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Jeremy

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In the meantime, I have a compromise that we started with issue #72. We published an "Editor's Gallery" as a part of LensWork Extended (but not in the magazine) so I have a place to show some of my own work in a venue that might not ruffle feathers so much. And for those of you who think that it's an acceptable idea that a publisher of a photography magazine is a photographer himself, well, you're welcome to take a look from time to time at some of my work there. Acceptable?

Brooks


Brooks,

Thank you for adding to the discussion. You make a very convincing case and I agree with you, though it did give me pause when I saw your work in the magazine without this information here.

As for your comparison to self-published books I think there is a correlation here, but it may be spotty. Michael and Paula do publish other people's work, but the core of their publishing company is to print high quality books of their own work. As you said, you've only published your own work 3 times and therefore the point of Lenswork is obviously not to print your own work. I think my problem is that I don't think of Lenswork as "yours" even though it is because I'm not used to thinking of a magazine in such a way; this is obviously my hang-up and not yours.

I still think Lenswork puts out a great, high quality magazine.
 

lenswork

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How do we select work? Here is the short version. . .

First, we look at every portfolio we receive and some of them get immediately rejected -- primarily because they are simply not good enough for further consideration. They may be printed poorly (common), a random collection of images that don't hold together as a project (common), or just badly executed (less common).

Of the work that survives the first cut, passing the next hurdle is where most work fails to progress. Quite simply, it is all too common that the work is boring or derivative. We've been doing this so long now, we can often tell whose workshop someone has been to based on the submission we receive. For example, I cannot begin to count the number of submissions we've seen over the years of the Anasazi ruins, the slit canyons, sand dunes, lacy Havasu waterfall, etc.

Next, is there enough? We really struggle with some work, because it's wonderful work, but only, say, 6 images or so. Sometimes there are 8 or 10 great images and then another dozen that are not so good. If there isn't enough to be a full portfolio, we have to reject it even though we really like some of it. (We're working now on an idea that can help with this problem. Stay tuned.)

Next, if it's an abandoned place, we set it aside. We sometimes publish them -- they can be very interesting portfolios. But, in general, it's a rare submission review around LensWorkland that doesn't include at least five or six portfolios of some abandoned factory, abandoned house, abandoned farm, abandoned cemetery, abandoned town, etc. I've come to think of this kind of work as being "easy" in the sense that abandoned places usually don't require permission to enter, are often nostalgic by nature, and no one is going to come up and ask you what you are doing there with a camera. Whatever the reason, we reject far, far more of the these than we could ever publish.

There is usually a small pile we reject because every single blasted image is dead center. Bullet composition. Boring.

So, with what's left, we add them to our "publishing board." This is the roster of candidates that we are interested in publishing. Each time we approach a deadline, we sit down with the publishing board, review all the work that is there and start looking for combinations that we think would make a good issue. We don't -- for example -- want to have two landscape portfolios in the same issue. To preserve the "anthology" nature of LensWork, we mix and match for good combinations of work that seem to complement one another, or at the very least don't compete with one another. We also look back a couple of issues (and forward a bit) to try to select work that is not too similar to something we've recently done. This is often harder than you might guess, because the minute we publish a body of work, it seems to communicate to other photographers that we like that kind of work and we suddenly get a number of similar portfolios all arriving at once. Bad timing.

We move things around on the board until we feel we have a good fit, good timing, and strong work. Eventually, we make a decision what goes in and the rest of the portfolios on the publishing board are carried over to the next issue for re-consideration. If they repeatedly don't get selected, eventually we send them back. That's about it.

The one thing that often shocks people when I describe this may not be obvious until I mention it. We never look at what equipment they use; we don't care how it was printed; your fame or status in the photo world is never a factor in selection or rejection. I can honestly say that in 14 years I am yet to read a single curriculum vitae. Simply not interested in your degrees, experience, exhibition history, publishing success, etc. The work must stand on its own. Period. For some, this might seem ruthless. We think of it as a strict meritocracy.

Hope this gives a bit of insight into our process.
Brooks
 

roteague

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How do we select work? Here is the short version. . .

First, we look at every portfolio we receive and some of them get immediately rejected -- primarily because they are simply not good enough for further consideration.

...

