cares about the final product. It seems with Lucky film, your lucky if your shots turn out, fine for "goofing" around maybe, but I have to trust that when I press the shutter button, I will have a decent result unless I screw it up, having the film fail on me, that's not acceptable.

It's a moot point anyway, far as I know there is no distributor for it in Canada at the moment.

 

[Shangheye]

As someone who worked in China for 10 years (and continues to), lived there for four years, I can only say that this thread has lost the original OP's question and has become more about China bashing for some. It often strikes me that we choose to forget our own Industrial revolutions (and sweat houses) and deny them to others, as well their fair share of CO2 emmissions. I do so wish that when China comes up, the stereotypes by people who have probably never been there wouldn't crop up.

As I said, Lucky film is OK if you know what to expect. Some of my best shots are with it (and some of my worst). Would I use it for commercial work? No. Would I use it as a general shhot and don't care becasue it is cheap snap material. Yes. Do I use it still, no...but that is because I use MF more now, and I don't think it is any good at that format.

Any more views on Lucky, or does someone want to raise Tibet? :rolleyes: