Kodak Professional Portra 400

[2F/2F]

If they could only have one Portra emulsion in this speed, I would have preferred that they had kept the saturation of the NC film. Before we had a choice about saturation, and now we will have none. There is no way that this is good news.

It is only good news from the "anything is better than nothing" standpoint...which certainly has value, given the obvious state of film demand.

 

[jpberger]

Looks like this will be a middle of the road Portra, what I am wondering is if you can get it to act like VC or NC by moving a half stop either way.

My thoughts exactly, and one of the reasons a lot of people like the fuji 400h-- it can be vivid or subdued depending on how you expose it.

 

[Erik Petersson]

My thoughts exactly, and one of the reasons a lot of people like the fuji 400h-- it can be vivid or subdued depending on how you expose it.

Hmm, I do like this film, but I did not know that it is so flexible. Please do tell me how you achive this!

 

[rphenning]

My thoughts exactly, and one of the reasons a lot of people like the fuji 400h-- it can be vivid or subdued depending on how you expose it.

I hope this is the case as well, portra 400nc was one of the main reasons I shot with medium format.

 

[holmburgers]

Although it's sad that things are changing (and change breeds uncertainty) whatever Kodak can do to remain profitable is good in my book. I think consolidating their line is a good, if not somewhat sad, solution.

Now it's up to us to determine how far these new films can be stretched.

 

[traveller]

Looking at the Kodak Reports 2nd-Quarter 2010 it is still good news to me that Kodak invests in new film. Especially when you read this passage

Film, Photofinishing and Entertainment Group second-quarter sales were $466 million, a 21% decline from the year-ago quarter, driven by continuing industry-related declines.

Second-quarter earnings from operations for the segment were $29 million, compared with earnings of $51 million in the year-ago period. This decrease in earnings was primarily driven by industry-related declines in volumes and increased raw material costs, partially offset by cost reductions across the segment.

They have to cut costs and in my eyes it is better to have fewer films with superb quality control than no film from Kodak at all in some years

John

 

[mabman]

Looking at the Kodak Reports 2nd-Quarter 2010 it is still good news to me that Kodak invests in new film. Especially when you read this passage

Film, Photofinishing and Entertainment Group second-quarter sales were $466 million, a 21% decline from the year-ago quarter, driven by continuing industry-related declines.

Second-quarter earnings from operations for the segment were $29 million, compared with earnings of $51 million in the year-ago period. This decrease in earnings was primarily driven by industry-related declines in volumes and increased raw material costs, partially offset by cost reductions across the segment.

They have to cut costs and in my eyes it is better to have fewer films with superb quality control than no film from Kodak at all in some years

John

My continued annoyance with Kodak's reporting is that they don't break down the results from Film, Photofinishing, and Entertainment into results for those individual categories, at least in the general media releases.

It's possible (maybe even likely) film sales are down, but we don't know for certain because those results keep getting bundled with other things.

So, the question is, are they consolidating film lines because of *specific* film sales issues, or just because of general cost-cutting across the whole division? Enquiring minds want to know

 

[fotch]

They reduced the SKU from 2 to 1 making it easier to stock. This is better than losing both. Its the world order.

 

[SWphoto]

Yes, we live in the New Normal era

 

[perkeleellinen]

A little bit about this in the BJP:

http://www.bjp-online.com/british-j.../kodak-replaces-professional-films-portra-400

 

[2F/2F]

So, according to BJP, with this announcement, two color 8x10 films bite the dust as well. However, while they state that 400NC and 400VC were available in 8x10, I was only aware of the NC. I highly doubt that the VC was available in 8x10, as it was not available in 4x5.

Thank heavens they decided to make the new film in 4x5 size! It takes the place of 400NC as the only 400 speed color 4x5 sheet film in existence. It is extremely useful in a hand held 4x5, or in studio filtered for tungsten light.

 

[jpberger]

Hmm, I do like this film, but I did not know that it is so flexible. Please do tell me how you achive this!

Ok this is getting off topic but quickly since you asked 400h at ~box speed-- very subdued colours
400h at - ~1/2-1 stop over box speed-- more intense colour
~1-1/2 to 2 stops over -- soft pastel colours

This is true of all colour neg to some extent, it's just that the fuji stuff tends to have more lattidude for over exposure before it falls apart. It will be interesting to see how the new porta behaves visa vis exposure

 

[MaximusM3]

I don't view Kodak's statement as implying that film has a problem but as a fact that the overall state of the economy just sucks and they are suffering like everyone else.

 

[Tim Gray]

I'd rather they discontinue 400NC and 400VC and bring out a new film then just kill one of the two and leave us with the other. They are still putting money into bringing out new products and trying to create ones that will have a chance of surviving longer. That's the way I look at it. And I loved 400NC.