We never look at what equipment they use; we don't care how it was printed;

Brooks,

Thanks for passing along how your submission process works, that is very helpful. You may want to remember that what equipment is used may not mean anything to you, but it means quite a bit to a lot of APUG members - just a thought. FWIW, I have no problem with your film work being presented in LensWork; you are an accomplished photographer, with a very interesting, and enjoyable, body of work.
 

jeroldharter

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Brooks,

I have enjoyed reading your posts. I will traveling soon so I will buy a copy of Lenswork for the trip and then subscribe.
 

michael9793

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Now there is a class act. This is how you handle Misc. BS information and getting it right from the horses mouth. [...]
My favorite work was from one of the last issues the (can't remember her name) one from the antarctic.
thanks again for the issues.

michael andersen
 
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Michel Hardy-Vallée

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I discriminate against those using DSLRs for fine art, simply because I find digital capture inferior to using film, and don't find it a tool for fine art. Digital is fine for reporting, but LensWork is supposed to be about fine art. So, I choose which issue based upon this.

Well Robert, it won't change your opinion that I say this, but you do realize that this exact same argument was used by painters against photographers all the time?

More on topic, Mr Jensen, I think you have done more than an honest job at explaining yourself, and I hope you are not having too much of a bad day because of that. Your business reasoning is sound to me, and some people will always want to have everything free, on top of being paid for having it. I must admit I haven't been much into Lenswork lately, but when I find something there that I like, I really like it.
 

MP_Wayne

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But my opinion aside, I don't frequent the bookstore reading chairs much anymore due to the constant cell phone conversations taking place all around.

At the Canadian equivalent of Barnes & Noble, Chapters Indigo Books, they took out their nice leather couches for browsers a couple of years back. Seems there were just too many folks doing the horizontal mamba on those nice couches (particularly the ones in the back corner). True story...

Now there are a select few hard ash single chairs here and there to discourage squatting patrons...
 

MP_Wayne

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... I'm curious why so many are complaining about Lenswork publishing too much digital work. I thought the issue was the images. ... But since Ms. Myers has a great "eye", I also love her digital work on Antarctica, some of which was recently published in Lenswork. Should I like her work less because in Antarctica she used a DSLR and an MF panoramic?

Hear hear! I too enjoyed those Antarctic images immensely - I did not give a whit as to how they had been derived. They were compelling and I thank both the artist and Brooks for bringing them to me in such a high quality manner. Keep up the great work...
 

rusty71

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Well. I used to subscribe to Lenswork. Sometimes I still buy an issue from the newstand. But I simply can't afford it, and will be less able to do so now. Perhaps it's just personal taste, but I look at many of the portfolios and see a particular kind of redundancy. A sort of pre-occupation with the beauty of texture and surface, but little depth of emotion in the images.
But there is a place where I can view thousands of images which suit my proletariat tastes.....

We got a long lecture about "market forces." Certainly that is a huge factor. We also hear a lot of people talk about the importance of equipment used. It is usually not a factor to me, but let's be realistic. Would Diane Arbus have been able to take the same kind of portraits without using a TLR? perhaps. But perhaps not. That wasn't the only factor in her ability, but it surely figured into the mix.
This little thing we're using here; it's called the web. It has for better or worse brought market forces to bear on the printed media. Magazines and newspapers of all sorts are drying up. There are lots of photo oriented websites like Flickr where liked minded people can share and discuss their images. I take offense at Brooks assumption that abandoned places are "easy" to photograph. Yeah, sneaking into a decrepit quarry in -10 weather so I could avoid the watchman was "Easy" allright.

I say the market has spoken. Publications like Lenswork are headed for the dustbin. It's sad because much of the work I enjoy, and in particular Bill Jay's wonderful observations. But the future of photo publication is alive and well online. It may not always be Fine Art, but there is a lot of well thought out photography and fresh ideas. No one is playing "Art Cop" and we can all have fun without taking ourselves too seriously. In the end, hasn't that always been the appeal of art and photography?
 

bjorke

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If I'm not permitted to publish my own work, who would?
Brooks, no need to apologize.

Next time this comes up, you might want to cite some other examples, who are much-lauded on APUG:

Ralph Gibson, who founded Lustrum Press to print his books but also printed many others, including people like Larry Clark or the SX-70 book or the often-cited-on-APUG "Darkroom" duet.

Alexei Brodovitch, who not only mentored Avedon and Hiro and designed books for the likes of Kertesz but also used his skills and connections to publish his rare and beautiful BALLET.

