Koni omega rapid quality ?

Dan Fromm · Aug 9, 2020

bluerough said:
Dear halfaman and Dan Fromm
I think this discussion is to confirm what I know is true or not.
Every debate is interesting, many different opinions. but calm down, don't be offensive

As I said upthread (see post #3 above), I have the 58 and the 60, have used both on 2x3. They cover 2x3, they're very good lenses and the chromes I've shot with them have correct colors. The only thing wrong with the lenses, from my narrow parochial perspective, is that they don't cover 6x12. Can't have everything ...

hsandler · Aug 9, 2020

I have a KO Rapid with the 58mm and 90mm lenses. I shoot plenty of colour (see gallery) and have not had any issues. Even if a coating theoretically could tend to act dichroically and filter out a colour, this can easily be corrected at scanning or printing stages. https://www.flickr.com/photos/hsandler/albums/72157697258248334

grat · Aug 9, 2020

halfaman said:
I read some years ago in a pdf that I can't find, I think it was by Zeiss but I can be wrong. It explained what a single coating does and why multicoating is needed. Multicoating improves transmission evenly in all visible spectrum, single coating do it just in some part of it.

And of course, Zeiss would gain nothing by convincing people that multi-coating is absolutely essential.

Do some searches, and find actually photographic articles from the 70's, where they put single vs. multi-coating to the test, and you discover there's almost no discernible difference.

Finding the exact copy of the magazine article has proven challenging, but here's some summaries (via archive.org):

https://web.archive.org/web/20060813154918/http://medfmt.8k.com/mf/coatings.html

reddesert · Aug 9, 2020

The improvement of multi-coating over single coating is that it's better at decreasing reflectivity over a wide range of wavelengths. The effect on transmission is lesser. That may sound like semantics, but it's not. Suppose you have a single air-glass interface, and uncoated it has about 96% transmission, 4% reflection. Single-coated it might have 99% transmission, 1% reflection, averaged over a range of wavelengths. Multi-coated, perhaps 99.5% transmission, 0.5% reflection, when averaged.

The difference between 99.5% and 99% transmission is negligible, but the multi-coating halved the amount of reflected light. When you have a lot of lens groups, like in a modern zoom, this matters for reducing flare. For a lens with 3 or 4 groups, like a Tessar or Planar design, it doesn't make as much difference.

I have never used a Koni-Omega lens, but I have used other lenses of that era with single coating and they're perfectly fine. These were made for professional use and a zillion studio shots, wedding portraits, magazine photos were likely made with them in the 60s and 70s.

craigclu · Aug 9, 2020

I used one for many years and had all the lenses (also the Omegaflex kit). Mostly B&W but the color work was very nice from it. Our wedding pictures were taken with one by a local pro (a prize winning fellow) and they are very sharp and accurate. His name was Virgil Byng and he took one of John F Kennedy's portraits and I always admired his work (have no idea the equipment used on that, though). Part of why I bought a Koni was from seeing his results but I ran out of talent far before approaching his abilities!

Grim Tuesday · Aug 9, 2020

I had one a while ago and could never get good results from it. I ended up selling it in "as-is" condition. But then I scanned one last roll of pictures from it and there was on really sublime picture on that roll that made me regret selling that camera. Looking back, I am sure my issue with it as a badly calibrated rangefinder. I now keep one around because I found a deal on it, and I like the eye level viewing and rangefinder, and the mamiya 6 and 7 are a bit too rich for my blood right now. I would suggest a shoe mounted light meter like the "Reveni-Labs." All told you, you will have eye-level-viewing and a light meter for under $300, and I don't think any other medium format camera can offer that.

bluerough · Aug 10, 2020

After long days I searched google about Single coated and multi coated lens. I just found this in4 from this book " Optics in Photography"
They said about "density in the shadow"...
correct me if not true, the multi coated lens on color will have more increasing the light in highlight and reducing in shadow than single coated. So multi better a little thing than single coated lens in color film ???

bluerough · Aug 10, 2020

Summary ._. All your opinions I read
- Koni omega: have nice lens, but use this camera gently.
- single coated or multi coated ??? don't have a lot of different in color film: just a little ( color cast,..) but can approve, can fix when scan or print

bluerough · Aug 10, 2020

Dan Fromm said:
They cover 2x3, they're very good lenses and the chromes I've shot with them have correct colors.

Can you show me some picture you take with 2x3. I just wanna see, the biggest format I have at the present is 6x7 =((( hope some day I can you bigger format

craigclu said:
Part of why I bought a Koni was from seeing his results but I ran out of talent far before approaching his abilities!

Yepp, that's interesting story. Hope some day I have all lens of koni omega =((((
Question about the Omegaflex kit: I just know it is very heavy, what about its glass ? equivalent to koni omega's glass or different

removed account4 · Aug 10, 2020

mgb74 said:
Unless you have a bad sample or camera/lens in need of repair, the results should be just fine. Don't get hung up in comparisons or theoretical limitations. Just make photographs and enjoy.

couldn’t agree more !

