LF Novice

[removed account4]

I'd be willing to try a 5x7, but unfortunately the school I'm going to can only facilitate 4x5 and smaller, maybe some day I'll move into 5x7 though k jupiter

Joe

joe

methinks tim was including a 4x5 reducing back so it is BOTH a 4x5 + 5x7
its a good think you are sort of staying to 4x5, once you shoot 5x7
you probably won't want to shoot 4x5 anymore

 

[Joe O'Brien]

jnanian

and after I shoot 5x7 it will be on to 8x10? maybe I should scrap my whole plan of doing LF and just go ULF?!?

 

[eddie]

Yes... The downward (upward?) spiral...
One of the advantages of a larger format, with a reducing back, is that it will have a longer bellows, allowing you to use longer lenses.
5x7 contact prints can be beautiful, too.

 

[removed account4]

jnanian

and after I shoot 5x7 it will be on to 8x10? maybe I should scrap my whole plan of doing LF and just go ULF?!?

you might consider doing that ... later

8x10 and bigger are nice, but they can be a real pain to transport -
... they're heavy and the lenses, even junque brass barrel lenses, can be expensive,
not to mention a lot of $$$ ... besides you won't be going anywhere farther than 100 feet from your car ...

4x5 is a nice format, nice and compact and easy ... if it works for you, go for it

 

[Joe O'Brien]

Heh, yeah, on a college student budget I think I'll take your advice and wait on that 20x24

 

[k_jupiter]

Hey hey... The asking price was going to be dirt cheap. And yes, there would be a 4x5 reducing back included.

But that 4x5 Orbit went for 255.00, not a bad price, a fair price. It is what a lot of us at NESOP learned on. Carrying the Orbit around Boston for a semester was a right of passage.

Good luck in your search Joe. I love my 8x10 Deardorff and if you had the money, not a bad place to start. I have three 8x10 lens for it, the heaviest being a 450mm Nikor M lens. The other two (a 191mm Ektar and a 12 inch Commercial Ektar) are no more heavy than most 4x5 lens. Or at least within a couple of oz.

tim (o'brien) in san jose

 

[stevebrot]

Hi,
I just took the LF plunge a couple of months ago and figured that I might be in a good position to share what little I have learned.

Here is what I bought as initial kit:

• Chamonix 045N-2
• Bromwell lens boards (2)
• Caltar II-N 90/6.8
• Caltar II-N 150/5.6
• Super Rollex 6x7 roll film holder
• 1/2 dozen Riteway 4x5 film holders
• 120 size SS processing tank

Things that became urgent next step purchases:

• Epson V700 scanner
• AP plastic daylight processing tank for "taco" method developing of 4x5 negatives
• Negative sleeves/pages
• Different tripod head (the ballhead does not cut it for LF work)
• Super thick reading glasses so that I can see to focus under the cloth (presbyopia sucks)

Things I got just for the hang of it:

• Two Calumet 6x7 roll film holders

Badly needed things I still must purchase:

• Changing bag/dark tent
• Better darkcloth setup
• 4x focus loupe
• Better backpack to carry the kit in

Things I may yet buy and/or make:

• Jobo 4x5 film tank kit
• Slosher-type processing frame
• 4x5 enlarger
• Some sort of camera cover for use when the rain starts before I can break down the kit (it rains a lot where I live...)
• Larger computer hard drive and more RAM. The files for even moderate resolution scans are huge.

Additional:

• Willing assistant to help carry the kit and to keep a lookout for the bad guys, errant cars, etc. while my head is under the cloth trying to focus

As you might have guessed, the costs start adding up fast...very, very fast...much faster and much more than I would have guessed. Everything is fairly expensive and finding good quality used items is a hit-or-miss proposition. Lenses can be expensive, particularly wide angles. I felt fortunate to have gotten my two for about $550 for the pair. Film can be pricey, but fortunately Freestyle sells Arista.EDU Ultra 100/400 for less than $25 a box of 50 sheets. Processing is expensive too with prices starting at about $2.00 per sheet. If you do your own B&W, be prepared to use about 1 liter developer per 4 sheets doing the "taco" method and about half that if done in trays or with a Jobo film drum. Remember that 4 sheets of 4x5 requires the same amount of developer "strength" as a full roll of 35mm film.

So, is it worth it? I am still not sure. The camera movements are purely addictive and the larger negatives are extremely impressive. OTOH, using the camera requires a completely different mindset than that of a 35mm or MF body. There are million ways to screw up and everything takes forever to do.

I have been pretty happy with the results so far, though. Click HERE for a few examples.

Good luck!


Steve

 

[eddie]

Things I may yet buy and/or make:

• Some sort of camera cover for use when the rain starts before I can break down the kit (it rains a lot where I live...)
  Steve

• 
  
  Steve- I keep the packaged showercaps, from hotels, in my 4x5 backpack. They do a good job protecting the camera & lens from rain.

 

[John Kasaian]

I kept my 8x10 expenses down by limiting myself to 1 lens, 3 holders, a heavy used tripod, a cable release, $5 Agfa loupe, an old Adam's light meter from a swap meet junk box and a home made dark cloth. When I finally added a couple of filters I thought dang, I'm gettin' to be like a real Pro!

Over the years other lenses, light meters, a bunch of film holders and other stuff have joined the kit, but the point I want to make is that you really don't need a lot of gear to get started.

 

[Sirius Glass]

Hi,
I just took the LF plunge a couple of months ago and figured that I might be in a good position to share what little I have learned.

