Leica film leader template - suggestions ?

[titrisol]

This is all good and as suspected. Leitz could have been more particular explaining the long leader, but. maybe that would put some potential buyers off ? I'm pretty set I will follow proper technique to load a film in.

I seem to remember that the long leader was common at some point in time and St.Barnack designed around it

I learned my lesson after I sent my IIIf to YYE for CLA and he said that there were bits of film in the chamber

 

[chuckroast]

The sprocket at the top of the camera does not allow the film to slip over it - it has to feed onto the sprocket holes laterally. There is also the possibility that a short leader could have the point of the film (where it becomes full width again) pierce the shutter cloth. Which would you rather cut? Film leaders or shutter curtains?

OK, that makes sense. And, of course, this is a non issue with M bodies that have the trapdoor on the back.

 

[Don_ih]

OK, that makes sense. And, of course, this is a non issue with M bodies that have the trapdoor on the back.

Although, if you're particularly sloppy, you could drive a corner of the film through the curtain in those, too.

 

[Pioneer]

I am pretty sure I have three or four of these templates around the house somewhere but I can never find them when I need them. I just pull the leader out until 20 sprocket holes are exposed and cut the leader with a small scissors. I try to start the cut between two sprocket holes and make the cut look like the little picture on the camera base. I have been doing this for a very long time but they are not always very neat. Seems to work ok.

 

[awty]

Although, if you're particularly sloppy, you could drive a corner of the film through the curtain in those, too.

Yep, I actually find the Barnacs easier to load. The leader is no big deal, slides in easy and you dont have the top cog to negotiate.

 

[GregY]

i've cut tongues with scissors, but an easy solution if you want a template is this one

Film Trimmer for Leica and Russian Clones

Film Trimmer for Leica and Russian Clones: I use old cameras including a Leica IIIf and a couple of Zorkis. The problem with bottom loading cameras is that the film can be difficult to load. There are one or two suggestions on the net, and of course there is the official Leica tool the 'ABLO…

www.instructables.com

 

[250swb]

You don't need a cutting template just common sense not to cut through a sprocket hole but cut between them, the aim being to avoid the top sprocket holes snagging on the gear teeth when loading the film. It's far, far faster than trying to load an uncut leader, and can be done at home before leaving on a photo trip. As for the time it takes those were the days when people thought nothing of cleaning out their pipe or rolling a cigarette and, when the average car was much slower than today and still augmented by horse power during the Great Depression, and flying from New York to Los Angeles in under 20 hours was record breaking, so I guess trimming the leader was something to while away the hours.

 

[Disconnekt]

Reveni Labs has a "Leica Leader cutting guide template for $14cad (~$10.40usd) https://www.reveni-labs.com/shop/p/leica-leader-cutting-guide

 

[guangong]

The reason the Leitz leader cutting template is so expensive is that its targeted market was those few who bulk loaded film, therefore relatively few made and thus coveted by collectors. 35mm film was usually packaged with a long leader; the short leader is relatively new, probably to accommodate automatic film loading. I don’t remember the need to trim leader when using ltm cameras back then.
Freestyle Photo sells a template for $19.00.

 

[Hassasin]

Bu now I am all good with simple length measurement and small curved scissors to make proper cut. I'll cut all corners round, avoid sprocket holes and that is all. I may make a basic template just to avoid actual length measurement and for quite guidance the to cut.

Maybe one day I'll get an LTM set with original template in the bag, that's always possible, even if not all that probable.

 

[btaylor]

That Reveni Labs template looked great, thanks for the suggestion- just bought one. Thanks for the suggestion.

 

[Mr Flibble]

The sprocket at the top of the camera does not allow the film to slip over it - it has to feed onto the sprocket holes laterally. There is also the possibility that a short leader could have the point of the film

It's not the sprockets in the camera that is the problem when loading film, it's the top edge of the film catching on the top edge of the frame opening on the shutter crate.

 

[Hassasin]

It's not the sprockets in the camera that is the problem when loading film, it's the top edge of the film catching on the top edge of the frame opening on the shutter crate.

Just double checked some of Leica LTM manuals, nowhere does it say that. In fact Leica does not say why the leader is to be as long as it is stated, just gives step by step film loading instructions. Sort of like, turn ignition switch, motor will start. press clutch pedal, put stick in gear 1, slowly press on gas pedal while releasing clutch and the car will go. No need to know why engine actually started or why anything else takes place.

But you state one is a fact, the other is not. Based on what? I don't judge, but I do like to know why certain things need to be done in a certain way. Given film loading steps, the early step of tightening the film between two ends prior to advancing leads one to believe it is all to help align film in its path to take up spool, be it film rail, sprocket wheel, whatever.

I think we all need to remember that long leader is how 35mm photography started, things changed / evolved and long leader was no longer a necessity.

Barnack is all new to me, just got my IIIC and given 1947 built with overall way it clicks, I have to admit, it's a mechanical joy. Good clean looks and great condition it's an icing on the cake.

