Kodak XTOL trade concern announcment

[pentaxuser]

So we should remember to use SinoPromise or SP now instead of KA for chemicals. Is this correct. KA is EK still film only?

However if a problem arises with an EK film then as consumers the face of EK remains KA in terms of the front man?

Thanks

pentaxuser

 

[MattKing]

So we should remember to use SinoPromise or SP now instead of KA for chemicals. Is this correct. KA is EK still film only?

However if a problem arises with an EK film then as consumers the face of EK remains KA in terms of the front man?

Thanks

pentaxuser

If you need customer service or information with respect to Kodak still film, you should go to:
1) your retailer; or if they can't help you
2) Kodak Alaris.
Eastman Kodak has no one there set up to help you. They are only set up to deal with Kodak Alaris.
If you need customer service or information with respect to Kodak branded photo chemicals, there is a transition happening as we speak. At the moment, all the contact information is still Kodak Alaris, because the people and locations haven't changed.
At some time in the near future, the contact points will say Sino Promise or something related to them - there might be a newly formed division with Kodak in its name for all I know - but that has not yet been fully set up.

 

[MattKing]

By the way, and for what its worth, I expect that all or most of the Kodak branded black and white photo chemicals that we have been using have been contract manufactured by third parties unrelated to Eastman Kodak or Kodak Alaris for something like a quarter century. I base that on fact that Eastman Chemicals was spun off in 1994.

 

[wyofilm]

By the way, and for what its worth, I expect that all or most of the Kodak branded black and white photo chemicals that we have been using have been contract manufactured by third parties unrelated to Eastman Kodak or Kodak Alaris for something like a quarter century. I base that on fact that Eastman Chemicals was spun off in 1994.

I have no doubt that you are right about Kodak outsourcing photochemical production, but it appears that they still have a significant chemical synthesis operation. From their website:

https://www.kodak.com/en/advanced-materials/page/specialty-chemicals

 

[MattKing]

I have no doubt that you are right about Kodak outsourcing photochemical production, but it appears that they still have a significant chemical synthesis operation. From their website:

https://www.kodak.com/en/advanced-materials/page/specialty-chemicals

They do. But that isn't really a commercial product, mass market factory.
And most of that probably isn't in any way related directly to the photo chemicals we or labs use.
There is probably a small portion that is related to film and motion picture development, but mostly there probably is no connection between the product from that division and analogue photography.
Eastman Kodak is mainly a commercial printing (as in ink and presses) support business.

 

[mshchem]

If you want to see the very successful chemical company that Matt refers to just Google "Eastman Chemical Company" stock in NYSE is EMN. These guys are a huge very successful company that Eastman Kodak spun off in 1994. I think at that time, EKCo. looked at it as a "commodity" chemical company, which it is. They have been very successful in polyester plastics. We used to buy several million pounds of Tritan brand polyester resin from them. Probably still do.

These guys still manufacture all manner of basic chemicals, solvents, etc. I checked their product list didn't see Elon, or Hydroquinone listed. .

These guys and their suppliers sold the best there was in photochemicals. I've bought sodium thiosulfate pentahydrate off of Ebay it looks good, and it is good. But it's not as good as my old brown bottles of Kodak "Tested Chemicals".

 

[mshchem]

They do. But that isn't really a commercial product, mass market factory.
And most of that probably isn't in any way related directly to the photo chemicals we or labs use.
There is probably a small portion that is related to film and motion picture development, but mostly there probably is no connection between the product from that division and analogue photography.
Eastman Kodak is mainly a commercial printing (as in ink and presses) support business.

I think that advanced chemical is more of a plea for business than a thriving enterprise.
Kodak is just a little business with an amazing history.

 

[eddie]

Didn't Kodak get a 765 million loan to produce hydroxychloroquine? Wonder how that worked out...

 

[grat]

Just fiy, Coca-Cola could never afford one single canister to taste differently than what Coca-Cola is supposed to be tasting. That would be a marketing disaster.

Coke in a can tastes different than coke in a plastic bottle, which is different from coke in a glass bottle. And that's all from one bottling plant.

And whatever you do, don't get me started on that crap that comes out of the Freestyle machines.

You chose a poor example.

And I admit-- I drink too much Coke.

 

[grat]

Kodak Alaris no longer sells photo chemicals. They just sold that business to Sino Promise.
Before the sale, they did manufacture colour chemicals. They had a factory in China, and I believe a factory in South America. They sold those factories to Sino Promise as part of the sale.
They may have also contracted out some of the colour chemical manufacture.

Matt, you're trying to talk sense to a mob of angry armchair internet experts who know that it's perfectly simple to manufacture, package, and distribute globally during a pandemic, chemicals for a niche market after downsizing from a massive multi-national conglomerate.

They're much more interested in metaphorically burning anything with a "K" logo to the ground, because that will somehow make their lives better.

I recently had a pack of Duracell batteries start leaking, while in their original packaging, less than 3 months after I bought them. Instead of swearing and raging against Duracell, I contacted them, and they sent me a pre-paid return package, because they wanted to find out what went wrong. I was more than happy to oblige them. And yes, they sent me replacement batteries as well.

It's all in the attitude, and the attitudes in this thread have, by and large, been childish.

