Kodak gets loan; Stock Triples in Value!

[MattKing]

Eastman Kodak has no involvement in the manufacture and marketing of retail and commercial photo chemicals, other than perhaps some chemicals related to motion pictures.

 

[wyofilm]

Matt -
Do you know if Kodak Alaris markets photographic chemicals manufactured by anyone other than Kodak? Is KA required to only source and market from Kodak?

 

[MattKing]

Eastman Kodak does not manufacture any photographic chemicals that I am aware of (see caveat below*). They are involved in compounding some of the extremely specialized components required for making film, but most of that work is also sub-contracted to others.
Kodak Alaris does not manufacture any photographic chemicals.
All photographic chemicals with the Kodak name on them are manufactured by other entities.
Both Ilford/Harman and Kodak Alaris had moved all of the black and white photo chemical manufacture to Tetenal in Germany, and then Tetenal went into receivership. A reconstituted Tetenal has come out of receivership. Ilford/Harman appear to have left manufacture with Tetenal. Kodak Alaris appears to have stayed with Tetenal for some black and white photo chemical products, and moved some other products to US manufacturers - thus the angst about changes to HC-110 (being one example).
As a result of Tetenal's situation, plus the Covid-19 pandemic, there are disruptions in supply.
The colour photo chemicals with Kodak's name on them seem to be manufactured in China and at least one other international location.
It is only still films that Kodak Alaris has the exclusive right to source from Eastman Kodak and market worldwide.
Eastman Kodak manufactures those still films. They also manufacture motion picture films, and they do their own marketing of them.
*Caveat: I don't know whether Eastman Kodak has any involvement in manufacturing motion picture film chemistry - ECN and ECP. They aren't involved in the E6 photo chemicals.

 

[pentaxuser]

So, Matt, it would appear that a reasonable conclusion is that whatever happens to Kodak as a result of the malfeasance case we can rest assured that there is no effect on the range and price of Kodak chemicals?

On the question of its effect on film do I take it that your "take" is that you are not close enough to know how future manufacture in terms of price and range of films might be affected. I understand this. In fact there probably isn't a single person on Photrio who is close enough to the real state of Kodak finances to say what the consequences might be. Would this be a reasonably accurate statement?

So from this, it is in the words of Doris Day "Que sera, sera"

Thanks

pentaxuser

 

[kuparikettu]

Que sera, sera...

Even so, I want to believe that since film (especially motion picture film!) is still a big business - even if not nearly as big as it used to be - it'd not be wise to close the factory and stop manufacturing Kodak film, who ever owns it in the future...

 

[MattKing]

So, Matt, it would appear that a reasonable conclusion is that whatever happens to Kodak as a result of the malfeasance case we can rest assured that there is no effect on the range and price of Kodak chemicals?

Eastman Kodak has very real problems with availability of capital.
If its stock price plummets again because of these apparent manipulations, it could be very bad for its existence.
If Eastman Kodak doesn't exist, where rests the value of the brand.
Kodak Alaris is in the process of selling a big chunk of its non-film Kodak rights (primarily RA-4 colour paper) to a Chinese company that is the world's largest distributor of Epson. It is clear that the colour photo chemical business is included in that deal, but not clear whether the black and white photo chemical business is included.

On the question of its effect on film do I take it that your "take" is that you are not close enough to know how future manufacture in terms of price and range of films might be affected. I understand this. In fact there probably isn't a single person on Photrio who is close enough to the real state of Kodak finances to say what the consequences might be. Would this be a reasonably accurate statement?

Correct.

 

[AgX]

I do not see how any misbehaviour/criminal activity had direct effect on Kodak. It survived with extreme low share prices and without that loan so far.

 

[Arthurwg]

Let's face it, Trump loves film but he had no idea that Kodak doesn't make it any more.

 

[AgX]

Kodak does not make film anymore? Did we all missed something?

 

[George Mann]

The film division of Eastman Kodak is alive and well.

 

[mshchem]

Tonight Eastman Kodak shares are up 31% in after hours trading. Some hedge fund bought over 5% of the shares outstanding.

 

[AgX]

Are there any updates on Kodak having started production of generic drugs?

The latest I found is this from last December:
https://www.fiercepharma.com/manufa...ufacturing-loan-played-by-books-investigation


The most important statement for us, by Kodak CEO, was that Kodak would enter the API business with or without government support

 

[luckypiglive]

Congrats to those that had Kodak stock and held. A $765 government loan has rescued you.


https://www.morningstar.com/news/ma...government-loan-to-help-produce-generic-drugs

ohh I didn't know that kodak produces generic drugs as well. anyway lately I don't see it often the name...it's fading...not like it was before..something like happened to nokia happened to kodak as well

 

[AgX]

ohh I didn't know that kodak produces generic drugs as well.

Well, they stated to start again such production, but from my post above you see that so far no one here confirmed the start of such.