Ed Burtynsky, who built his Toronto lab business out of a desire to have someone around that he could trust to make magnificent prints -- of HIS pictures.

But more importantly, it's your magazine. Every issue is full of your opinions. In my mind, photos are more opinion than fact, so it only seems entirely natural to me that at some times your opinions come in the form of little gray-patterned rectangles.

--

Holmeses, don't be hatin' on Brooks.
 

mabman

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At the Canadian equivalent of Barnes & Noble, Chapters Indigo Books, they took out their nice leather couches for browsers a couple of years back. Seems there were just too many folks doing the horizontal mamba on those nice couches (particularly the ones in the back corner). True story...

Now there are a select few hard ash single chairs here and there to discourage squatting patrons...

I lived in Toronto for a few years, including the period around the amalgamation of Chapters and Indigo, and the eventual Comfy Chair Reductionist period.

What was funny was patrons adapted - people started sitting on the heat registers, in front of fire exit doors, etc. The staff kept telling people they couldn't sit there, but would be happy to get them a folding chair. I took advantage of this on occasion - usually not to read an entire volume, but largely to have an extended look at a new or expensive book before buying (which were largely either not in the library system yet or not at a library conveniently located for me).

But I digress...
 

eclarke

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The O.P. was about the newstand price increase of Lenswork. In this thread I promised to subscribe, which I did. This is not a commercial, but I got 1 year of Lenswork magazine and 1 year of Lenswork Extended for $37.00!! Maybe this little bit of info will change some minds, it's a short time offer...Evan Clarke
 

clay

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I agree to a point with your observation about the web being the new democratic medium. But does anyone really have time to wade through the millions of pictures on Flickr?

It raises a point about the one advantage that printed magazines still offer a reader: the ability to sift through a lot the available work and cull out the best for us to look at. They act as gatekeepers, in other words. And that seems to be the real contention here. Some people don't like a lot of the Lenswork portfolios. So they basically have a beef with the gatekeeping aspect of the magazine.

Maybe I am too easy to please, but I enjoy looking through the porfolios because it exposes me to work that I might never actively search out on my own. Even if I end up not really liking it, it makes me think about the specific reason that I don't like it. The whole notion that we have some innate right to get only what we want is sort of weird. I chalk it up to the whole solipsist world view that began when Microsoft Windows started the whole 'My computer' menu on its OS. (tongue is in cheek on that last remark)


This little thing we're using here; it's called the web. It has for better or worse brought market forces to bear on the printed media. Magazines and newspapers of all sorts are drying up. There are lots of photo oriented websites like Flickr where liked minded people can share and discuss their images. I take offense at Brooks assumption that abandoned places are "easy" to photograph. Yeah, sneaking into a decrepit quarry in -10 weather so I could avoid the watchman was "Easy" allright.

I say the market has spoken. Publications like Lenswork are headed for the dustbin. It's sad because much of the work I enjoy, and in particular Bill Jay's wonderful observations. But the future of photo publication is alive and well online. It may not always be Fine Art, but there is a lot of well thought out photography and fresh ideas. No one is playing "Art Cop" and we can all have fun without taking ourselves too seriously. In the end, hasn't that always been the appeal of art and photography?
 

thebanana

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At the Canadian equivalent of Barnes & Noble, Chapters Indigo Books, they took out their nice leather couches for browsers a couple of years back. Seems there were just too many folks doing the horizontal mamba on those nice couches

Well, the winters up here are long and cold:D
 

roteague

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Well Robert, it won't change your opinion that I say this, but you do realize that this exact same argument was used by painters against photographers all the time?

Sorry, but it is a different argument. As a landscape/nature photographer I have an implicit contract with the viewer that my images have not been falsified (for lack of a better term) in any way. Digital does not provide that safeguard, in fact, it encourages the breaking of it. Secondly, digital is a computer generated process, and as a result is entirely dependent upon the software algorithms to create the final image - an algorithm, under the current technology, is not up to the task (except for computer displayed images, or low resolution prints - like newspapers).
 

palewin

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Quote:
Originally Posted by mhv
Well Robert, it won't change your opinion that I say this, but you do realize that this exact same argument was used by painters against photographers all the time?
Sorry, but it is a different argument. As a landscape/nature photographer I have an implicit contract with the viewer that my images have not been falsified (for lack of a better term) in any way. Digital does not provide that safeguard, in fact, it encourages the breaking of it. Secondly, digital is a computer generated process, and as a result is entirely dependent upon the software algorithms to create the final image - an algorithm, under the current technology, is not up to the task (except for computer displayed images, or low resolution prints - like newspapers).