Here is what I bought as initial kit:

• Chamonix 045N-2
• Bromwell lens boards (2)
• Caltar II-N 90/6.8
• Caltar II-N 150/5.6
• Super Rollex 6x7 roll film holder
• 1/2 dozen Riteway 4x5 film holders
• 120 size SS processing tank

Things that became urgent next step purchases:

• Epson V700 scanner
• AP plastic daylight processing tank for "taco" method developing of 4x5 negatives
• Negative sleeves/pages
• Different tripod head (the ballhead does not cut it for LF work)
• Super thick reading glasses so that I can see to focus under the cloth (presbyopia sucks)

Things I got just for the hang of it:

• Two Calumet 6x7 roll film holders

Badly needed things I still must purchase:

• Changing bag/dark tent
• Better darkcloth setup
• 4x focus loupe
• Better backpack to carry the kit in

Things I may yet buy and/or make:

• Jobo 4x5 film tank kit
• Slosher-type processing frame
• 4x5 enlarger
• Some sort of camera cover for use when the rain starts before I can break down the kit (it rains a lot where I live...)
• Larger computer hard drive and more RAM. The files for even moderate resolution scans are huge.

Additional:

• Willing assistant to help carry the kit and to keep a lookout for the bad guys, errant cars, etc. while my head is under the cloth trying to focus

As you might have guessed, the costs start adding up fast...very, very fast...much faster and much more than I would have guessed. Everything is fairly expensive and finding good quality used items is a hit-or-miss proposition. Lenses can be expensive, particularly wide angles. I felt fortunate to have gotten my two for about $550 for the pair. Film can be pricey, but fortunately Freestyle sells Arista.EDU Ultra 100/400 for less than $25 a box of 50 sheets. Processing is expensive too with prices starting at about $2.00 per sheet. If you do your own B&W, be prepared to use about 1 liter developer per 4 sheets doing the "taco" method and about half that if done in trays or with a Jobo film drum. Remember that 4 sheets of 4x5 requires the same amount of developer "strength" as a full roll of 35mm film.

So, is it worth it? I am still not sure. The camera movements are purely addictive and the larger negatives are extremely impressive. OTOH, using the camera requires a completely different mindset than that of a 35mm or MF body. There are million ways to screw up and everything takes forever to do.

I have been pretty happy with the results so far, though. Click HERE for a few examples.

Good luck!


Steve

"The Force of the Darkslide strong it is." - Yota

"The GAS shall rise again!" - Anon

 

[Joe O'Brien]

Thanks for all of your input guys! This information is really opening my eyes to all the decisions I need to make before I buy.

 

[stevebrot]

I kept my 8x10 expenses down by limiting myself to 1 lens, 3 holders, a heavy used tripod, a cable release, $5 Agfa loupe, an old Adam's light meter from a swap meet junk box and a home made dark cloth. When I finally added a couple of filters I thought dang, I'm gettin' to be like a real Pro!

Over the years other lenses, light meters, a bunch of film holders and other stuff have joined the kit, but the point I want to make is that you really don't need a lot of gear to get started.

I agree with this approach and it was my initial intent! I posted my comment to show how the expenses kept piling up. This happened despite my good collection of existing gear and my general tendency to being VERY cheap.

I am using the $5 Agfa loupe, but it is 8x and a bit too strong for use with the ground glass. I use a windbreaker jacket as a dark cloth, but that is real cumbersome and too warm now that it is summer. Making a dark cloth is an option...know anyone who has a sewing machine I can borrow? I bought everything used that I could source through that route. The film holders were particularly cheap. They are in excellent condition and I got them for $2 per. I already own a Gossen Luna Lux, so a meter is not on the list. Also on the list of stuff that I already had were various darkroom gear needed for B&W negative processing and my tripod.

The tripod head issue was a real surprise. It did not occur to me that it is not easy to true-up and position a bulky field camera when using a ball head. The replacement head for the tripod (an ancient Bogen 3028 3-D) was picked up used for $15. I was lucky, it is ideal for the task and could have cost a lot more if I had to get an equivalent new. I tried to go used with the lens boards, but after a few false starts with some really rough used stuff, I cut my losses and just bought new.

I splurged in two areas, the camera itself and the roll film option. If I had shopped carefully, I might have been able to get into a used camera at about a third of what I paid for the Chamonix. I could have trimmed the expense by about $500 if I had put off the roll film option and also stuck with a single 150mm lens. Several hundred more dollars might have been saved by deferring the print/scan option and used a service for processing.

So to break it down, here are the minimum essentials:

To Record an Image:

• Camera
• Normal lens with board and cable release
• Something to use as a dark cloth
• Film holders
• Sturdy tripod (nope the $45 Slik video pod does not cut it)
• A true 3-way tripod head
• A reliable light meter or equivalent

If you are over age 40 add:

• Higher power reading glasses than you might already require

Very helpful:

• A fine focus aid such as a loupe
• A daylight changing bag so that you can reload your film holders when needed when access to a darkroom is not possible
• A case or backpack to carry the kit in. I went out the first couple of times with everything in a cardboard box...not recommended.

May eventually be desirable:

• 120 roll-film holder(s)
• Additional lenses
• Polaroid film holder
• Different/better camera
• Gear to allow home processing of negatives/slides
• A means to optically print or digitize negatives/slides (e.g. enlarger with wet darkroom, film scanner, other equipment as might be used for alternative processes)

I ended up buying a lot of things in the last grouping because of my original goals for the LF project. But, that is just me.


Steve

 

[Joe O'Brien]

Hey, I think there has been a bunch of great advice given on this thread and I was wondering if there is anyway to make this thread easier to find for other newcomers to LF?