Kowa Super 66

[garpet]

I've shot a fair amount of 35mm and was looking to get into medium format. If I got a Hasselblad I would be at risk of hesitating before doing stupid things to get a good shot - which I cannot allow - so I got a Kowa super 66 instead. Anyone have experience with this? I got mixed reports on whether or not you can use straps not originally meant for it to hold it. The handle for it is kinda pricey but seems like a near necessity from what I've heard (especially if I have to wait for a strap with connectors specifically for the super 66 to show up), and whether things are compatible with it even if they're 'for' the six is unclear. Also, the one I got is coming with the E-type grid screen, but id really prefer a split or micro prism for making sure I get critical focus (as an aside, what's everyones preference for split vs micro prism for medium format? I use a split prism for my 35mm camera, but I'm interested to know if my preference is likely to change with medium format) anyone have any actual experience with the II vs the III series focusing screens? It seems like they're both compatible with the super 66.

 

[OAPOli]

I have the Kowa Six. Nice camera, fantastic lenses.

The strap studs have a standard 4mm shaft. The head is a bit larger at 7mm (vs 6mm) but the generic clips found online are compatible.

I had the left hand grip but didn't like it: you have to fight a torsional force. It's much easier to hold the body above your palm.

 

[loccdor]

I've heard and seen good things about the camera. Finding repair/CLA could potentially be a problem. Big cloth shutters tend to develop problems on the higher speeds over time. Big mirrors slap and cause a lot of vibration. If you're going to use it on a tripod one way around that is by using a strong ND filter to extend the exposures to at least several seconds.

Did you mention if you are using it with waist-level finder or prism? I prefer WLFs for cameras like that as it makes them lighter and more compact, and nicer to use on a low tripod or held near ground level.

 

[OAPOli]

@loccdor the Kowa uses a leaf shutter and has an pneumatic piston to dampen the mirror movement.

 

[loccdor]

My mistake. I read something about the mirror slap being strong enough to change the focus point. I'll shut up though as I've never used one.

 

[OAPOli]

Oh dear. Now I remember that camera-wiki article. Here is the quote:

the mirror movement may create vibrations which cause the focusing ring to rotate itself, thus shifting the focus. The focus ring has to be held tightly when firing.

That's an insane statement. Can't believe it's still up after all these years.

 

[Paul Howell]

The first generation Kowa 66 has issues with mirror slap, the later M version has mirror lock up, the Super as noted above has mirror damping. I have both a 66M and super, I don't use straps or the handle, when hiking I keep the body in my bag until I am ready to take a shot or leave on a tripod. I have the standard grid screen, never felt a need for a split screen. I think Kowa left the film camera market in the late 70s so finding screens, eve level finders may take time. Ross Yerkes in LA has parts for Kowa SL bodies and lens shutters. I last used him maybe 15 years ago, serived my SLm and a wide angle lens, did a good job at a fair price. Others report that he has included racist material in returned cameras. He doe not have a webb site so you need to call him. He might have a split image screen.

https://www.yelp.com/biz/ross-yerkes-camera-repair-los-angeles

 

[OAPOli]

The first gen Kowa Six has an air damper for the mirror.

 

[Paul Howell]

I need to see if I can find my manual, the air damper must be on the M as well. But if there is an air damp for the mirror it did not work all that well. When I bought my Kowa M in the early 80s the dealer had the M and the standard, the photographer who had traded them in was in the shop, he was a wedding photographer who traded both in for a Hassy system. He told me that he used the first generation only with flash at a high shutter speed to minimize the mirror slap. I bought the Super in the late 90s, no issues with mirror slap.

 

[OAPOli]

@Paul Howell the damper is adjustable. It can have no effect, or damp the mirror so much that there is a delay before the shutter fires. My Kowa has less mirror shock than my Hasselblad. Both are perfectly manageable.

 

[Paul Howell]

Might have lost track of the damper over the years, my manuals do not mention how to adjust the damper. Where is the adjustment located?

 

[OAPOli]

You need to remove the left side panel. The piston is on the top. On the left and right of the piston are two screws that function as needle valves.

 

[garpet]

I've heard and seen good things about the camera. Finding repair/CLA could potentially be a problem. Big cloth shutters tend to develop problems on the higher speeds over time. Big mirrors slap and cause a lot of vibration. If you're going to use it on a tripod one way around that is by using a strong ND filter to extend the exposures to at least several seconds.

Did you mention if you are using it with waist-level finder or prism? I prefer WLFs for cameras like that as it makes them lighter and more compact, and nicer to use on a low tripod or held near ground level.

Yea, I'll be using the waist level finder

 

[Paul Howell]

You need to remove the left side panel. The piston is on the top. On the left and right of the piston are two screws that function as needle valves.

OK, thanks, it's not a user intended adjustment.

