Kamerastore of Finland launches crowdfunding to sell Kodak Aerocolor 125 as SantaColor 100 after its B&W films got discontinued for being Russian

Fortepun · Jun 10, 2022

Well, a couple of things, really. No, this won't be a sub $10 new color film. It will be a ~$14 C41 color negative before shipping. Kodak's Aerocolor air surveillance film is popular in Russia. Hell knows why, but it is. Kamerastore says the following on why this hasn't been repackaged before much in the western world:

“Firstly, the film is not handled by most canister-spooling machines because of the thinner than normal base. This means that it has to be spooled by hand, and most places are not able or willing to do this – usually for economic reasons. Compared to the amount of work this project is, we are not making much profit at all."

“Secondly, the minimum order is about 15,000 rolls. This is much more money than most small companies are willing to put down for an unknown film that then requires a lot of work to resell."

“Finally, and most importantly, until last year, you could buy cheaper colour films than even the material cost of SantaColor 100. Prices of cheaper films like Kodak Gold 200 and Fujifilm C200 used to be so cheap that there would be no demand for an unknown film from a small brand that costs between 10 and 15€. This is no longer the case, and it therefore now makes sense to make this film available.”

Entry into this crowfunding is not cheap, but there you have it. A made in USA film that's interesting in terms of tone, and probably way better in questionable weather than Proimage 100, due to being an air surveillance emulsion.

How do you feel about this?

Bronson Dugnutt · Jun 10, 2022

Yum yum, gimme some. That's why they're called 'the Reds'.

If I knew with any certainty what my address would be in 6 months time I'd already be in for a bulk roll.

Donald Qualls · Jun 10, 2022

I need to think hard about this -- the bulk roll price isn't at all excessive (barely more than HP5+ or Tri-X), and that's for a genuine C-41 stock that never had remjet. Trying to recall why I've never registered with Kickstarter... ...but this is IndieGoGo. I"ll look when I'm home.

radiant · Jun 10, 2022

I just needed to write: the product is coming from the town where I live. Absurd.

AgX · Jun 10, 2022

This film already is converted in Ukraine. Thus better put all effort to end that war instead to begin yet another Kickststart project.

gone · Jun 10, 2022

The sample pics on that website look really good. I'm still trying to figure out why a made-in-America film is sent to Europe for hand spooling, but just add that to the list of things that I don't understand these days. I guess they figure it's a larger market for them.

Make photographs, not war, that's my sentiment.

radiant · Jun 10, 2022

momus said:
I'm still trying to figure out why a made-in-America film is sent to Europe for hand spooling, but just add that to the list of things that I don't understand these days. I guess they figure it's a larger market for them.

Because the available automatic spoolers cannot handle that film. There is demand for color film. They also want to make sure the spooling is done with good labor & payment conditions. Pretty crazy actually in terms of how much labor costs in Finland.

MattKing · Jun 10, 2022

There may also be other European users of the film who actually use it for its intended purpose. Existing users mean an existing distribution channel.

Paul Howell · Jun 10, 2022

I'm surprised that there any market for color areo film at all.

mshchem · Jun 10, 2022

Does Kodak still produce this stuff. I found a datasheet last updated in 2009. The 125 speed is not ordinary ISO but a film speed for Aerial films ISO A, apparently for maximum contrast.

Found this note, from the good old days from datasheet at Kodak.com

Note: The Aerial Film Speed given in this publication is
rounded to the nearest cube root of 2 step (equivalent to
1⁄3 stop).

AgX · Jun 11, 2022

Paul Howell said:
I'm surprised that there any market for color areo film at all.

Well, to begin with colour aerial films are not the same. Some even had similar emulsions as terrestial films.

Maco were the first to introduce aerial colour film in a bigger style to the market. For their unmasked CN version their sale arguments were:

-) better for scanning (actually the argument by Agfa themselves)
-) ideal for dual use - that is processing as intended in C-41 (for scanning or printing) or crossprocessing in E-6 (for making slides, as lacking a mask and having an undyed base)

As some aerial films have to be converted to amateur formats anyway, there is the opportunity to offer it in special forms not offerd by the oroginal manufacturs on the market so far.

LeoniD · Jun 11, 2022

Fortepun said:
Hell knows why, but it is

Because the Kodak distributor sells it and there are labs that put it into canisters. Plus it was available from Astrum. It's not cheap, but nowhere near 15$/roll. And the minimal order, iirc, was around 300m, not 24.7 km, as "Santa" claims

Does Kodak still produce this stuff.

Seems like they do, or, at least, they have a big amount in the freezer

Arcadia4 · Jun 11, 2022

According to their explanation, it comes in 300m/1000ft rolls. It may be that the MoQ is 1 roll but the practical minimum is around shipping worthwhile pallet quantities of it to Finland and any price break for bulk, it seem they plan to buy roughly 83 x 300m rolls.

Early backer offers are ca. 10E/Roll or 135E for 30m which doesnt seem unreasonable cost for the effort involved and they essentially say it wouldn't be worth the effort if Gold/C200 was readily available.