 

[mshchem]

Duracell batteries suck. They are permanently banned from my house. Like 4 times over 20 years I've had leakage, fortunately I never used in a camera. I buy ray-o-vac AA, They do house brands for Menards and others. US factory, Energizer has never burned me. I'm always careful about removing batteries. MHO WHICH ISN'T MEANT TO OFFEND.

 

[grat]

I've got an exercise bike, which gets infrequent (sadly) usage. I bought it in 2002. It's on it's second set of Duracell D-cell batteries. Up until a year ago, I've always had better luck with Duracells. Anecdotally, I heard a well-traveled, well-recorded musician rhetorically ask who the $%@()# had put energizers in his pickup system, and replace them out with Duracell, so it's all relative.

Energizer doesn't leak-- it just dies, in my experience. Duracell used to do neither-- but I admit, they've had a drop in quality control in the past few years.

 

[wyofilm]

I recently had a pack of Duracell batteries start leaking, while in their original packaging, less than 3 months after I bought them. Instead of swearing and raging against Duracell, I contacted them, and they sent me a pre-paid return package, because they wanted to find out what went wrong. I was more than happy to oblige them. And yes, they sent me replacement batteries as well.

And if the next set of Duracell batteries leaked, would you go for a third round?

 

[john_s]

Matt, you're trying to talk sense to a mob of angry armchair internet experts who know that it's perfectly simple to manufacture, package, and distribute globally during a pandemic, chemicals for a niche market after downsizing from a massive multi-national conglomerate.

They're much more interested in metaphorically burning anything with a "K" logo to the ground, because that will somehow make their lives better.........

It's all in the attitude, and the attitudes in this thread have, by and large, been childish.

Not all of us fit that description. Some of us are merely amateur photographers trying to produce our photos with minimal chance for things to go wrong.

If it matters, and I'm not suggesting that it should, some of are sad rather than angry. My parents and I have used Kodak products for 60 years at least, and I still use some Kodak film, but just not some affected chemical products.

 

[Pat Erson]

An engineer, a physicist and a mathematician were traveling together. One night three fires broke out in each of their hotel rooms."

And the photographer, upon seeing the fire, grabbed his precious gear and hurled himself throught the window... though his room was located on ground floor.

 

[eddie]

Without going through this whole thread, do we know if it's a packaging problem, a component problem, or something else entirely?
Regardless of the issue, once we're told it's been solved, I'll have no hesitation about using it again.
I think every auto manufacturer has had recalls, yet we still buy their cars...

 

[AgX]

I think every auto manufacturer has had recalls, yet we still buy their cars...

But at least some models are said to have been failures at the market just as their image did not recover after recalls and successful repairs. I know at least one tv commercial from the 60's where even was hinted at such recall that was described as a kind of children-disease long ago cured and prohibitated.

 

[eddie]

I hope they do identify the problem.

 

[removedacct1]

I hope they do identify the problem.

Kodak Alaris isn't going to issue a recall of a product without first identifying the exact problem! Of course they know what the issue is. They're under no obligation to disclose the details.

 

[radiant]

10 days since my first email with Kodak and still no response.

If they really cared about this situation, they would have responded already. In 10 days or 240 hours you can send plenty of emails. I even emailed again few days ago and no response to that either.

I would say the company doesn't care / new owner doesn't understand the situation at all.

 

[Laurent]

10 days since my first email with Kodak and still no response.

If they really cared about this situation, they would have responded already. In 10 days or 240 hours you can send plenty of emails. I even emailed again few days ago and no response to that either.

I would say the company doesn't care / new owner doesn't understand the situation at all.

Same here, I only have one bag of this lot, so it won't be a big issue if I lose it, but it may affect my future purchases...

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

10 days since my first email with Kodak and still no response.

If they really cared about this situation, they would have responded already. In 10 days or 240 hours you can send plenty of emails. I even emailed again few days ago and no response to that either.

I would say the company doesn't care / new owner doesn't understand the situation at all.

I'm sure they care. They responded to me after a few days. Maybe I got on the list early... Try emailing again.

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

I should add that it only took a few days to hear back from them... If I hadn't heard from them yet, I'd probably keep emailing them.

 

[radiant]

I should add that it only took a few days to hear back from them... If I hadn't heard from them yet, I'd probably keep emailing them.

Two emails is enough for me. I probably contact seller and ask for refund. My XTOL replacements arrived yesterday; ID-11 and Excel Maybe I develop a test film with Excel and see if there is difference with my mixed Xtol stock. I just don't know what batch it is made from

 

[Adrian Bacon]

im guessing the xtol would work OK if mixed with a bit of one's favorite print developer .. les mclean wrote at one point about how he liked to add a little rodinal into his xtol to give it a little something he thought it was missing. I typically add a shake of whatever print developer I have lying around when I use caffneolC which sometimes has a tendency to give thin xtolesque negatives. all may not be lost, and who knows you might like xtolxtra better than it performs flying solo...

YMMV

I actually do the opposite. I keep all my old replenished XTOL and use it to mix up print developer. 100ml of Multigrade concentrate and 900ml of old used XTOL. It makes for some markedly different prints than just straight stock multigrade, or working strength dektol. If/When I switch to Ilford DD developer, I'll do the same thing... I also keep the my old used D-76, Rodinal, etc and put it in the used developer bottle and use it to mix up working strength print developer. I like the prints that I make with that. Of course, this is for my own work. I don't do that for customer prints, unless they ask me to.