Dan Fromm · Aug 10, 2020

bluerough said:
Can you show me some picture you take with 2x3. I just wanna see, the biggest format I have at the present is 6x7 =((( hope some day I can you bigger format

Sorry, I don't have my photos scanned. 2x3 is 24x36 with both dimensions multiplied by ~ 2.33. Look at 35 mm slides or negatives, they're the same aspect ratio as 2x3, but smaller.

Question about the Omegaflex kit: I just know it is very heavy, what about its glass ? equivalent to koni omega's glass or different

Not equivalent to, identical to.

voceumana · Aug 10, 2020

The biggest advantage I know of for multi-coating is the resulting reduction in light loss permits many more elements in the lens design.

I took many transparencies with a Yashica Mat-124 with its single coated lens and the results show no particular color cast. I suspect the color cast idea is more theory than practice, as many things can influence the color balance in a photo.

grain elevator · Aug 10, 2020

I think most manufacturers tired to avert the issue of color casts by using different coatings on different elements of a lens. Very often, the reflections off the elements have different colors.

flavio81 · Aug 10, 2020

halfaman said:
90 mm and other Omega Rapid lenses are single coated. This kind of coatings adds some cast to color images, normally a yellow cast.

This is misinformation and misleading.

Correct color balance can be set using single-coating and has been done that way for decades. There are lots of single-coated lenses with excellent color balance from Nikon, Canon, Leitz(leica) etc.

halfaman said:
Because of this some people say they are not recommended for color photography, only multicoated lenses should be used..

They are mistaken.

Dan Fromm · Aug 10, 2020

Flavio, I don't mean to abuse you in any way, but contradicting what others have posted is very unpleasant. Please don't do it.

ic-racer · Aug 10, 2020

I remember discussing single vs multi coating in 7th grade study hall. People are still discussing this? We also were contemplating if Aerosmith would have a second album too. No one is discussing that anymore.

Grim Tuesday · Aug 10, 2020

I think we are beating a dead horse about single coatings when really OP wants to know about KO lenses. By the way, if anyone wants to see if the lenses have a color cast, just look through them, at a white piece of paper and decide for yourself.

What I would like to discuss is whether or not the Koni Omega is a "fragile camera" as OP was saying he learned from this thread. I've always treated it like a true workhorse. I can't think of any medium format camera I would be less gentle with, since this one is like a tank. The only potentially delicate part is the film advance, where being gentle means not slamming it in and out as hard as you can, rather pulling it firmly. And even then, I'd characterize this as less gentle than I would treat, say, a Pentax 6x7.

MattKing · Aug 10, 2020

I too doubt that "fragile" is the right term.
The "Rapid" in the name is a reference to the fact that these were designed to permit rapid operation - think wedding receptions and candid photos.
I like to compare the sound of operation with the sound of a pump action shotgun (without the firing of a shotgun shell).
The result of this concentration on rapid shooting is that the winding mechanisms in the backs do wear, and do require reasonably regular maintenance, if the camera is/was used in the manner intended.
If you want to extend the life, learn to actuate the winding mechanism smoothly.
This thread makes me want another one - non-left handed ergonomics be damned!

flavio81 · Aug 10, 2020

Dan Fromm said:
Flavio, I don't mean to abuse you in any way, but contradicting what others have posted is very unpleasant. Please don't do it.

Sorry, i don't understand who i'm contradicting apart from halfaman.

Dan Fromm · Aug 10, 2020

flavio81 said:
Sorry, i don't understand who i'm contradicting apart from halfaman.

That's the one.

flavio81 · Aug 10, 2020

Dan Fromm said:
That's the one.

I have every right to call out on what I consider are ill views, specifically that:

- single coated lenses can't get correct color balance

- only multi-coated lenses are recommended for color.

This is a forum, a place for interchanging views, which can be confronting as well.

Dan Fromm said:
Flavio, I don't mean to abuse you in any way, but contradicting what others have posted is very unpleasant. Please don't do it.

By the way, telling other forumers what to do, is very unpleasant. Please don't do it.

Dan Fromm · Aug 10, 2020

flavio81 said:
By the way, telling other forumers what to do, is very unpleasant. Please don't do it.

I didn't tell you, I asked you politely. There's a difference.

And now I've contradicted you. Oh, dear, what shall I do?

Koni omega rapid quality ?

Dan Fromm

hsandler

grat

reddesert

craigclu

Grim Tuesday

bluerough

Attachments

bluerough

bluerough

removed account4

Dan Fromm

voceumana

grain elevator

flavio81

Dan Fromm

ic-racer

Grim Tuesday

MattKing

Moderator

flavio81

Dan Fromm

flavio81

Dan Fromm

Koni omega rapid quality ?

Attachments

Moderator

Privacy & Transparency

Privacy & Transparency