Lowell Tota lights - any impressions ?

[CBG]

I'm with Christopher.

I've used Totas more than any other light for 30 plus years and think they are a fabulous deal in power for the dollar. They are reliable, simple and easy to use, and with a bit of finesse can do all sorts of stuff no broadlight should be able to do.

I have no problem with the heat, since like all hot lights, ummm, they are hot, and I take that into consideration when I use them. I dunno what all this gloves thing is about, never needed them. I just don't hang onto the hot parts, I use the handles and such.

And yes, relamping is easy.

Of course you bounce them or diffuse them 99% of the time. That's what they are made for. They are lights, not modifiers. Arguing that they are bad since they need to be less specular is like arguing that cameras are defective since they need lenses to work.

Aiming them directly at a portrait subject is misusing broad lights. Of course, used direct, they are hot and harsh. That's why you diffuse or bounce.

If I need more oomph I use more than one to light up a surface. I often use six or seven to get enough light to get what I want. I am a hog for light.

I have used them just over and/or under the lens as a poor man's ringlight. A cheep hack, I admit, but it has worked. That's about the only time I have ever used them as direct lights.

They're great in a softbox or bounced or shot thru a tent....

I'm baffled by the people's experience that they break down or explode a lot. What are they doing? For me, in thirty plus years not a single lamp breakage. Not one. Never.

In my experience - they are more reliable than I could have imagined. Never a total failure while shooting in thirty years. Of course it will happen tomorrow.


They are not invulnerable. Two of my three original totas are gradually showing they will sometime need a repair - the plug holder in the housing has cracked and will need for the plugholder to be removed and replaced. They still function well but you can see they'll need work sometime. Lowell offers to do repairs, so what's the issue? I doubt any light will work forever without some sort of maintenence sometime. As I have found deals on Totas in the last year or two, I've snapped them up so now I have a couple extra so I can send the original two to get fixed without being held back.

They fulfill one major lighting need - power in a compact package. Great for all sorts of work from studio to architecture to film to TV to general bouncing and softboxing. What's not to like?

Combined with a few other hot lights, you can do anything. By themselves a great beginner's kit. The stands are wimpy but usable and light enough to make a portable three light kit.

If you're doing portraiture in 8x10, I'd be inclined to add to consideration a really good strobe setup, since people cannot generally be themselves during longish exposures. Really good means a truly proportional and powerful modelling light, scads of reflectors and accessories avaliable, and gobs and gobs of power - expensive. Broncolor perhaps?

Best,

C

 

[CBG]

Just read AZLF's post on waiting ten minutes before moving the lights.

I just re-aim them as I need. Never seems to be a problem.

C

 

[CBG]

Beware! They aren't as bright as they seem once you start bouncing or diffusing them.
QUOTE]

That happens to any light. Why is that something that requires "Beware!" ?

Aim any cheeep or pricy light at a wall and watch the exposure times soar into the minutes.

It's just physics.

Best,

C

 

[Flotsam]

I know that they say not to close the flaps until several minutes after they have been turned off. As far as moving them, I can't see why they should be handled any differently than any other lights that use the same bulbs.

Personally, I like Totas. They are small, light and portable and there are many clever light control devices available in the system. Flags, Frames, umbrellas etc.

 

[RobertP]

That's funny that many say you can't get good results from these crap lights. I won a national juried show using these crappy lights. 1- 750 watt tota... 1- 500 omni...and 1- 250 watt lowel pro. And the shot was an 8x10 pt/pd portrait of a clown. I'm sure glad you guys didn't tell my judge I was using crap lighting and I sure hope he doesn't read this post because he may just ask for the award money back.

 

[CBG]

RobertP,

Three cheers for crap lighting!

C

 

[Kino]

Well, they are what they are and they can produce good work or bad depending on how you treat them and use them. I worked 5 years at the OSU Department of Cinema and Photography as their Media Lab Supervisor and cannot tell you how many times I rebuilt those 5 Tota light kits; at least twice each quarter, maybe more.

I have also used them extensively on "hack" tv and film projects and found if you don't know what you are doing, you will get crap results; but I think that is pretty true even with a grip truck full of Arri and Mole Richardson's best kit.

My recommendations:

1. The "barndoors" are not barndoors in the truest sense, DO NOT close them while the lamp is on under any circumstances. In fact, keep them well back of the "safety" wire stops or you will find molten aluminum dripping down on your talent and/or crew. If you think I am kidding, just try it sometime. It WILL melt the aluminum reflectors.

