Low toxicity, Eco-friendly B&W processing

Photo Engineer · Sep 6, 2011

If you are concerned with odor then here are some tips:

1. Any developer for film or paper will do. B&W developers are pretty much odorless.

2. If you can stand vinegar, then a stop bath is ok, but if not use citric acid or running water (but the latter only if you must and it is not best for prints).

3. Use a neutral fix. They have no odor.

PE

Kirk Keyes · Sep 6, 2011

Sirius Glass said:
I always get a kick out of seeing a sign on the Santa Monica Mall in a Holistic Pharmacy [Half-Asstic?] "Our Vitamins and Minerals Contain Absolutely No Chemicals".

More than once when I questioned the pharmacist about how "he could encapsilate a vacuum in a non-chemical container and sell it as a product" he threw me out telling me that I did not understand medicine or chemistry. :eek:

My hat is off to you, good sir!

kreeger · Sep 6, 2011

Athiril said:
Some people like to mix their ammonia based cleaning products with their chlorine based products thinking they're clever and it'll clean better.

Sometimes referred to "Lung Buster"... LOL

Worker 11811 · Sep 6, 2011

If the sign said, "...No UNWANTED chemicals" it would be technically correct.

removed account4 · Sep 13, 2011

Athiril said:
By "parent" do you mean you're the state and by "kids" do you mean citizens?

no anthiril .. i mean i am a parent and have children.

i find it strange that people would suggest
that leaving poisonous chemicals out in the reach of children is OK ...

i don't have my kids play outside when they spray for gypsy moths either ...

removed account4 · Sep 13, 2011

Photo Engineer said:
John;

I have, and have had for years, a fully stocked color and B&W darkroom and chemical store room. We had 3 young children who grew up around these chemicals, and our son learned the basics of photography as did a few neighbor's kids who were friends. We treated the chemistry with respect and care which is what I taught them. We never had an accident with them.

I have never known a researcher at EK to have problems, nor did any of us when I worked at the Cape and in the photofinishing industry.

Household and medicine cabinet chemicals are more of a problem.

PE

i didn't say in a store room ( which can be locked )
i asked if you kept your photochemistry under the kitchen sink
where kids could get at it ...

Photo Engineer · Sep 13, 2011

Household chemicals go under the kitchen sink. They were never touched by our children at all.

Really nasty household chemicals went into the pantry with a lock. I guess our children behaved when told what they could and could not do.

PE

Scheimpflug · Sep 13, 2011

Tony-S said:
My wife will be teaching a B&W component in a high school art class this year and I was wondering if there is a good workflow for darkrooms that don't have an active ventilation system.

Personally, I would look further into what it would take to get a proper ventilation system installed.

While it may be possible to find a way to make this work with your setup, you are on a bit of a slippery slope - getting students interested in analog photography, telling them it is safe, and then using a non-ventilated darkroom.

While your carefully researched system with procedures to manage the chemicals may be safe itself, it doesn't educate the students with a complete picture of the safety steps that were required to make it safe... and they get used to working without proper ventilation. Some processes and chemicals *do* require ventilation... and when these students leave the school and start doing things on their own, perhaps with different chemicals or with the need to mix solutions themselves, they won't instinctively think about ventilation.

AlbertZeroK · Sep 13, 2011

Lovely thread! I am hoping to work with some local schools for B&W. So this is a great primer for what to expect.

At home, my dark room doesn't even have a lock, but it's one of the deadly sins in our house to play with one of Daddy's cameras or go in the darkroom alone. Mostly handled by a simple rule that I'm happy to put any equipment in your hands to use, just ask. Ah, the joys of having photography insurance!

MattKing · Sep 13, 2011

As I've posted before, any task performed in a closed, small room is unhealthy if there isn't enough ventilation, so my advice would be to work on the ventilation even if the only "chemical" you were using was H2O.

snapshot2000 · Sep 13, 2011

I had a chemistry set when I was a kid and I loved it. I bet you'd be hard pressed to find one these days.

removed account4 · Sep 13, 2011

Photo Engineer said:
Household chemicals go under the kitchen sink. They were never touched by our children at all.

Really nasty household chemicals went into the pantry with a lock. I guess our children behaved when told what they could and could not do.

PE

ours are stored like yours ron ...
and my kids behave as well,
but as i mentioned i have known quite a few kids
when i was also a kid who did not behave as well
and nearly killed themselves or others because of
their curiosity. i am by no means suggesting that photochemicals
are evil and should be stored in a dungeon ... but it seems
that many people lack common sense as we have seen in other threads
here on apug ...