Robert: While each of us may have our preferences in art, wouldn't you agree that it is the market which defines "fine art" rather than each of us individually? I attend the AIPAD (Association of International Photographic Art Dealers) show annually in NYC, and without specific statistics, I would guesstimate that close to 1/2 of the work shown is either digitally captured or digitally printed. Since the show is made up of the dealers in "photographic art" that would seem to say that "the market" has decided that digital is indeed "fine art." Equally, if one looks at the recorded sales prices for contemporary photography, there is little price difference between digital and traditional work (you must limit this to contemporary work, since vintage prints from the "pre-digital era" still capture the highest prices, but this relates to the artist and time period, rather than the technology). So we as individuals may prefer traditional technology (obviously the APUG audience is composed of those of us with wet darkrooms and/or those who prefer to shoot film) we can't define what is, or is not, fine art.

And going back to my original post, related to LensWork publishing digital photography, many responses in this thread echo my own view, that while I personally prefer to work with film and chemicals, I can still be stimulated by visual work in any medium, be it sculpture, painting, or photography in any form. The fact that I then use this as a catalyst to produce my own imagery in "analogue" form doesn't diminish the status of the original work.

Finally, to reveal my own prejudices, I guess that with one daughter currently at university majoring in studio art I'm sensitive to discussions which IMHO seem to blur the line between the art produced, and the technology used to produce it. (Actually, while she currently is producing both sculpture and paintings, her current favorite is a printing/etching course, where she is fascinated by the combination of art in creating the etched plate, and the craft in making the print - the parallel to analogue photography is obvious. But if she one day starts to produce computer-generated art, I wouldn't feel that makes her less of an artist.)
 

roteague

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Robert: While each of us may have our preferences in art, wouldn't you agree that it is the market which defines "fine art" rather than each of us individually?

I don't know, does McDonalds define "food"? They sell a lot more "food" than everyone else; that is what the market wants after all. I see no difference between someone who uses the drive through at McDonalds and someone who shoots digital and calls it "fine art" - they are taking the easy way.
 

Shawn Rahman

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Sorry, but it is a different argument. As a landscape/nature photographer I have an implicit contract with the viewer that my images have not been falsified (for lack of a better term) in any way. Digital does not provide that safeguard, in fact, it encourages the breaking of it. Secondly, digital is a computer generated process, and as a result is entirely dependent upon the software algorithms to create the final image - an algorithm, under the current technology, is not up to the task (except for computer displayed images, or low resolution prints - like newspapers).

Robert,

I generally agree with you, and your work is superb testament that images need not be manipulated to achieve spectacular results. But for me, I'll add that I find the whole process of sitting behind the PC and manipulating an image so completely cold and boring.

I'd like to ask you to further elaborate your opinion on this statement that you wrote:

"As a landscape/nature photographer I have an implicit contract with the viewer that my images have not been falsified (for lack of a better term) in any way".

Agreed, but isn't filtering - in particular ND filtering - at odds with this sentiment? How about using fill flash? I ask this largely because Galen Rowell pretty much shared the same philosophy you did, but his use of ND filters and fill flash are well known, and some would say, disingenuous.

Your thoughts?
 

roteague

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"As a landscape/nature photographer I have an implicit contract with the viewer that my images have not been falsified (for lack of a better term) in any way".

Agreed, but isn't filtering - in particular ND filtering - at odds with this sentiment? How about using fill flash? I ask this largely because Galen Rowell pretty much shared the same philosophy you did, but his use of ND filters and fill flash are well known, and some would say, disingenuous.

Your thoughts?

There is a wide gulf between using filters to make an image appear on film the way the viewer sees it, and using a computer to falsify an image - after all, that is what cloning new skies, removing telephone poles, etc, are.
 

Michel Hardy-Vallée

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Sorry, but it is a different argument. As a landscape/nature photographer I have an implicit contract with the viewer that my images have not been falsified (for lack of a better term) in any way. Digital does not provide that safeguard, in fact, it encourages the breaking of it. Secondly, digital is a computer generated process, and as a result is entirely dependent upon the software algorithms to create the final image - an algorithm, under the current technology, is not up to the task (except for computer displayed images, or low resolution prints - like newspapers).