2. If you want to have any real directional control of your light, other than bounce from a wall or a Lowell umbrella, spend a lot of money on cinefoil and C stands... a lot... and NEVER trap the heat from one of these lamps in anything or you WILL have a fire.

3. Sandbag the stands ALWAYS or some dork will trip over it, tip the light stand and brand your actor's face. Try cutting around that...

4. Buy enough spare parts to totally rebuild the lamp at least ONCE, better twice, if you intend to do any serious work and become familiar with the process. I used to have the parts numbers memorized, no joke.

5. When you unplug the cord from the fixture DO NOT DROP THE PLASTIC END ON THE FLOOR. In fact, don't drop any part of the cord on the floor or you WILL be replacing it. Word.

6. Melted plastic end plugs on the cords are a 100% sure fire memo to you that you mishandled the lights -- no two ways about it, you screwed up and trapped the heat in the fixture. You don't wrap a 12K HMI in a blanket now do you? Treat it right...

7. If you are trying to get all types of lighting from point source to broad diffusion from a Lowell Tota kit, you need to go back and rethink your strategy. While the kits are generally very versatile, they are NOT everything to everybody. Use them for their strengths, lightweight -- high broad light output -- relatively inexpensive, and use OTHER kinds of luminaries for effects outside the range of the Lowell Light kit's abilities.

My 2 cents...

 

[JBrunner]

Don't get crappy lights confused with crappy lighting. A person who understands lighting can make do with almost anything.

I've had to light with nothing, and I've also had every light at a grip electric rental house available to me for a shoot. I never said anybody couldn't get good results using these things. But all in all, I'd rather have 1 12K and some boards and blades than twenty totas, but if its what ya got, the fact that they suck is no excuse for you to.

 

[RobertP]

12K ? Try plugging that into someones household current when you show up to do their portrait. Not to mention hauling a 12K around. I have a 2K 412 mole lamped at 1500 watt and that beast never leaves the studio. Now if you are using a 12K for portraits your studio must be the size of a theatre or you are working on a film crew. But comparing a little lowel tota to a 12K fresnel is like comparing a tic tac to a whale. If fresnel quality light is what you are after the Lowel Fren-L 650 watt is a gorgeous light. They are light and portable and they peg the light meter with almost the same intensity as my mole -richardson 4131's. Plus they have every light controller option that is available. I think they make a kit of three that comes with a carrying case. You don't need huge expensive lights and grip trucks to make photographs.

 

[JBrunner]

12K ? Try plugging that into someones household current when you show up to do their portrait. Not to mention hauling a 12K around. I have a 2K 412 mole lamped at 1500 watt and that beast never leaves the studio. Now if you are using a 12K for portraits your studio must be the size of a theatre or you are working on a film crew. But comparing a little lowel tota to a 12K fresnel is like comparing a tic tac to a whale. If fresnel quality light is what you are after the Lowel Fren-L 650 watt is a gorgeous light. They are light and portable and they peg the light meter with almost the same intensity as my mole -richardson 4131's. Plus they have every light controller option that is available. I think they make a kit of three that comes with a carrying case. You don't need huge expensive lights and grip trucks to make photographs.

Plugging a 12k into a house- no problem- you just have to think outside the box.

 

[Kino]

Plugging a 12k into a house- no problem- you just have to think outside the box.

That reminds me of the Lowel Light newsletter they published for a short time.

My favorite article was called, "On Performing Power Tie-ins and Seeing God".

Ever climbed a pole and did a tie in on a live transformer? Not me, but I knew a guy who would! Wonder if he is still alive...

 

[Vaughn]

I will agree with Kino.

We have a set of three we check out to students. Occassionally the line switch is left in the "on" position and a student will plug one in without opening the barndoors. When we use to run the 1000W bulbs, it did not take long to melt them down. We have had better luck now running them with 750W bulbs. With the 750W bulbs, you can smell them heating up and turn them off before major damage is done. The 1000W bulbs gave you no time before they turned the reflectors into slag.

I do like the fact that I can rebuild them easily, parts are easy to order, though I have not had to order anything for a few years.

I have found them very good for taking slides and 4x5 transparencies of art work. I used two of them to light up some 6'x10' paintings (using 4x5 camera and Kodak 64T redi-loads). Worked very well.

During the last 20 years we have never had a bulb explode, nor many screws come loose. Pretty amazing considering how students use equipment w/o direct supervision! But we have had several meltdowns.