Presumably difficult to buy a single 300m roll from Kodak. Has anyone?

AgX · Jun 11, 2022

Arcadia4 said:
Presumably difficult to buy a single 300m roll from Kodak. Has anyone?

Single rolls of wide rolls of Kodak aerial films were listed. And many years ago I wanted to buy one. Kodak Germany was clueless, Kodak USA were most friendly but had it about having to follow a sales hierarchy and only could hint at a german aerial surveyor as their sales representative, who then again stated not to know about that film.

Well, having to kind of beg for being sold something, I saw as a sign to save myself a 4-digit sum...

Huss · Jun 11, 2022

mshchem said:
Does Kodak still produce this stuff. I found a datasheet last updated in 2009. The 125 speed is not ordinary ISO but a film speed for Aerial films ISO A, apparently for maximum contrast.

Found this note, from the good old days from datasheet at Kodak.com

Note: The Aerial Film Speed given in this publication is
rounded to the nearest cube root of 2 step (equivalent to
1⁄3 stop).

Santa says it was made in 2022. $10/roll is not bad. Seems crazy to say that given that four years ago regular c41 was $4/roll. But this is aerial film. Aero film? Well, different film.

Huss · Jun 11, 2022

I think they somehow need to get the word out better. I know it's been only 4 days in, but when Lomo does this it gets funded by now. Santa is just over 1/3 funded.
They mention a possibility of film damaged by light leaks because they use recycled canisters etc, so there is that to consider. Them providing a refund if that happens is cold solace unless you don't care what you shoot. And then it has to be really damaged, not just a little light leaky.

The film is going to be spooled into re-used canisters: This does mean that there can be quality problems. We are aware of this and we are ready to replace films that have severe light leaks or other issues. We did the same for over 10 000 Santa black and white film and have had very few quality issues. Handspooling in reused canisters also means that for every canister we ship, we prolong the life of these canisters, saving them from entering the trash mountain of the world. This means a lot to us, and we hope you see the use in it too.

Due to the thinner, clearer base, we recommend you load the film indoors, and definitely not in direct sunlight as this might lead to light leaks on the first frames.

AgX · Jun 11, 2022

Huss said:
Santa says it was made in 2022. $10/roll is not bad.

You already can get it for $6/roll. Why pay more?

mshchem · Jun 12, 2022

Clear base doesn't have the "orange" mask for straight RA4 prints using an enlarger.

This is a good thing in terms of feeding the develop then scan workflow.

I can afford Portra and Ektar.

foc · Jun 12, 2022

mshchem said:
Clear base doesn't have the "orange" mask for straight RA4 prints using an enlarger.

You can always add an orange mask for optical and scanning if you wish.
Just simply use a length of unexposed, developed, C41 masked film and put it in between the unmasked negative and the light source

lantau · Jun 12, 2022

mshchem said:
Clear base doesn't have the "orange" mask for straight RA4 prints using an enlarger.

This is a good thing in terms of feeding the develop then scan workflow.

I can afford Portra and Ektar.

I've successfully printed Rollei Digibase C41 film on Kodak Endura paper. It is a (Agfa-Gefaert) aerial film, as well, and has this 'clear' base. Which is more greyish, iirc. The Rollei had a own certain look. So having the orange mask may have a point, after all. But I like it. I wouldn't use it as a general purpose film, but that doesn't mean it can't be. I was quite fond of the greens, though.

Arcadia4 · Jun 12, 2022

AgX said:
You already can get it for $6/roll. Why pay more?

I guess that is begging the question, where from?

AgX · Jun 12, 2022

I already said so above in this thread. In Ukraine, at a firm busy with dealing with non-consumer, especially aerial, films since decades and that also got and uses own conversion equipment. One may argue on the rebrandindg policy and veiling the origin of their films, no datasheets, no modern marketing etc. But still more attractive than a newcomer offering film without own machinery. The positive thing about the finnish project is that they say to use film just bought from Kodak.

As toll conversion capacity is limited worldwide, one may ask whether this finnish project is not an existing conversion which is re-re-branded.

And that Elves story makes no sense to me, it is even contradictory. Aside of that such childish talk is utmost annyoing when it is about making over money to a private person, without address just as a "contribution" to him, not even an order.

AgX · Jun 12, 2022

In the past seemingly same finnish entity offered a veiled "shot at ISO 1000" B&W film. Likely stock from Tasma.

halfaman · Jun 12, 2022

AgX said:
In the past seemingly same finnish entity offered a veiled "shot at ISO 1000" B&W film. Likely stock from Tasma.

Santa Rae 1000 is defitevely a Russian film, kamerastore claims that because of this they stopped the business and all income coming from the existing stock goes to support Ukraine. Seems to be also an aerial film produced by Tasma.

AgX · Jun 12, 2022

They, or rather he, can say a lot.

Kamerastore of Finland launches crowdfunding to sell Kodak Aerocolor 125 as SantaColor 100 after its B&W films got discontinued for being Russian

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