OK, I knew I wasn't going to change your opinion, so unless we're starting a new thread elsewhere, I won't put forth my objections to this logic...
 

rusty71

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I agree to a point with your observation about the web being the new democratic medium. But does anyone really have time to wade through the millions of pictures on Flickr?

It raises a point about the one advantage that printed magazines still offer a reader: the ability to sift through a lot the available work and cull out the best for us to look at. They act as gatekeepers, in other words. And that seems to be the real contention here. Some people don't like a lot of the Lenswork portfolios. So they basically have a beef with the gatekeeping aspect of the magazine.

(tongue is in cheek on that last remark)
I think the contention is whether it's worth the 10 or twelve bucks a month to pay for LensWorks' dubious position as a "gatekeeper" for photography.
I can pay 20 bucks a month for high speed internet access. I can look at an awful lot of photographs online. Plus, there are online "gatekeepers" such as jpg.com. Frankly the publisher's attitude bothers me. After all, 100 years ago someone was likely calling the work of Eugen Atget "Romantic junk photography of nostalgic ruins", to paraphrase. So in a sense you are correct. It's a personal preference on my part. I choose to be my own "gatekeeper" of photography.
Lenswork is a first class publication and it has many fans. I wish them luck in the future, and will certainly pick up a copy at the newstand if it suits me. But my subscription expired 2 years ago and I see no reason to renew at this point.
 

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Lenswork

I am a new APUG member and as such, I feel compelled to respond to critics of Lenswork and Brooks Jensen. I have subscribed to lenswork for some time. While there are some portfolios I don't care for, there many that I do like and am inspired with, even the digital prints), same goes for the editorials. I consider Lenswork magazine and Lenswork Extended the best productions around and will continue subscribing. (To each his own opinion).
That being said, I, along with the rest of you do believe the traditional film
and silver print processes are superior. I do have a DSLR and even scan some of my negatives and print digitally, but the wet darkroom still makes the magical prints.

Paul
 

noblebeast

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quote HKR:"Agreed, but isn't filtering - in particular ND filtering - at odds with this sentiment? How about using fill flash? I ask this largely because Galen Rowell pretty much shared the same philosophy you did, but his use of ND filters and fill flash are well known, and some would say, disingenuous."

quote Roteague:"There is a wide gulf between using filters to make an image appear on film the way the viewer sees it, and using a computer to falsify an image - after all, that is what cloning new skies, removing telephone poles, etc, are."

I'll carry Robert's reply a step further: In the particular case of Rowell, ND filters and fill-flash were used to compensate for the limited dynamic range of the film he was using - especially limited when one considers how many "stops" our eyes are capable of processing, so in effect he was using them to better represent to the potential viewer what he was seeing with his own two eyes at the time the shutter was released.

The one thing of which I can be sure when I look at a Galen Rowell or a Robert Teague photo is that the photographer was there at that moment, in the chill of the morning or the heat of the afternoon/evening, waiting for the light to be right and releasing the shutter, and the resulting photograph is the best representation of that moment that the photographer's skills and intuition can produce.

And that, to me, has always been and will always be what photography is about. I was "tricked" more than a few times in the early days of digital imaging by photos that appered to be the dedicated work of a patient, talented photographer but that turned out to have been doctored and this has left a bad taste in my mouth. While on the one hand I can appreciate the skill required to doctor those images in such a way as to not be overtly apparent, I would be reluctant to purchase an image that was created mostly by typing orders into an electronic device. As a potential purchaser of a photograph, I appreciate and value the process by which a Robert Teague image is created over that of a 100 percent digital workflow. I know I can trust the first, I have doubts regarding the second.

Joe
 

JBrunner

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I can pay 20 bucks a month for high speed internet access. I can look at an awful lot of photographs online.

I like Lenswork. Don't get me wrong. I look at images on line, as well, for my twenty bucks/month, but I'm not fooling myself that it is photography. They are images, facsimiles of photographs. The net, or a fine photo magazine is a wonderful way to peruse and expand ones understanding, especially if one lives where real photographs can't be readily viewed. That's where it stops for me. Some cold glowing phosphor, plasma, or LCD, or ink sprayed on paper isn't a photograph. A real print by a master photographer/printer is something entirely different to behold.
 
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