Photo Engineer · Sep 13, 2011

In my experience, teenagers are more dangerous!

PE

Maris · Sep 13, 2011

Here's a couple of incidents from my time as the hot-line guy for Eastman Chemicals:

A darkroom worker complains of headaches, dizziness, and general malaise while working in a well ventilated darkroom. He blames the "fumes" from the fixer.
When I check his work space I find that the guy is doing 5 hour darkroom sessions while wearing a double cartridge (dust and vapour) face mask. He's got a deep fear of chemicals but what's getting him is ordinary anoxia because he's not breathing adequately.

An urgent call comes through from someone with metol allergy. The stuff is literally eating his hands even though he is wearing surgical gloves. It turns out that the victim has latex allergy from the gloves and the metol is innocent. But the story has spread to every darkroom in town and it takes ages to hose it all down.

Sometimes the irrational behaviour stemming from the fear of chemicals is more dangerous than the chemicals themselves. Knowledge and discipline deliver safety.

John Austin · Dec 28, 2011

Lemon juice stop bath - Does anyone have a formula for lemon juice stop bath?

Our citrus trees are on a slope below the leech drain from the septic system so we produce a superabundance of lemons and oranges

Photo Engineer · Dec 28, 2011

Lemons contain Ascorbic Acid which is a developing agent. Are you sure you want to use this? When exhausted or in use with an alkaline fix, well, you can get some fog or over development. Use citric acid.

PE

Crashbox · Dec 28, 2011

I totally agree that there is much more fear instead of respect for chemicals, it's downright crazy these days.

Guess I'd better stop wearing those cyanide gloves for protection...!!!

Tony-S · Dec 29, 2011

So, after a visit from the school district's occupational health department, the only requirements were (1) store the chemicals in a ventilated room and (2) install an eye wash station. Much easier than I expected.

NJH · Oct 20, 2017

Just to update this thread both Tetenal and Adox are marketing hydroquinone free paper developers based on ascorbic acid/Vitamin C (Eukobrom AC & Neutol ECO respectively). I think that pretty much completes the set now for low toxicity/low hazard film and print processing.

darkroommike · Oct 20, 2017

moose10101 said:
Why not caffeinol (coffee, vitamin C, washing soda) and a water stop bath?

Caffenol really stinks.

darkroommike · Oct 20, 2017

NJH said:
Just to update this thread both Tetenal and Adox are marketing hydroquinone free paper developers based on ascorbic acid/Vitamin C (Eukobrom AC & Neutol ECO respectively). I think that pretty much completes the set now for low toxicity/low hazard film and print processing.

Hydroquinone was, until recently, used as a skin treatment for age spots and general lightening of skin.blemishes.

darkroommike · Oct 20, 2017

If you don't have a copy of Dr. Richard Henry's book Controls in Black and White Photography, 2nd Ed. (and dang you should, we all should) you should go get one. He has an entire chapter on chemical safety. Dr. Henry was an MD that ran a lab and company that specialized in safe handling of chemicals as well as a being a photographer that debunked a ton of the mythology that surrounds our craft. It's a must read, he takes a couple of shots at the writer of a book that purports to be an expert treatise on darkroom safety. I've read her book and I don't think she could read an MSDS or a CAS registry number statement if her life depended on it, and she would not know what the CRC Handbook of Chemistry and Physics looks like, it could walk right up to her and bite her in the a...er...leg...I think I'll say "bite her in the leg".

removed account4 · Oct 20, 2017

darkroommike said:
Caffenol really stinks.

stinks as in smells bad, or stinks as in doesn't work well ?

jgoody · Oct 20, 2017

One of the issues this highlights is the lack of real information on toxicity of various products we come in contact with. Everything is labeled "may cause cancer" by manufacturers on the advice of their attorneys so we have no rational basis to evaluate toxicity. We need a scale or letter grades so that things that are really toxic can be identified, eg the solvents used to "weld" plastic are actually very toxic, while much of what we encounter is reasonably safe, despite the labels. Good luck with the school administration, who are no doubt worried about lawsuits.

Joe VanCleave · Oct 20, 2017

jnanian said:
stinks as in smells bad, or stinks as in doesn't work well ?

Stinks like an urn of badly burnt coffee.

Low toxicity, Eco-friendly B&W processing

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