 

[removed account4]

Kodak's core business and its strength has always been chemistry related products.

photofinishing was their core business, when they shuttered that it it was their Achilles Heal. it would be nice if the Pharma industry helped them but what would be better is if they somehow got back their photochemical industry and actually started supplying people with Dektol that wasn't a chocolate mess ( amongst other things ) and maybe 120 film backing paper that they sell to everyone else so no one gets the infamous backing paper bleed that plagued MF photographers for 10 years. its a massive blow to their reputation to have their name on products that have been a staple for 100+ years that are currently useless. don't misread me please, I grew up thinking Kodak was the only photography company that existed, never knowing anything else until I was in my 20s ( except for the local guys down the road from me who ran sprint ) so I wish them all the luck in the world. but the current situation, making pharma here, paying american wages to workers to make pharma ? that's like paying 80$ a caplet of acetaminophen is too funny, unless it says KODAK on each tablet then its worth it cause we can all pay for the bottle take each tablet as directed and click our heals together 3 times and say "there's no place like Kodachrome". if you ask me, its more like they have too much voltage in their vape pen, their burning off the filament and impurities in their E-juice made by some high 13 year old in their mom's kitchen at 2am so they can chasing the dragon at a red light and have a nasty cough 2 days later.

Quinine derivatives plus Zinc is believed to be highly effective against SARS-Influenza.

you forgot bleach injections, a tea made from couchgrass, clever and cramp bark ( consumed under a pyramid of course ), oleadrum, and the dog distemperment shots .. highly effective :munch:

 

[gone]

If it's true that Kodak manufactures generic drugs, I'm going to look closely at what my doctor prescribes so that I don't end up w/ any of those. I'm still hopping mad at this company for selling me developers that were in defective packaging and never refunding my money, something they assured me in writing that they would do.

I would love to see them finally get their noses rubbed into the laws of cause and effect. They're behaving like a crappy company, not like a good company. If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck and sounds like a duck, it's a duck.

And you know, when one door shuts, another one opens. Thanks to their incompetency and shifty business practices, I've discovered other films and developers and don't miss Kodak at all in my life, except for the aggravation they caused and the money they essentially stole from me. They're going to find that customers have long memories.

 

[GRHazelton]

Kodak has had a specialty chemical division for decades. I remember as I grew up (I'll be 78 in August) my Father took Scientific American magazine; it regularily had ads for Kodak's speciality division. Consider: If Kodak could produce Kodachrome and its development process profitabily for decades, surely they could make precusor chemicals for pharmaceutical manufacturing.

 

[MattKing]

Much of Kodak's specialty chemical production capacity went with Eastman Chemicals when that business was sold, but they retained enough to be not entirely out of that business.

 

[AgX]

Kodak has had a specialty chemical division for decades. I remember as I grew up (I'll be 78 in August) my Father took Scientific American magazine; it regularily had ads for Kodak's speciality division. Consider: If Kodak could produce Kodachrome and its development process profitabily for decades, surely they could make precusor chemicals for pharmaceutical manufacturing.

This thread is not about precursor chemicals, but active drug components and a loan Kodak was to get to start production of this.

Whether a activity in pharmaceutical production at this degree (should it happen at all) is benefitial for us film photographers or not, is seen differently by us as this thread shows.

 

[cmacd123]

as far as manufacturing, making a specific chemical in bulk is the same business no mater if it is an ingredient or something that will be further reacted by another maker to eventually end up as an end product. My very old "Eastman organic Chemicals" book mentioned at the time that theiy had facilities that were licenced by the State of New york for producing pharmaceuticals. No doubt with the propensity to sell off any business taht was not as profitable as Kodacolor, they probably lost that capability over the years. (which is why the Dektol that is sold now is no longer made in Rochester)

and generic drugs are often made by companies that specialize in the business, while they are sold by other companies that finish and package them. Apotex (https://www1.apotex.com/ca/en) is one of the biggest but they have their ingredients made all over the world.

one trick with drugs is that there are "codes of Manufacturing Practice" which make the quality control procedures that the Photo film industry uses look like shade tree chemistry. Health Canada and the FDA have simalar rules and they are quite extensive. https://www.fda.gov/drugs/pharmaceu...-good-manufacturing-practice-cgmp-regulations

 

[luckypiglive]

Kodak has had a specialty chemical division for decades. I remember as I grew up (I'll be 78 in August) my Father took Scientific American magazine; it regularily had ads for Kodak's speciality division. Consider: If Kodak could produce Kodachrome and its development process profitabily for decades, surely they could make precusor chemicals for pharmaceutical manufacturing.

to tell you honest, I would prefer to buy my camera from a company that does only cameras

 

[Don_ih]

Whether a activity in pharmaceutical production at this degree (should it happen at all) is benefitial for us film photographers or not, is seen differently by us as this thread shows.

My guess is it's about as beneficial as Fuji manufacturing makeup.

 

[warden]

one trick with drugs is that there are "codes of Manufacturing Practice" which make the quality control procedures that the Photo film industry uses look like shade tree chemistry.

Correct, pharmaceutical GMP is on another level from photo chemistry and if Kodak is engaged in this we'd probably have heard of the huge investment in facilities and employees to make it happen.