 

[Ballinderry-Michael]

...

Barnack is all new to me, just got my IIIC and given 1947 built with overall way it clicks, I have to admit, it's a mechanical joy. Good clean looks and great condition it's an icing on the cake.

@Hassasin, there are two authors that I've found really informative - Andrew Matheson, whose The Leica way has pretty much everything in it. I have the 6th edition (1963), which is good on the early Ms as well as all the Barnacks. The other author is Theo Kisselbach, with two titles - The Leica book and Pocket Leica book, both from the 1950s. My copies of those are the German originals Das Leica-Buch and Kleines Leica-Buch. They are really well illustrated: Kisselbach worked for Leica. His son Hans-Günter wrote a book called Barnacks erste Leica (Barnack's first Leica) which is in German only but the illustrations are something else.

By the sound of it you certainly won't need to look up everything in thpse books; but they are very useful for out-of-the-way information - and there are copies available on abebooks.

 

[Hassasin]

@Hassasin, there are two authors that I've found really informative - Andrew Matheson, whose The Leica way has pretty much everything in it. I have the 6th edition (1963), which is good on the early Ms as well as all the Barnacks. The other author is Theo Kisselbach, with two titles - The Leica book and Pocket Leica book, both from the 1950s. My copies of those are the German originals Das Leica-Buch and Kleines Leica-Buch. They are really well illustrated: Kisselbach worked for Leica. His son Hans-Günter wrote a book called Barnacks erste Leica (Barnack's first Leica) which is in German only but the illustrations are something else.

By the sound of it you certainly won't need to look up everything in thpse books; but they are very useful for out-of-the-way information - and there are copies available on abebooks.

Thanks, have them coming since last Friday

 

[MarkS]

Since the Leica was the original 35mm camera, when Kodak introduced the Retina and the standard film canister (c.1932?) they trimmed the leader to fit the most common camera out there. They didn't go to the short leader tab until the middle 1970s (I was there for the change). By that time Barnack Leicas were long out of production, few were still in use, so there was no need to waste that bit of film.

 

[250swb]

Since the Leica was the original 35mm camera, when Kodak introduced the Retina and the standard film canister (c.1932?) they trimmed the leader to fit the most common camera out there. They didn't go to the short leader tab until the middle 1970s (I was there for the change). By that time Barnack Leicas were long out of production, few were still in use, so there was no need to waste that bit of film.

Does that even make sense? You don't need to cut the leader long to load a Retina because they had a swing back, and on top of that the Leica was not the most common camera and never has been.

 

[MattKing]

When the first Retina was introduced in 1935 - and with it the modern 35mm cassette we use today - there were already tens of thousands of Leica 35mm cameras in circulation. It makes sense that the film leader for the films loaded into those cassettes would be compatible with those existing cameras.

 

[BobUK]

Coincidence.
I saw an original leader trimmer template on ebay recently with a ludicrous asking price.
Although I have no use for one, thought was given to a home made version.
My idea was to use a piece of piano hinge. With the cheeks made from brass strips, filed to shape then epoxied to the hinge.

 

[Don_ih]

It's not the sprockets in the camera that is the problem when loading film, it's the top edge of the film catching on the top edge of the frame opening on the shutter crate.

It doesn't matter much what the reason. The end result is often film stuck in the curtain track or in gears somewhere. Incidentally, the tiny leaf springs behind the pressure plate are not made to withstand someone's thumb pressing against the plate while trying to wrangle film into position.

 

[Mr Flibble]

But you state one is a fact, the other is not. Based on what?

A decade of experience. If you feed in the uncut film and watch through the open shutter you will that it catches on the top of the film frame

Incidentally, the tiny leaf springs behind the pressure plate are not made to withstand someone's thumb pressing against the plate while trying to wrangle film into position.

They actually are pretty tough. I've never experienced a broken one in any of the LTM camera's I've had on my workbench.

 

[Don_ih]

They actually are pretty tough. I've never experienced a broken one in any of the LTM camera's I've had on my workbench.

They'd never break in the camera behind the plate. But they can flatten. That amounts to a rattling pressure plate, which I had in one of the Leicas I've taken apart.

 

[Hassasin]

A decade of experience. If you feed in the uncut film and watch through the open shutter you will that it catches on the top of the film frame

Leica says nothing about it, and bottom line is that film can catch a few tings inside as far as I can tell. You think it is only one issue, and that's fine. I see no evidence anywhere else it is actually the case.

 

[mshchem]

I have an original ablon it's perfect. I bought a quite substantial 3d printed version from. Ebay it was around 50 bucks it works well.
All you need is a steady hand and scissors, I try to keep photography as complicated as possible

 

[JerseyDoug]

The 1933 Leica General Catalog says, "The [ABLON} trimming template for Leica films is greatly to be recommended for the prescribed trimming of the Leica films. Trimming that is not carried out exactly in the prescribed fashion may easily cause jamming of the camera mechanisms." The price in 1933 was £0. 5.6