 

[waynecrider]

Not that I will go looking for it, but I wonder what the income after expenses was for their digital division.

On another note, at 29M for the quarter with a loss of about 44% over the year ago quarter, I'd be happy there is even one Kodak color film that you can count on of being very high quality. This especially so in light of the thread by PhotoEngineer. I believe it's coming down to to the point of doing something beyond trying to shoot enough film to help keep any color film in production. What seems to be needed is a campaign on various fronts towards the goal of getting shooters back in the fold on a partial basis to start and then trying to cultivate new shooters thru various means. Paths that can be explored are newspaper/magazine submission articles by some here with more knowledge then most, TV media coverage and/or famous personality support, planned group introduction workshops (LF comes to mind) and an increase by film users in contest with the goal of obviously showing great images and winning. I would also put forth the idea of a documentary on film and it's adherents as well as the famous photographers of yesteryear. We need to generate buzz. The first path of getting attention is talk, talk, talk and not just here in this forum. My feeling is that if you snooze you lose.

 

[Photo Engineer]

You should read this thread: (there was a url link here which no longer exists)

Of particular note there is Perez' comments and then relate this to post #32 above. There are specific declines. And, relate this to changes in the Fuji line up as well.

It is real, and it is happening. Film underwent another decline in the first part of this year, and specific products were involved. It is not legal to repackage an existing product under a different label and call it "new". It must be "new" and if improvements or changes are claimed (which is needed for something to be called new), then those specifications must be real. This is good. It means that some R&D is still ongoing small as it might be.

PE

 

[MaximusM3]

Not that I will go looking for it, but I wonder what the income after expenses was for their digital division.

On another note, at 29M for the quarter with a loss of about 44% over the year ago quarter, I'd be happy there is even one Kodak color film that you can count on of being very high quality. This especially so in light of the thread by PhotoEngineer. I believe it's coming down to to the point of doing something beyond trying to shoot enough film to help keep any color film in production. What seems to be needed is a campaign on various fronts towards the goal of getting shooters back in the fold on a partial basis to start and then trying to cultivate new shooters thru various means. Paths that can be explored are newspaper/magazine submission articles by some here with more knowledge then most, TV media coverage and/or famous personality support, planned group introduction workshops (LF comes to mind) and an increase by film users in contest with the goal of obviously showing great images and winning. I would also put forth the idea of a documentary on film and it's adherents as well as the famous photographers of yesteryear. We need to generate buzz. The first path of getting attention is talk, talk, talk and not just here in this forum. My feeling is that if you snooze you lose.

Wayne,

I feel that you are indeed correct. Although this is a little of a taboo subject here, I still 100% confident that the only way for film to be stable and survive, a marriage and understanding of digital workflow has to be promoted and encouraged. The lab situation is likely never to see improvement (it's a miracle if it stays where it is now) and forget about teaching youngsters about darkroom work. We live in a different world and if one promotes the fact that film photography (and especially black & white) is truly special, development is easy and incorporating it into scanning, digital workflow, the results can be very fulfilling. It may sound like heresy here but we have to be realistic and, like I always say, we can't have our cake and eat it too. I want to keep shooting film but a bunch of nostalgic old timers like us are not going to keep the boat floating for ever. This year I have spend many thousands on film and chemicals, but the most important thing I am doing, is push it to my two kids who may have to carry the torch and develop an appreciation for it. My daughter spends hours in front of a computer and I stand a much better chance at teaching her post processing digital techniques on scanned film than locking her in a darkroom where she can't iChat and AIM with her friends

 

[Ektagraphic]

I view this as good and bad news. I liked having two different 400 speed films but I am glad to see that there was some more effort put into film. I hope I won't feel like I miss the old film and I hope that the 160 emulsion remains unchanged!!!

 

[Ektagraphic]

My only hope right now is that they don't do the same thing with the 160 speed film! I really hope that things will stay as 160 NC and 160VC!!! It also appears that October must be Kodak film month! Last year in the big change was Ektar coming to store shelves now, a new Portra will be put in place and two put to rest.

 

[wblynch]

Perhaps an increased investment in advertising would help boost Kodak's film sales?

A lot (as in a LOT) of people don't even think you can buy film anymore.

I remember the old days of Kodak product placement and advertisement on Disney.

Some product placement or kids with film cameras on a popular new sitcom or 'hip' TV show would help too.

Get Lady Gaga to shoot some film instead of tossing empty Polaroid cameras around. Imagine if she showed up at the VMA's with a Leica instead of a meat dress?