 

[Paul Howell]

Yea, I'll be using the waist level finder

The WL is fine, with the 85mm 2.8 really bright, I also have eye level which I use at times, but the the WL is my default finder.

 

[outwest]

I've had the Six, the Six MM, and (and still have) the Super Sixty Six. It sits nicely in the hand like a Rolleiflex and I find it more comfortable to use that way than my Hasselblad. The various lenses are superb. With the Super be sure to track down the tripod mounting plate that allows changing the film backs on the tripod. Just be sure to watch the seals at the bottom of the film back for leakage which is simple to fix and to exercise the lenses regularly at all shutter speeds. I think it says something that in spite of also having a Hasselblad with a full range of lenses, I still have the Super.

 

[Paul Howell]

The lens are very good, in the day most reviews would say almost as good as a Ziess, but I only saw one tear down review in Modern in the mid 70s and the 85mm 2.8 tested as sharp as the 80mm 2.8 Ziess for the Rolli 66. I bought the Kowa thinking I would trade up to a Rolli or Hassy, just saw a reason.

 

[Kino]

I have the 1st Gen. Kowa Six with a handle and prism, the 55mm f3.5., 85mm f2.8 and 150mm f3.5 and it is one of my favorite kits. The lenses are superb, prism is bright and easy to focus and it's a joy to operate.

Great cameras if you can find one in good condition.

 

[Alex Varas]

Air brake is in every Kowa Six, not user adjustable but after cleaning it it does the job pretty well.
The strap, useful if you cut the original and put the end into a wide strap, mine is leather about 5cm wide.
The left hand grip, useful for carrying around the camera if there is no strap and also useful having the shutter release button for the left hand and focusing/advancing with the right hand.
My fav is the MM version, my less fav is the Super 66, working on the film backs is really nasty if they were abused before.
Lenses, the 150 is gorgeous, the 110 is the sharpness beast.
The split focusing screen you are looking for is quite rare and difficult to find if I remember correctly. I have a Rick Oleson screen in my MM and basically I don‘t miss any focus, installing this screen involves some work from your side but not difficult.
If you use different film backs on a tripod you will need the tripod adapter for Kowa Super 66 and being able to change the film back without detaching the camera from the tripod.

 

[Paul Howell]

the 110 is the sharpness beast.

I Should have bought one when I could have, hard to find.

 

[davela]

I own a Kowa Six. The 85mm F2.8 standard lens is sharp and contrasty - a pleasure to use actually. The 55mm F/3.5 gives acceptable results stopped down a little, but not in the class of say a Distagon 50mm or a Mamiya TLR 55mm IMO. The 55mm is fairly easy to find, although not that cheap. I own the very rare 40mm F4 which is frickin awesome, I think Kowa may have meant to send a message to Zeiss/Hasselblad when they created this lens. The number of 40mm's that appear on eBay every year is countable on one hand. The 19, 30, and 500mm lenses are very, very rarely seen for sale, but it occasionally happens. I think the telephotos the Kowa system are fairly common, but I don't own them.

 

[Paul Howell]

Kowa updated its lens, Heinz Kilfitt designed the first generation of lens while Kowa in house lens designers redesigned the second generation. Not sure if all line up were updated, seems the 85mm was not. The 150 first generation took a 72mm filter the second generation took a 67mm. First generation lens, 55 wide, some of the telephotos have silver barreles while all the second generation lens were black.

 

[Kino]

I think the telephotos the Kowa system are fairly common, but I don't own them.

I don't have anything over the 150mm. Don't see how you could use them without a custom lens support bracket on a tripod and I've never seen a factory bracket for sale.

Kowa updated its lens, Heinz Kilfitt designed the first generation of lens while Kowa in house lens designers redesigned the second generation. Not sure if all line up were updated, seems the 85mm was not. The 150 first generation took a 72mm filter the second generation took a 67mm. First generation lens, 55 wide, some of the telephotos have silver barreles while all the second generation lens were black.

My 55 and 85 are sliver, the 150 is black, so I guess it's 2nd generation.

 

[Paul Howell]

My 150 and 250 are Silver my 55 and 85 are black. My only grip is the 150 needs 72MM filters while the 55, 250 and 85 use the standard 67mm filters, so I carry a bit of extra weight. What I find odd is that the 1st generation silver 250 takes a smaller filter than the 150.

 

[Alex Varas]

Kowa updated its lens, Heinz Kilfitt designed the first generation of lens while Kowa in house lens designers redesigned the second generation. Not sure if all line up were updated, seems the 85mm was not. The 150 first generation took a 72mm filter the second generation took a 67mm. First generation lens, 55 wide, some of the telephotos have silver barreles while all the second generation lens were black.

Are all lenses from first gen or some of them came in the second generation?