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I've been looking for a Pentax 67, but then...

Analogski

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Hi all,

I’ve been searching for my “final” medium format camera for a while now, and my plan was to buy a well-functioning Pentax 67. I want a camera that’s intuitive and reliable for portrait work, but also capable for occasional landscape and architecture photography. My budget is up to €2000.

While browsing, I noticed that Hasselblad 500(C/M) kits are available in the same price range. I always assumed Hasselblad was far beyond my reach, so I never seriously considered it. Now that it is within budget, I’m unsure which direction to go.

A few concerns and questions:

Handling: The Pentax 67 appeals to me for its SLR-style ergonomics. On the other hand, the Hasselblad’s modular design and reputation are very tempting — but is it practical enough for occasional street photography?

Durability: I’d like to avoid frequent repairs. Build quality and long-term reliability matter a lot.

Alternatives: I also considered the Rolleiflex SL66(SE), but many say it’s heavy and not ideal to carry around. I’ve never held one, so I’m relying on your experience.


Given my needs — portraits first, landscapes/architecture second, some street use, and a strong preference for durable gear — which system would you choose, and why?

Thanks in advance f
or your insights.
 
For my hands the Hasselblad ergonomics is the way better than any other medium format SLR.
I would warmly recommend the Acute Matte focusing screen, because the standard one (with the thick lines) is too dark.
The series with the motor drive is a bargain (the functional ones) nowadays. Maybe because they are more bulky and noisy. I have already bought two of them. I can offer you one if you like.
 
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That 105mm f/2.4 lens is so good for portraits and the larger negative with 4x5 aspect ratio will result in less cropping.
 
loccdor said:
That 105mm f/2.4 lens is so good for portraits and the larger negative with 4x5 aspect ratio will result in less cropping.
Click to expand...
The Planar 110 f/2 is awesome for portraits.
If you think that Hasselblad lenses are more expensive, then you know nothing about the 6x7 slide projectors as well as 6x7 slide frames.
 
Re the Pentax 6x7 / 67
I'm a small-handed Irishman and find this camera quite the handful in size and weight, especially with something like the 165mm leaf shutter or non-leaf shutter lens — nudging close to 3.4kg (the 67 pack is 15kg with just one camera!) The two 67s I have are used specifically in the landscape genre with the 45mm f4 (latest-gen) and 75mm f2.8AL 'firecracker' leading the pack. Of Hassy, well, I did not warm enough to the Hasselblads in the time I used a 500C/M + 80mm; I went on to a Horsman 45FA after that courtship. The 6x7 format allows me to crop to 6x6, 6x4.5 or right down to 35mm. This flexible cropping ability might be the deal killer for Hasselblad, imaging quality aside. I use the 6x6 format all the time in my multiformat Zero Image pinhole cameras — it's a petite, intimate look at the landscape through primitive eyes (the camera's, not mine!)

Durability & reliability
I have a funny saying that the SMC Pentax 67 lenses are of a better build and reliability than the cameras they keep company with!

Be cautious if you land an early (1969 to 1976) 6x7 over the final-generation (early 1990s)) 67-badged cameras. So very, very many have gone through multiple professional in-service with attendant abuse over the years. Weak spots are the winding mechanism, specifically winding pawls stripping or breaking; film counter roller and sometimes broken film reel studs (early model cameras). Old, neglected cameras will require the light seals replaced around the prism and internal dovetails around the back cover — a gnarly and grizzly task best left to people with lots and lots of patience and 'elbow grease' — 'tis a loathsome chore! Some cameras come factory-fitted with a multiexposure facility (see pic below) — handy for stacking the scene for different effects.

Retarded shutter speeds in the 1/250 to 1/1000 range also show up in user gripes. Decay of mirror operation occurs regularly, with service of the solenoid being a good fix. The meter coupling chain is a bit delicate and can snap if a specific procedure for dismounting and re-mounting prism and lens is not followed. Repair entails disassembly of the lens mount and fashioning a replacement line out of e.g strong TigerTail beading wire that is very flexible and very, very strong, then re-calibrating the mount for correct alignment (it uses shims). Would recommend you look for a 67-badged camera with mirror lock-up that allows you to effectively isolate judder and shake in landscape (which assumes you will be using it tripod-mounted for the very best results it is able to deliver).