Anyone need 1000W bulbs? I got several...just too much heat and Tota has downgraded the capacity, so I won't use them.

The Totas certainly are not the best lights out there, but a student can put a set of three with stands, etc over his/her shoulder and walk out the door.

Vaughn

 

[tommy5c]

here's my problem, the original intent of the question was. " should i spend my money on these lights." not "if you use these lights you are a hack." this thread has skewed a little far from it's origins. i think that someone would be better served buying a mickey mole , a tweenie , or a few others. most can be found on e-pay. lowel lights will do the job, but if you had the choice wouldn't you pick a better light. just my thoughts. i think this thread has turned a little too personal, as if saying using a lowel light is a personal attack on your ability.

 

[Kino]

And I really don't know how you couldn't draw at least a few conclusions for yourself by reading the entire thread.

It really doesn't pay to post anymore on APUG as it appears no one reads the entire thread or tries to draw their own conclusions from multiple personal experiences.

That the thread wanders a bit to encompass observations not exactly related to the question SHOULD give you more meat to consider the situation, but somehow it doesn't appear to do that.

If you want direct advice, I charge $75 an hour for consulting with a 5 hour minimum.

PM me with your credit card information and we can get started.

 

[mark]

Damn Kino,

At that price for consultation you might as well just give it away. I mean the difference between a hooker and call girl is price. Same for consultants. The last one I hired cost 3000 a day plus expenses and he was cheap. I have yet to meet a good one that does hourly.

But you are right, some folks are a bit too hasty to judge without thinking. I did not read this thread as a slam. It veered but then again, if you wanted things to stay completely on topic you should read an article. This is a conversation. An insightful one at that.

 

[Christopher Nisperos]

here's my problem, the original intent of the question was. " should i spend my money on these lights." not "if you use these lights you are a hack." this thread has skewed a little far from it's origins. i think that someone would be better served buying a mickey mole , a tweenie , or a few others. most can be found on e-pay. lowel lights will do the job, but if you had the choice wouldn't you pick a better light. just my thoughts. i think this thread has turned a little too personal, as if saying using a lowel light is a personal attack on your ability.

Kino's rant brought me a chuckle, but he's not wrong. Furthermore, his comments in post#32 are pretty fair-sided and, I think, show alot of common sense. Having said that, Tommy, I re-read the thread starter:

Nick was offered an 'old, but well cared-for' Lowell Tota-light 3-lamp kit with 3 stands, gel frame, 3 or more flags, case, extra bulbs, some grip stuff, ... but no reflectors. He said he shoots 120, 8x10 and some 16mm cine. He asked for our impressions (but not —necessarily— our direct advice on whether or not to buy!) from using them and asked under which situations we thought they would best be used. He said that "any info or advice would be appreciated" and asked for going prices.

Since I agree with Kino that most of Nick's questions can now be answered simply by culling the thread, I'll just add that one way to judge a used price is to take a new price and multiply by 0.67. For photo equipment this will should give you a close —if rough— idea of what a normal selling price for mint, second-hand stuff. Further deductions are then made if the equipment is in less-than-top condition.

Lastly, perhaps the reason Nick didn't actually ask for direct advice to buy or not was that he knew that such advice would be impossible to give without first knowing the price! As an exagerated example: even the opponents of Lowel equipment on this thread would probably tell Nick to snatch it up if the kit were, say $100.00, if you see what I mean! I believe that's why the thread turned to "I like the stuff" vs "I don't" ....

Best,

Christopher


.

 

[CBG]

A quotation from the original posting:

" ... Any info/advice appreciated ..."

Sounds like he wanted varied input on Totas. I think the varying opinions I've seen here are exactly what was requested.

On stu-dented lights ... Students destroy everything in their path - just like rental cars. After a very few miles, they are worn out and get sold off.

I've seen student used Totas much newer than mine with cooked reflectors. They had obviously been turned on while not open, a no no no.

I'm not sure I would rule any equipment out because students can wreck it.

Those things are NOT barn doors - no matter what anyone says - not Lowell not anyone - they're just reflectors that should be open wide or open even wider. Never ever closed while on.

