If the 2 g/l free sulfite level is generally accepted
I have read on many occasions, that Formaldehyde is a fogging agent. Why doesn't it fog film or paper in a lith developer?
This patent states, that fogging induced by Fomaldehyde was well known many decades ago. It would have been very attractive as hardener in developers back then, and given how willingly med school students exposed themselves to Formaldehyde back then, its toxicity would not have been much of a concern.I have never heard this but considering that formaldehyde is a very reactive chemical would not be surprised. However the presence of the sulfoxylate adduct in these developers not only keeps the level of sulfite very low but also the amount of free formaldehyde very low.
In place of formaldehyde acetone can also be used. Trying to formulate a high contrast infectious developer without using either of these two chemicals is a bit like trying to make an omelet without eggs.
Given Formaldehyde's unpleasant smell I assume that both venues have been researched in the past, with nothing much to show.
The MSDS indeed mention no Acetone or Formaldehyde, but they don't mention any substituent either.
I would hazard a guess that many sulfur containing compounds would release SO2 when burned, And the MSDS for part C does mention sulfite, so they have no reason to keep it secret in part B MSDS.The MSDS only needs to mentions hazmats. As sulfite (at least in Germany) in not a hazmat but actually a food additive (E221) and also sodiumbromide is not considered a hazmateither, both are not mentioned in the MSDS. Nevertheless, sulfite is part of the Moersch Lith B solutions as the MSDS states that burning the part B will release sulphur dioxide.
I don't think that Ascorbate would survive very long in such an alkaline liquid. Since Moersch went through the whole effort of decoupling alkali from sulfite containing concentrate, I would be very surprised if they suddenly had close to 20% sulfite in their concentrate B. Not that I could point out an alternative explanation ...The MSDS mentions a solid content of 59% out of which 30%-40% is carbonate. This leaves a 19%-29% of solids which are not hazmat, which certainly limits the available choices. There is sulfite, there should be a little bromide, maybe there is some ascorbic acid, but we can only guess.
I would hazard a guess that many sulfur containing compounds would release SO2 when burned
I don't think that Ascorbate would survive very long in such an alkaline liquid.
Since Moersch went through the whole effort of decoupling alkali from sulfite containing concentrate, I would be very surprised if they suddenly had close to 20% sulfite in their concentrate B.
I've been trying to develop a decent lith developer with mixed success. I've figured out the right balance between hydroquinone, sod. sulfite, and KBr for me. I'm using saturated Pot. carbonate as the alkali. I'm basically not happy with the developer life both on the shelf and in the tray. With help, I figured out I want the Part A to have a pH of 4.....what is the best acid to achieve that? Regarding the tray life, is there anything other than sodium sulfite that would serve as an anti-oxidant? Thought about ascorbic acid, but it seems that adding a developing agent would be a bad idea.
Anyway any insight from the chemists out there would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks. Sulphite levels need to be low, no doubt. But I would assume that "low" in this context in relative to the HQ level and depending to a certain extent on bromide level and exposure times, too.
I was just curious where the max. 2g/litre are originating. Grant Haist is an excellent source (unfortunately I have not been able to buy a copy), but Tim Rudman quotes a lith developer recipe (The World of Lith Printing, page 150 second paragraph) "My single-solution lith developer recipe" by Kate Mokac containing 60g sodiumsulfite / liter to be diluted 1:5, i.e. 12 grams / liter of working solution.
Actually I have already tried it, and I can get excellent results with way higher levels than 2 grams / litre of working solution.
Is this something you can confirm from personal experimentation, or just from some literature reference?Yes the concentration level of sulfite in a working developer should be from one to two geams per liter.
It is well known, that Acetone will work, but it binds to sulfite much more weakly than Formaldehyde. As a result, Acetone Sulfite adduct will have more free sulfite in solution than Formaldehyde Sulfite adduct, and if the amount of free sulfite has an upper ceiling for proper lith action, less Acetone Sulfite adduct can be added. Shelf life will be less as a result.The famous portraitist G Paul Bishop used acetone in his developer to create a source of hydroxide ions. So yes acetone will also work.
Thanks. I have a fair understanding (at least as much at Tim Rudman's book could teach me)....at least the infecteous development equations. My effort will be based from existing formulas, MSDS sheets/ingredients list of commercial developers, and any patents I can dig up. I don't want to plow ground that people have already plowed, but I do have minimal chemistry knowledge. I hope to limit the sodium sulfite/metabisulfite to a minimum through other chemicals that may reduce aerial oxidation by some other means. We'll see. It may be a dead end, but I'm a fairly dedicated lith printer and I've spent my entire career developing products. Hopefully, I can make up for my lack of deep photochemistry knowledge. BTW - I have a stupid amount of photochemicals already as I like to mix my own where it makes sense.Before you run off and waste a lot of time, effort and chemicals read up on all you can get on the theory of lith printing.
Is this something you can confirm from personal experimentation, or just from some literature reference?
To fling another shoe into the works you must use hydroquinone as the developing agent. AFAIK this is the only developing agent that undergoes infectious development.
Do any of these scratch mixes compare to the top three I listed??
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