 

[Tim Gray]

Get Lady Gaga to shoot some film instead of tossing empty Polaroid cameras around. Imagine if she showed up at the VMA's with a Leica instead of a meat dress?

Maybe a meat Leica. Or even better, a meat 4x5.

 

[holmburgers]

....We need to generate buzz. The first path of getting attention is talk, talk, talk and not just here in this forum. My feeling is that if you snooze you lose.

And everything you said before this quote too.... I like the attitude!

You know, writing to your editor might not work for politics, but maybe it's enough to save film! People seem to have forgotten that film has been the basis of professional photography for the past 100 years. They look at you weird if you insist on working with film.

That's the key though, demand your work be done on film and show people what it is capable of.

And jeez, a modest ad campaign for film would be huuuuuugge.

edit: Also, I agree whole-heartedly with what MaximusM3 says about incorporating digital workflow, integrating with computers, because there's no denying that is where we are at. Scanners are the bridge to the exact same controls and maniupaltions of digital photogrpahy, but the added benefit of an analog source is huge (as we well know!)

 

[B&Wpositive]

I view this as good and bad news. I liked having two different 400 speed films but I am glad to see that there was some more effort put into film. I hope I won't feel like I miss the old film and I hope that the 160 emulsion remains unchanged!!!

The sample images look brilliant. Based on limited experience with other Kodak films over the years from VR200 to Ektapress to Max to Portra, I have a feeling that this one is going to have a very luminous, yet realistic rendition. Not too warm, not too cold. Not too saturated, not to flat. Not too bright, but not too dark. Just right. Could this be the color negative Goldilocks? We'll have to wait and see...

The lab situation is likely never to see improvement (it's a miracle if it stays where it is now) and forget about teaching youngsters about darkroom work. We live in a different world and if one promotes the fact that film photography (and especially black & white) is truly special, development is easy and incorporating it into scanning, digital workflow, the results can be very fulfilling. It may sound like heresy here but we have to be realistic and, like I always say, we can't have our cake and eat it too. I want to keep shooting film but a bunch of nostalgic old timers like us are not going to keep the boat floating for ever.

Agreed. Hybrid digital color film methods (the only method that I personally ever used for making color prints, save for a course a few years ago that entailed the color enlarger) is becoming increasingly important. Though there is a very active group who prints color via enlarger, I would guess that the majority scan rather than enlarge. As one of the scanning crowd, I personally don't see the cessation of Portra 400NC (or VC depending on which one you preferred) as a huge loss.

However, I do believe that the darkroom will not die off as long as there is film and paper. I believe that teaching darkroom to kids is not something to forget about. In fact, a mentor of mine does just that: he teaches a photography course (albeit in black and white) which is totally darkroom based. He is teaching 6th graders in a private school, and they love it. They catch on, and they think it's just the coolest thing to be able to make photographs in this way. Remember, the less common a process becomes, the more intriguing it is to those who have never tried it. Digital photography is readily accessable at home, in schools, etc, for the average practitioner today. We're saturated in digital! The hybrid film/scanning method is more intriguing though, because it's less common. Luckily it's still pretty easy though. Buy film, develop it yourself, and then scan. And the traditional method (sans computer) is even more intriguing for those who haven't done it. They just need to be introduced to it by someone. And this is the process whereby photography is easily elevated to an artform. Once someone realizes this, nothing will keep them out of the darkroom.

So I don't see this as just a two-for one dicontinuation/introduction of a film. I see it as the redefinition phase of analog photography. Analog photography should be promoted as a viable and respectable artform...not as a relic of the previous century. Unfortunately, there is still a perception out there in the general population that film is somehow outdated, and therefore lower quality than digital. With new films like this Portra 400 that set the bar for photographic image quality, there is no reason that people should continue to believe this nonsense. Don't let people typecast you as old fashioned because you shoot film. Teach them that it's a lot more than just another old habit when they ask why you shoot film. Show them how much of an artform it can become. Show them why it makes you more dedicated to your photography. And when they say it's old fashioned and lower quality than digital, tell them how excited you are about the new Ektar or the new Portra that just came out and offers the best image quality of any film in the world up to this point in time.

 

[Ektagraphic]

I'll agree with you B&W Positive. I would like to see a new product introduced without having one (or more) discontinued at the same time. I don't want to sound like I am complaining. At least it appears like Kodak is continuing to invest in some damn good film technology. It's better than loosing two films without any replacement.

 

[Ken Nadvornick]

Perhaps an increased investment in advertising would help boost Kodak's film sales?

Of course it would.

But first you have to want to sell film. Not just temporarily want the money from selling film. Want to sell film. That means actively working to make a market for the product you believe in.

If, however, your long-term strategic direction lies elsewhere, it would just be a waste of company resources.

Ken