"4. Buy enough spare parts to totally rebuild the lamp at least ONCE, better twice, if you intend to do any serious work and become familiar with the process. I used to have the parts numbers memorized, no joke.
5. When you unplug the cord from the fixture DO NOT DROP THE PLASTIC END ON THE FLOOR. In fact, don't drop any part of the cord on the floor or you WILL be replacing it. Word."
6. Melted plastic end plugs on the cords are a 100% sure fire memo to you that you mishandled the lights -- no two ways about it, you screwed up and trapped the heat in the fixture. You don't wrap a 12K HMI in a blanket now do you? Treat it right...
7. If you are trying to get all types of lighting from point source to broad diffusion from a Lowell Tota kit, you need to go back and rethink your strategy. While the kits are generally very versatile, they are NOT everything to everybody. Use them for their strengths, lightweight -- high broad light output -- relatively inexpensive, and use OTHER kinds of luminaries for effects outside the range of the Lowell Light kit's abilities.

On 4: Never had to get a single part myself. I will sometime though.
On 5: Never had to get a cord.
On 6: No one I know (other than students) was ever stupid enough to wrap any hot light with anything - why would you? Hot lights are hot.
On 7: Kino's right on - use tools for their strengths ...

C

 

[Kino]

Well Mark, I've never considered Hookers as a benchmark for consulting service fees, seeing as how I try NOT to screw my clients (on may levels), but if it somehow makes you feel better to pay the extra, be my guest.

I've yet to meet anyone who paid someone $3K a day for advice, capable of profiting from it (at least to the extent it WAS worth $3k).

 

[nick mulder]

well,

yip - heck this thread has been a goldmine hasn't it ...

I suppose I should chirp in - In the meantime the kit seems to have ended up being on permanent-ish loan... I told the seller who is a colleague and somewhat friend (we dont go out for soda's but certainly enjoy each others company etc..)

I told him that one day sooner or later it will become clear to me that they will have become indispensable or not and on that day I will offer him X amount of dollars for them... The thing is> what is that X amount of dollars ? It could range from 1 cent to the 0.67*current price (thanks Christopher)

A frivolous estimation would factor that only 1 cent might be the going price that some here would accept... However there is a limit as to how low I would offer him for them as not to cause offense.

I'll consider this X a work in progress

I have only used them for cine stuff so far where strobes are a no no without otherwise forking out many $$$ for a Lightning Strikes kit or similar. 8x10 portraiture session tonight maybe - still dont have the protective screens but I'll bounce them so if they blow it wont be in the direction of the model.

 

[mark]

Well Mark, I've never considered Hookers as a benchmark for consulting service fees, seeing as how I try NOT to screw my clients (on may levels), but if it somehow makes you feel better to pay the extra, be my guest.

I've yet to meet anyone who paid someone $3K a day for advice, capable of profiting from it (at least to the extent it WAS worth $3k).

Advice and training. If all you are talking about is advice then I guess that would be a bit cheaper. I have no argument with what I paid the guy because he helped set the tone for the school year. My teachers left that day knowing the direction we were going and he set the foundation for their continuing professional development, for this year. As for profiting from the advice, in my world we see profit differently than the rest of the world. Just the nature of the game.

 

[RobertP]

I've never used a Tota without bouncing it. My suggestion for anyone would be to rent lights for a while until you find the ones that meet you needs and vision. Get with an experienced photographer who is use to shooting with hot lights and pick his brain. A good shot can use lights from home depot and get good results. I've been using hot lights with ULF for years so format has nothing to do with it. And now I'm using hot lights for ULF wet plate. Learn your lighting techniques and brand names won't make a difference what- so- ever. Then you can buy what ever your wallet can afford.

 

[Flotsam]

Nobody understands the concept of "Different tools for different jobs" better than photographers. I may not choose them as my only hot light but Totas are the only lights that I am aware of that suspends the lamp out in front of a flat reflector instead of back within some sort of shaped, parabolic reflector. Like it or not, this gives them a unique characteristic that I find useful under many circumstances. Washing large areas with even light for example.

 

[RobertP]

Flotsam, Very good example of when they shine.

 

[Nokton48]

Washing large areas with even light for example.

That, is exactly why, I keep my old Tota kit. It has never let -me- down.

 

[RobertP]

Some one made mention before that a tota isn't supplied with a barndoor. If they meant the two doors that open on the bare light, that isn't the barndoors for a tota . Lowel however does make a barndoor for the tota light that works like any other 4 leaf door. Lowel allows you to use an add on barndoor and with gels and other modifiers at that. A lot of people speak about this little light without realizing what they can actually do with it. Just google Lowel Lighting and look at the modifiers that are available for this light.