Where MLU is fitted: with film loaded and the camera cocked, the MLU lever should be taped over to prevent it being accidently tripped in the pack, thus draining the battery (see pic).

All 6x7 - 67 bodies have a reset function that also craftily doubles as a battery-less exposure trip for astrophotography (using a cable release and adaptor plate). The reset function will sacrifice one frame of the roll to effect correct reset.

Try and examine a camera of interest in person rather than take what is printed as gospel. Else, ask lots of questions and be very satisfied that you are being given the right answers.
 

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Wow thanks for the great advice!
I'm worry sometimes about the little chain on the 67. I read a lot about the specific way/order to take the lens and prism off. This vulnerability scares me a bit, because of the amount of previous users and sometimes dumbness of people owning these camera's and not knowing this.

But still, my heart is a bit of set on the 67...
 
The Pentax 67 is a great camera and well flushed out system. I started with the "more rounded" Pentax 67 back in the 80's, then moved to the 67II years later. I don't do street photography, but I can't imagine using this camera in that capacity--it's large, heavy, and sounds like a howitzer when the shutter activates.

Many folks don't like handholding a Hasselblad due to its somewhat chunky "block" design. I've never felt that way about it, but I do use my 500C/M on a tripod most of the time. The Zeiss glass will provide wonderfully sharp images, but no better than the P67 lenses, IMO.

I had an SL66 for about a week and sent it back for a refund. For my type of photography, the tilting bellows design intrigue me; basic LF style camera control in a MF camera! However, this camera is quite a bit larger and heavier vs the Hassey and, IMO, definitely requires an upgraded focus screen; the stock screen is much too dull for my old eyes.

Good luck!
 

Hasselblad has enthusiastic followers in all genres of photography for a reason. It is such a flexible system. It is extremely reliable if handled correctly. It has a few quirks that demand attention, but to those giving it that attention, it is a durable and reliable partner that won't disappoint.
 
The Hassy is still repairable while finding someone to work on a Pentax 6X7 is problematic. With modern films and grain I don't think you will find that a 6X7 negative is sharper than the 6X6, if printed square or cropped 6X4.5 if printed rectangle. Saying that unless you print square why not a Mamiya 645? Smaller, lighter, full system. great lens. Late with top speed of 1/1000 and sharp fast prime lens. Downside is like the Pentax harder to get repaired.
 
These are very different cameras.

P67 is made for a eye-level finder which works a bit better for portraits and "action" shots. It has a focal plane shutter so the (longer) lenses are fast with more character wide-open. Lots of lenses available including a shift lens if you're into serious architectural photography. But it is heavy, has a fixed film back and is mechanically complex. A professional service will give you peace of mind for potentially decades, but despite the fact it was a very popular camera, many technicians don't service it.

Hasselblad 500-series is made for a WLF which gives a down-up perspective for portraits. You need to raise the finder and loupe so it's a bit less suitable for spontaneous shots. There is a 90 degree prism but holding the box-shape body at eye level is awkward. It's quite front heavy with all lenses except the 80mm. So with a prism, a tripod is preferred. Lots of lenses available but they are slow-ish. They do have a leaf shutter which is great for flash-synch in a studio. Interchangeable backs is great for changing film types or rapid continous shooting. It's a 1950's design so it has quirky features but nothing egregious. It's not overly complex mechanically and the camera was very popular, so service options are plentiful.

I'd say the two cameras are mostly complementary. Personally I prefer the P67.
 
First, I suggest you read the post "I want a Hasselblad." Second, using an eye-level camera with a prism is a very different experience than a waist-level camera. On one, you are looking directly through the lens at the subject, the other, you are looking down into the viewfinder with the image reversed so you have to get used to how to maneuver the camera to line things up. It is not immediately intiuitive. On the other hand, for portraits, with the waist-level finder you are not hidden from the subject and can make eye contact and engage them easier, often leading to a better portrait. As far as the Pentax 67 goes, it is enormous and heavy. Depending on your strength and stamina, you may not be able to hand-hold it for very long. I would recommend a tripod anyway for any medium-format camera for the sharpest negatives unless you are using strobe.
 
Heavy is relative. Lots of portrait and fashion pros, and even wildlife pros and aerial photographers, have relied on handheld P67's. In my own usage, handholding accounts for only 2% of the instances at most. Other than my Nikon, it's my smallest camera format,
though heavier than my 6x9 Fuji RF's, which are eminently hand-holdable, those even most of the time with those, I prefer tripod usage.

Hassies look less ergonomic than the P67. My brother sold analogous 6x6 Rollei SLR's, and owned a couple SL66 kits himself, but preferred to borrow my P67 for its more intuitive
handling (but otherwise, mostly for tripod use, just like me). But I say its all "relative", weight-wise, because he also often handheld shot his Linhof 4X5 Super Technika via rangefinder focus, atop a Kenro Gyro stabilizer. That did the trick even in bouncy helicopter flights or on constantly vibrating industrial floors, where a tripod would have been useless.
 

The 45 degree finder, not the 90, makes all the difference.
 
I own both systems and they are both exceptional camera systems. If I were strictly shooting the streets and the people I would only be using the Hasselblad for sure. For banging around the woods and such the Pentax is fine. Plus, I prefer the 6X7 format. When it comes to lenses for each, my vote goes toward the Pentax glass. I like the fact that they are less fragile and more trouble free. That is the shutterless Pentax lenses that is. I should say that I have the 90mm and 165mm shutter lenses and have never had a problem with either, but the shutters are just something extra that could go wrong. I think it just boils down to your shooting style more than anything.
 
Arthurwg said:
The 45 degree finder, not the 90, makes all the difference.
Click to expand...
Ergonomics are a bit better vs the 90 degrees because the camera is a bit lower. But it's not at eye-level, and only 1-2cm above the WLF position when using the loupe.
 
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OAPOli said:
Ergonomics are a bit better vs the 90 degrees because the camera is a bit lower. But it's not at eye-level, and only 1-2cm above the WLF position when using the loupe.
Click to expand...

But it's much easier to hand-hold and helps steady the camera, as Wildi suggests.
 
Of the two camera's, is the Hassie or the Pentax much easier to work with handheld? I do most of my photography handheld...
 
As I said before, I find the Hasselblad much more convenient for shooting handheld than the 6x6 SLR. The 6x7 is much bigger, though. But you have to try it for yourself!
 
Thanks. I think I'll rent a Hasselblad for a couple of days to check it out for myself.
 
Also pay attention that you get the one with the Acute Matte focusing screen. This screen is much brighter than the old standard one making it impossible to miss the focus.
 
You really need to try them both, see what suits you. I find focusing the 67 with the left hand grip attached a little tricky, even with the extension knob. On the other hand, the coupled shutter speed and diaphragm controls on the Hasselblad lenses can be annoying, too.
 
Analogski said:
Of the two camera's, is the Hassie or the Pentax much easier to work with handheld? I do most of my photography handheld...
Click to expand...

Perhaps avoid using the 67 hand-held for portraiture, unless you have one of the leaf shutter lenses to get around the arcane 1/30s native sync speed (LS lenses are 90mm or 165mm), and ideally, a strobe. The LS lenses allow sync speeds to 1/500, but the FP sync – that is, the camera's shutter, must be set at 1/4s to sync with the leaf shutter in the LS lens.

Too many people brag that they can hand-hold the 67 at 1/30s and lower, but they are not getting prints made, or not having them made any larger than 6x4 which, at large sizes, will clearly show the folly of hand-held shooting, with blur caused by shutter and mirror inertia. For the very best results the camera can deliver, use it tripod-mounted with mirror lock-up and a cable release.
 

I agree....i couldn't get sharp negatives with the 300..... drove me to buy a view camera.
 
I wanted a 67 for a long time, my local camera shop had one, then i tripped the shutter and really didn't want it
 
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